Will SH Conservatives Whine And Make Lame Excuses When President Obama Is Reelected ?
Che Guevara - Hero
2012/05/03 18:31:17
Will SH Conservatives Whine And Make Lame Excuses When President Obama Is Reelected ?
Top Opinion
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The Elitist Libtard SodaJerk 2012/05/03 21:26:10YES, They WILL Whine And Make Lame Excuses.+16Whining is what they are doing now, Bitching, moaning and having full on Nervous breakdowns is what they'll have after the re-election. First it will be Voter Fraud, Then it will be the Liberal Media, Then They'll try to impeach him. During all of this we will still have to hear from the birthers. and finally they will reach acceptance and realize that Romney was never "Conservative Enough" for them. By then it should be 2015 and wait for the gate to open and all the maniacs barreling out for 2016. And Chances are that who ever the 2016 nominee is will still not be "Conservative Enough" The Leader who is "Conservative Enough" for them took his own life at the end of WWII.





















You said: "All classes are better off today then they were 30 years ago."
My jaw hit the floor when I read this. Are you really being the slightest bit serious? Here's something I would suggest you take a look at: http://money.cnn.com/2011/02/...
An excerpt: "Incomes for 90% of Americans have been stuck in neutral, and it's not just because of the Great Recession. Middle-class incomes have been stagnant for at least a generation, while the wealthiest tier has surged ahead at lighting speed.
In 1988, the income of an average American taxpayer was $33,400, adjusted for inflation. Fast forward 20 years, and not much had changed: The average income was still just $33,000 in 2008, according to IRS data.
Meanwhile, the richest 1% of Americans -- those making $380,000 or more -- have seen their income...
You said: "All classes are better off today then they were 30 years ago."
My jaw hit the floor when I read this. Are you really being the slightest bit serious? Here's something I would suggest you take a look at: http://money.cnn.com/2011/02/...
An excerpt: "Incomes for 90% of Americans have been stuck in neutral, and it's not just because of the Great Recession. Middle-class incomes have been stagnant for at least a generation, while the wealthiest tier has surged ahead at lighting speed.
In 1988, the income of an average American taxpayer was $33,400, adjusted for inflation. Fast forward 20 years, and not much had changed: The average income was still just $33,000 in 2008, according to IRS data.
Meanwhile, the richest 1% of Americans -- those making $380,000 or more -- have seen their incomes grow 33% over the last 20 years, leaving average Americans in the dust."
Just to illustrate the disparity in economic growth and opportunity...
"...those on the lower end should do what those on the upper end did to achieve what they achieved rather than letting their jealousy get the best of them."
And yes, many don't take the opportunities presented them. But that's always been the case and isn't the point. What you need to learn is that there's less opportunity today than there was in the past thanks to the shifting of a larger and larger percentage of Americas wealth to a smaller and smaller group of people who influence legislation in their favor while shipping more and more jobs overseas - all of which leaves less jobs and less wealth available for the middle and lower classes to earn and advance through. This is whats been decimating the middle class. Do you know what kind of countries have only a lower and upper class with no middle? Third world countries.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
"The report found that real household income after federal taxes and including government transfers (payments from Social Security, unemployment insurance, etc.[43][44]) grew by 62%. However, income of households in the top 1 percent of earners grew by 275%, compared to 65% for the next 19 percent, just under 40% for the next 60 percent, 18% for the bottom fifth of households."
That is where I got the 18% improvement for the lowest quintile, from the CBO report. Yes, I understand the rich are getting very rich but that is not what I said. All classes are doing better. Certainly I have seen anecdotal evidence of that as my 80 yr relatives are less well off than my 50 yr old and the 50 yr olds are less well off than my 20-30 yr olds. Bigger houses earlier, more expensive cars, more travel, etc. Surprised that you haven't noticed. And with my relatives, each generation was less educated than the previous, ironically.
Maslow talked about the hierachy of needs, w...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
"The report found that real household income after federal taxes and including government transfers (payments from Social Security, unemployment insurance, etc.[43][44]) grew by 62%. However, income of households in the top 1 percent of earners grew by 275%, compared to 65% for the next 19 percent, just under 40% for the next 60 percent, 18% for the bottom fifth of households."
That is where I got the 18% improvement for the lowest quintile, from the CBO report. Yes, I understand the rich are getting very rich but that is not what I said. All classes are doing better. Certainly I have seen anecdotal evidence of that as my 80 yr relatives are less well off than my 50 yr old and the 50 yr olds are less well off than my 20-30 yr olds. Bigger houses earlier, more expensive cars, more travel, etc. Surprised that you haven't noticed. And with my relatives, each generation was less educated than the previous, ironically.
Maslow talked about the hierachy of needs, with physiological, safety, social/love, self esteem, and self-actualization, in order. The first 2 are related to money but basically everyone in the US has that. Only a cynic would say money is needed for social needs, love, or self-actualization. That is perhaps why it is not a "false choice", as you called it, to choose between working and leisure. We are at historically low rates of participation in the labor force as many are doing what I am doing.
http://data.bls.gov/timeserie...
The greatest possession we have is the 1,440 minutes we all get each day. Because of the diminishing utilty of money (after you have a pair of shoes and a roof over your head do you really need 3,000 pairs of shoes and seven 30,000 sq ft houses?), people are choosing to work less.
And we have historic lows in married couples. Marriage helps greatly in achieving financial security but since we already have this, many are choosing not to be married-no financial need.
Finally, it just irritates the heck out of me that we live in a world in which 2.5 billion live on less than $2/day and only the richest 700 million live on more than $10,000/year. Basically all of the US is in the top 10%. Yet the OWS crowd is whinning about the top 0.1% of the top 10% that they are all in. And they complain about jobs being shipped overseas which has contributed greatly, as Money mag noted, in improving the lives of the bottom 90% globally.
I guess that liberalism is dead.
Let's not lose the point in semantics. My work frequently takes me to India, and yes, even there they have a "middle class". But it's nowhere near significant enough a demographic to drive their economy as our middle class has historically been. It is overwhelmingly poor, with a handful of obscenely wealthy people scattered throughout. You should visit some time if you've never been. Mumbai in particular is made up of a sea of slums, with new highrises and other high-end buildings popping up here and there in the middle of them. A diminishing middle class pushes us further towards this model.
As for your position that the "declining middle class" is essentially a false narrative, you're only citing one factor and drawing a broad conclusion on it when the reality is that there are MANY factors to consider here. For instance, you pointed out yourself that between 1979 and 2007, income "grew by...just under 40% for the next 60 percent" - the "next 60 percent" being, for discussion's sake, the middle class. Sounds great when considered in a vacuum. But then factor in things like the following:
"...the cost of college doubles every nine years. For a baby born today, this means that college costs will be more...
Let's not lose the point in semantics. My work frequently takes me to India, and yes, even there they have a "middle class". But it's nowhere near significant enough a demographic to drive their economy as our middle class has historically been. It is overwhelmingly poor, with a handful of obscenely wealthy people scattered throughout. You should visit some time if you've never been. Mumbai in particular is made up of a sea of slums, with new highrises and other high-end buildings popping up here and there in the middle of them. A diminishing middle class pushes us further towards this model.
As for your position that the "declining middle class" is essentially a false narrative, you're only citing one factor and drawing a broad conclusion on it when the reality is that there are MANY factors to consider here. For instance, you pointed out yourself that between 1979 and 2007, income "grew by...just under 40% for the next 60 percent" - the "next 60 percent" being, for discussion's sake, the middle class. Sounds great when considered in a vacuum. But then factor in things like the following:
"...the cost of college doubles every nine years. For a baby born today, this means that college costs will be more than three times current rates when the child matriculates in college." http://www.finaid.org/savings...
So assuming the "baby" in question is looking to attend college at 18 years old, that means college tuition has increased 300% in 18 years, while it's taken 28 years for their middle class parent's income to grow by less than 40%. And in those same 28 years, the median home prices rose over 400%. Are you starting to see an imbalanced trend here that may just support the reality of a declining middle class?
Finally, yes, U.S. incomes are higher than the vast majority of the world. But as I've been illustrating above, so is our cost of living. I've had full, high quality, restaurant meals in places like India, Thailand, etc. for only pennies. A McDonald's in the U.S. costs a fortune in comparison. So we need to consider apples to apples if we're going to be drawing conclusions about comparative quality of life and who deserves the right to complain.
But don't get too carried away with the idea that life is so much cheaper in other countries. I do understand that some things, food especially, costs less. Wonder how much of that price difference is due to the types of food eaten as locals tend to eat more locally produced food, less processing and the labor costs are lower. For reference, comparing apples to apples, a $4.20 US Big Mac costs $2.46 in Thailand and $1.62 in India. So, that equivalent food cost 39% in India and 59% in Thailand, compared to the US. Per capita GDP in the US is $48,10, in India is $3,700 (8%) and in Thailand is $9,700 (20%), and so it would appear that the difference in income more than covers the higher US food prices. Meanwhile, I suspect that my $22,000 Hyundai or $700 42" Toshiba TV probably costs a little more in those countries. Gas/energy probably costs more. Housing costs seem somewhat lower but relatively close, comparing apples to apples. Most of us would probably not be happy with average Indian housing.
http://www.economist.com/blog...
https://www.cia.gov/library/p...
The price of education is interesting. Many assume that we are in a higher education bubble, produced when...
But don't get too carried away with the idea that life is so much cheaper in other countries. I do understand that some things, food especially, costs less. Wonder how much of that price difference is due to the types of food eaten as locals tend to eat more locally produced food, less processing and the labor costs are lower. For reference, comparing apples to apples, a $4.20 US Big Mac costs $2.46 in Thailand and $1.62 in India. So, that equivalent food cost 39% in India and 59% in Thailand, compared to the US. Per capita GDP in the US is $48,10, in India is $3,700 (8%) and in Thailand is $9,700 (20%), and so it would appear that the difference in income more than covers the higher US food prices. Meanwhile, I suspect that my $22,000 Hyundai or $700 42" Toshiba TV probably costs a little more in those countries. Gas/energy probably costs more. Housing costs seem somewhat lower but relatively close, comparing apples to apples. Most of us would probably not be happy with average Indian housing.
http://www.economist.com/blog...
https://www.cia.gov/library/p...
The price of education is interesting. Many assume that we are in a higher education bubble, produced when money is easily available and more and more are attending. US provides over 25% of the worldwide tertiary educated people. More US citizens attend college, c. 42% then the OECD average of 30%. Not sure that many of those attending college should be attending. If Germany can survive with 27% of the adult population being college grads why can't we. I read today that only 30% of the 2004 US graduates are working in jobs that require a college degree. I think that the answer is not to make money more readily available for college as colleges just seem to raise their tuition to meet available revenues. I would like to see less people in college and more government support for those truly qualified for college. There are millions of well paying jobs that don't require a college degree. There has to be some system of grading colleges on performance and rewarding those that keep costs low. Perhaps with colleges holding some responsibility, with their own chips in the game. If their Women's Studies grad can't get a degree in that field perhaps the college should lose something, like they pay the interest on the student loan until it is paid.
If qualified college students complete college in a timely manner, and actually study while in college, their earning potential should cover the costs. But, yeah, I agree with your that college costs a major concern.
http://www.oecd.org/dataoecd/...
I think that the biggest challenge facing the young is public debt and fulfilling government promises to its citizens. We need c. $300,000 to fund Soc Sec and $500,000 to fund Medicare, per recipient (if I remember the Money mag article). With 77 million baby boomers almost done contributing, that means that $61.6 Trillion should be sitting in a bank somewhere. Or added to our $15.7 Trillion debt.
Electronics are also not an accurate gauge. Despite often being made in Asia, they are much more expensive due to how the tarriffs and such are set up. You can't simply isolate the exceptions to the rule and act as if they establish the norm.
You are exactly right that typical Indian housing would not be well-received by the average American. And not just the housing, but the basic public services, such as tainted water, unreliable power, very poor internet infrastructure, etc. This is exactly my point about why it's nt a model we should be moving towards, yet we are and will continue to until we deal with our declining middle class problem in a substantive way.
And only a fool would be eating Big Macs in Mumbai.
Everyday the same mouthbreathers are here with breaking news that " You will NOT find this story on any of the Old Media outlets!!"