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Why the GOP is winning the Medicare debate

Evil 1 2012/08/18 18:08:19

You can crunch the numbers all day long, but in politics it’s perception that matters.


And though it’s still early, Republicans have a chance to turn the Medicare debate into a political advantage (or a wash, which is as good as a win). The conventional thinking, the media thinking, and actually, the thinking (if we’re to believe Politico) of the entire hand-wringing GOP establishment, was that Paul Ryan’s vice presidential candidacy would make Medicare an issue and surely sink the ticket. Democrats, we were told in story after story, were just giddy over the prospect of facing the Wisconsin congressman.


The debate hasn’t exactly evolved the way we were told it should. Why?


One: It’s possible that voters have already priced-in the hysterical warnings from liberals about the GOP’s intent to destroy all entitlements. They’ve heard it all a million times, yet the programs’ price tag continue to grow exponentially, and often under Republican rule. Add to that increasing numbers of Americans who believe that Medicare is unsustainable and the issue has probably lost some potency for Democrats.


Two: It’s not what you fear; it’s what you fear more. Seniors might be more anxious about Republicans expanding Medicare to include premium support , but they are more nervous about what Obamacare means to their future.


Three: When the Affordable Health Care Act passed, Obama handed Republicans a political gift.


Obamacare sucks over $700 billion from Medicare. Not that it means much, because surely few people really believe any Affordable Health Care Act cost estimates. But the president made a political calculation to keep the price tag of Obamacare under a trillion dollars to make it an easier sell to American people.


So now, if Democrats argue that the $700 billion is just a cut in future growth (the truth), they are undermining the age-old left-wing definition of government “cuts”– in fact, they are undermining their argument about how Ryan’s budget “slashes” spending (it doesn’t).


If Obama’s campaign argues that Ryan’s budget also cuts $700 billion (the truth), they offer Republicans another opening: Because not only did Obama decide to cut $700 billion from Medicare, unlike Ryan, he did so to fund a new entitlement program that, according to nearly every poll conducted since its passage, Americans really dislike – especially seniors.


So, all of a sudden Romney-Ryan can focus on Obama’s Medicare cuts, which Obama must defend, which steers the entire conversation back to Obamacare.


Romney could also mention that Obama’s Medicare cuts draw heavily from the Medicare Advantage program, which is a privately-administered health care plan that is, in spirit, similar to the premium-support programs that seniors are supposed to fear. Both Medicare Advantage enrollees and traditional Medicare enrollees oppose cutting the program under any circumstance in large numbers.

Read More: http://www.humanevents.com/2012/08/17/can-the-gop-...

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  • wtw 2012/08/18 18:18:32
    wtw
    +3
    Obama-care is a lie and a scam--Obama said it would not add to the deficit and that is a lie. Obama said you could keep your doctor and that turns out to be a lie because most people will be forced out by their companies to Obama-care which will not allow you to use certain doctors. Obama care has a panel of 14 people to oversee and control how and when medicare will or will not pay for certain points of care. If you are over 70 and could have plenty years of life but Obama care reps deem a certain operation as too costly guess what you get a pain pill and no operation just because mother government says no! Obama and the lies of the left is going off of Ryan's original plan which he revisided--Obama is using old figures as always and lies--Obama has proven not to be trusted because of his many lies and broken promises!

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Opinions

  • Don Leuty 2012/08/19 04:03:42
    Don Leuty
    We'll have a better idea Nov 7.
  • ppk007@cfl.rr.com 2012/08/19 00:24:20
    ppk007@cfl.rr.com
    +1
    LOL - Social Security - Started under a Democratic POTUS (FDR) ..... Medicare - Started under a Democratic POTUS (LBJ) - but some how the GOP believes that they can better protect a social plans that they never really supported from jump street... 50 years from now - the GOP will be telling Americans to trust that their candidate will better protect their Obama Care health plan...you just got to love it !!
  • mrk5panzer 2012/08/18 19:32:59
    mrk5panzer
    +2
    Thats because Obamacare gives you nothing but a bill. Someone has to pay for it and you don't start by robbing Medicare.
  • ppk007@... mrk5panzer 2012/08/19 12:53:55
    ppk007@cfl.rr.com
    and how pray tell are social security and medicare funded - you get a bill for them too.
  • mrk5panzer ppk007@... 2012/08/19 16:50:39
    mrk5panzer
    +1
    True! but we, thats us have been putting into both SSN and MEDICARE for a very long time. That money wasn't meant to be spent on all these other Gov. scam's. thats why their failing. Uncle Sam just couldn't keep his hands off something that was working in the first place.
  • ppk007@... mrk5panzer 2012/08/19 17:13:06
    ppk007@cfl.rr.com
    I notice that you said Uncle Sam, and not any particular political party... both parties are gulity
  • Evil 1 ppk007@... 2012/08/19 17:21:26
    Evil 1
    Yes both parties are guilty. But the precedent was set by Lyndon Johnson in 1968 and he was a Democrat. Once the door was opened all the others followed suit. So had the initial looting not occurred things would be much different.
  • mrk5panzer ppk007@... 2012/08/19 17:22:43
    mrk5panzer
    +1
    Not even close, the left want a lot more control over your life than the right does.
  • ppk007@... mrk5panzer 2012/08/19 18:00:06
    ppk007@cfl.rr.com
    depends on what aspect of one life is being discussed...
  • Evil 1 mrk5panzer 2012/08/19 17:19:24
    Evil 1
    +1
    And the liberal/progressives should look back at history and see who the first President to 'borrow' (loot would be the more appropriate word) from Social Security and setting the precedent. It was a during the Lyndon Johnson administration, a Democrat.
  • ppk007@... Evil 1 2012/08/19 18:01:06
    ppk007@cfl.rr.com
    if my neighbor robs the bank, does that justify me robbing the bank?
  • Evil 1 ppk007@... 2012/08/19 20:31:52
    Evil 1
    Not at all. But if Johnson hadn't opened the door by looting in the first place we'll never know if it would have ever occurred. And if you're going to point fingers and place blame shouldn't that blame be placed on the individual that created the problem in the first place?
  • ppk007@... Evil 1 2012/08/19 21:43:36
    ppk007@cfl.rr.com
    No President by himself can loot Social Security - it takes an Act of Congress
  • Evil 1 ppk007@... 2012/08/20 10:44:24
    Evil 1
    And Lyndon Johnson was the first President to propose it and get Congress to go along with him. And it was a Democrat controlled House and Congress. So the problem was initially created by the Democrats.
  • ppk007@... Evil 1 2012/08/20 15:29:10
    ppk007@cfl.rr.com
    I assume you are talking about the Social Security Act of 1965 - which is the act the created Medicare - are you saying that Medicare is a bad thing - LOL - I am SURE you would NEVER get the current GOP to officially say that... one again it was a Democrat that start the Social Security program (FDR) and it was also a Democrat that started the Medicare program (LBJ) - but somehow now, the GOP are selling themselves as the political party best to protect those programs, - social programs that they never initially endorsed from the get go.
  • Evil 1 ppk007@... 2012/08/20 15:53:23
    Evil 1
    I said Social Security which was established by FDR in 1935. No where did I mention Medicare which was created in under Title 18 of the Social Security Act. So to loot Medicare Johnson had to loot Social Security.

    I also never said Medicare is a bad thing as I never mentioned Medicare, you did. Nor did I say that Social Security is a bad thing. I said that is Johnson would never had looted Social Security in the first place and set the precedent possibly it may have never occurred. Johnson set the precedent for looting the system and he was a Democrat. So the problem was created by the Democrats.

    And yes the Republicans are selling themselves as the best to 'manage' and revamp those programs. And considering the job virtually every Democrat administration has done destroying them they should be given the chance.

    Here is another example of a liberal Democrat President setting bad precedent. Bill Clinton worked to start changing our entitlement programs and had good ideas. His non-partisan support passed the Welfare Reform Act of 1996. An act that was supported by and praised by both parties. Now Obama, a Democrat, on July 12, 2012 announced that he and his administration had rewritten the law and gutted the federal work requirements that were the foundation of the 1996 re...
    I said Social Security which was established by FDR in 1935. No where did I mention Medicare which was created in under Title 18 of the Social Security Act. So to loot Medicare Johnson had to loot Social Security.

    I also never said Medicare is a bad thing as I never mentioned Medicare, you did. Nor did I say that Social Security is a bad thing. I said that is Johnson would never had looted Social Security in the first place and set the precedent possibly it may have never occurred. Johnson set the precedent for looting the system and he was a Democrat. So the problem was created by the Democrats.

    And yes the Republicans are selling themselves as the best to 'manage' and revamp those programs. And considering the job virtually every Democrat administration has done destroying them they should be given the chance.

    Here is another example of a liberal Democrat President setting bad precedent. Bill Clinton worked to start changing our entitlement programs and had good ideas. His non-partisan support passed the Welfare Reform Act of 1996. An act that was supported by and praised by both parties. Now Obama, a Democrat, on July 12, 2012 announced that he and his administration had rewritten the law and gutted the federal work requirements that were the foundation of the 1996 reform law. The foundation that was praised and supported by both parties. Once again a liberal Democrat (just like Johnson) has set a precedent that is detrimental to the US rather than beneficial.
    (more)
  • ppk007@... Evil 1 2012/08/20 16:13:23
    ppk007@cfl.rr.com
    Let's do this - we both admit that the POTUS can not, as you put it "loot" Social Security without Congress' approval - so the question to you is this - What Congressional Act / Law are you referring to when you state that LBJ looted Social Security?
  • Evil 1 ppk007@... 2012/08/20 16:41:58
    Evil 1
    Why not do a litte research and see who was the first President to make it possible to take funds from Social Security (or loot it) to be utilized elsewhere. It was Johnson. He got a Democratically controlled House and Senate to move Social Security monies from the 'Independent Trust Fund' into the General Fund so that he and Congress could spend the money or as I view it loot the fund. That is why the General Fund owes Social Security. The problem is Johnson and every President since this was allowed has looted Social Security on the premise of 'borrowing' the money. But they have never paid it back. If they would have never tapped the funds or paid them back as they promised Social Security would not be in the dire straights that it is today.

    I also notice that you didn't make any statement regarding Obama's gutting of Clinton's 1996 Welfare Reform Act. I'm curious as to your opinon about it. Do you feel he was justified in doing so? Do you think his gutting of the federal work requirement implemented by the Clinton administration will have a detrimental effect on the Welfare system? What do you think Obama's motive was to gut a provision that had bi-partisan support when it was implemented? Just curious.
  • ppk007@... Evil 1 2012/08/20 17:49:36 (edited)
    ppk007@cfl.rr.com
    I have (researched) - I just wanted to see if you could actually name any legislation, that supports your position that LBJ "looted" Social Security - you have in past posts, listed particular references (ie Title 18 of the Social Security Act......Welfare Reform Act of 1996).. surely you can supply the actually legislation that supports your position that LBJ "looted" Social Security.

    In as far as my "opinion" on the Obama / Clinton matter - might I suggest that you open a forum on that particular topic and I may enlighten you on my opinion on that subject within that forum.
  • Evil 1 ppk007@... 2012/08/20 21:07:31
    Evil 1
    It is my opinion that he looted it based on his moving the funds into the general fund so he could get at it. If you want the article look it up. If you research it you will see that Johnson did it and that is fact enough.

    And I see you avoid answering the matter on Obama gutting the welfare reform act. I expected as much.
  • ppk007@... Evil 1 2012/08/21 00:33:17
    ppk007@cfl.rr.com
    Tell you what - I will get off topic with you, and address with you my position regarding the Obama / Clinton matter, IF you can provide the legislation whereas you insist that LBJ "looted" Social Security.
  • Evil 1 ppk007@... 2012/08/21 00:36:20
    Evil 1
    Tell you what, I could care less about your opinion as you have alredy proven you aren'y looking to discuss or debate. You just want to play childish liberal games. So I will leave you to play with yourself.
  • ppk007@... Evil 1 2012/08/21 00:57:44
    ppk007@cfl.rr.com
    I apologize - but when you stated - "I'm curious as to your opinon about it." - in an earlier post, I just thought that you were interested in my opinion.

    Actually, I was looking to discuss and / or debate - but you apparently can NOT provide the particular legislation, in support of your allegation that LBJ "looted" Social Security.

    Later
  • Rebel Yell 2012/08/18 18:32:16
    Rebel Yell
    +1
    What does Romney and Lyin' Ryan have to offer ? Ryan's Medicare plan does absolutely nothing to curb Medicare spending for a full decade. Meanwhile his draconian tax cuts will add another 6 trillion in that same time period. His plan doesn't balance the budget until 2030... maybe. So what does he have to offer in the here and now? Nothing but more rhetoric.

    Ryan's 'Path to Prosperity' gives massive tax breaks to the wealthy but forces anyone on Medicaid and other social services to absorb a whopping 60 % of his spending cuts.

    The more voters discover about Ken Doll # 1 and Ken Doll # 2 , the more they will withdraw in horror.
  • Evil 1 Rebel Yell 2012/08/18 18:44:44
    Evil 1
    +1
    Provide some viable sources to back up your claims for they are nothing but personal opinion and hold no factual basis.
  • Rebel Yell Evil 1 2012/08/18 19:53:10
    Rebel Yell
    Mareen Dowd, NY Times

    Katrina vanden Heuvel, Washington Post

    Michelle Goldberg, The Daily Beast
  • Evil 1 Rebel Yell 2012/08/18 21:01:54
    Evil 1
    Provide the links and the articles.
  • ppk007@... Evil 1 2012/08/20 17:56:47
    ppk007@cfl.rr.com
    viable sources are always important - please see my above post to you, regarding the particular legislation you are referring to regarding your position that LBJ "looted" Social Security.
  • Evil 1 ppk007@... 2012/08/20 21:08:53
    Evil 1
    And being able to research a topic is also important. Unless of course you don't want to see the truth and facts and are just trying to avoid them. But I suspect that is normal for many including yourself.
  • ppk007@... Evil 1 2012/08/21 00:31:10
    ppk007@cfl.rr.com
    Interesting how you insist on "links and articles" and "viable sources" from others, but are very lacking providing them (sources) to others.
  • Evil 1 ppk007@... 2012/08/21 00:40:24
    Evil 1
    Just more childish liberal games on your part in a feeble attempt to avoid the truth and facts. I told you to research it yourself. But typical of a liberal you want someone else to do the work for you. That is the norm for liberals and you are proving it beyond a doubt. Now rather than lower myself to your ridiculous, childish level I will (as I told you previously) leave you to play with yourself, which you are more than likely used to. Goodbye.
  • ppk007@... Evil 1 2012/08/21 01:00:58
    ppk007@cfl.rr.com
    I again apologize - I initially thought you wished to discuss and debate the issues at hand. In a debate, both sides usually bring their facts to the table. You apparently can NOT or will NOT provide the particular piece of legislation that supports your allegation that LBJ "looted" Social Security.

    Later.
  • mrk5panzer Rebel Yell 2012/08/19 16:52:12
    mrk5panzer
    It replaces the 700 billion that Obama robbed from it back into the porgram. That works!
  • wtw 2012/08/18 18:18:32
    wtw
    +3
    Obama-care is a lie and a scam--Obama said it would not add to the deficit and that is a lie. Obama said you could keep your doctor and that turns out to be a lie because most people will be forced out by their companies to Obama-care which will not allow you to use certain doctors. Obama care has a panel of 14 people to oversee and control how and when medicare will or will not pay for certain points of care. If you are over 70 and could have plenty years of life but Obama care reps deem a certain operation as too costly guess what you get a pain pill and no operation just because mother government says no! Obama and the lies of the left is going off of Ryan's original plan which he revisided--Obama is using old figures as always and lies--Obama has proven not to be trusted because of his many lies and broken promises!
  • ☆astac☆~PWCM 2012/08/18 18:09:21
    ☆astac☆~PWCM
    +3
    Because team obama has lied about it, and now his lies are all falling apart

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