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What Was The Root Cause of The 2008 Financial Crisis?

Conservative in California 2010/12/15 18:05:05
Related Topics: Government, Free Market, Mac
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Not what exaccerbated the collapse, but what was the root cause?
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  • lauren dull 2010/12/15 20:56:55
    Government regulation--C.R.A., Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac, Government Welfare
    lauren dull
    +7
    They destroyed the American dream by making sure everyone obtained it . What happened to the good old day's when you had to have 20% down to buy a home?

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  • mzemma 2010/12/16 06:13:22
    Other...
    mzemma
    +1
    Will I think what started it was contractors build these huge houses, people were buying and flipping them causing even higher rising prices.... and I kept thinking.. who can afford to buy these houses.. salaries have not kept up with the cost of living and housing prices.. so who can afford to buy them... well evidently people could not afford them so some loan places developed some creative loans and financing techniques.. further tinged with a little trickery..and fooling and talking people into refinancing, and/or thinking they afford new homes. So the guys on Wall Street knew it was coming.. so.. let's bundle up bad loans and split them up so people get a little of each.. and let's sell insurance in case they fail. Well, too many failed. and they knew they would.. because the balloon was due to blossom in a couple of years and after a couple of years suddenly people couldn't afford the payment with the new higher payment amount. So, the guys in Washington and Wall Street wanted to get the most they could and not be left holding the bag.. and it worked for them. And then the bail out. "They," the big shots had nothing to lose! I'm still not convinced the whole world would have come down...but again, "they" took advantage and left smiling all the way to their Swiss b...
    Will I think what started it was contractors build these huge houses, people were buying and flipping them causing even higher rising prices.... and I kept thinking.. who can afford to buy these houses.. salaries have not kept up with the cost of living and housing prices.. so who can afford to buy them... well evidently people could not afford them so some loan places developed some creative loans and financing techniques.. further tinged with a little trickery..and fooling and talking people into refinancing, and/or thinking they afford new homes. So the guys on Wall Street knew it was coming.. so.. let's bundle up bad loans and split them up so people get a little of each.. and let's sell insurance in case they fail. Well, too many failed. and they knew they would.. because the balloon was due to blossom in a couple of years and after a couple of years suddenly people couldn't afford the payment with the new higher payment amount. So, the guys in Washington and Wall Street wanted to get the most they could and not be left holding the bag.. and it worked for them. And then the bail out. "They," the big shots had nothing to lose! I'm still not convinced the whole world would have come down...but again, "they" took advantage and left smiling all the way to their Swiss bank ac counts (I'm assuming). In my view, most disasters are planned by this country one way or another. It's a wonder Halliburton wasn't around somewhere.. they using are... either creating the mess or cleaning up after it, or both (it's genius)... either way.. they clean up in more ways than one. My point! the big shots see that they come out ahead always and.. and at our
    expense. It's just the way it goes... rich are allowed to beat up on the getting-poorer middle class. It's a shame our government doesn't look out for us... but guess they prefer "follow the money" . If you had a choice wouldn't you? That's why poor people vote Republican they falsely dream being rich will rub off onto them....
    (more)
  • wtw 2010/12/16 05:02:37
    Government regulation--C.R.A., Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac, Government Welfare
    wtw
    +1
    The government was the cause and they failed to even include fannie and freddie on the needed finacial reform--they are betting on the fact that americans are stupid and will keeo voting them into power and they are correct!
  • James 2010/12/16 04:45:27
    Other...
    James
    +1
    Greed and stupidity. Take a look at EVERY single time the U.S. went through some sort of recession, depression, or panic and the root cause was almost always easy access to credit and a spendthrift society.
  • Nancy~PWCM~JLA~POTL 2010/12/16 04:27:31 (edited)
    Other...
    Nancy~PWCM~JLA~POTL
    +1
    It has been an accumulation of all the things that I read and hear I suppose. The housing market and loss of jobs to overseas companies come to mind first of all. The cost of living continues to rise and foolish spending of our hard earned tax dollars. Government corruption is like a three ring circus act and I am not naming names of the three...:-) People simply cannot keep up. The biggest problem that has added insult to injury has been the banking/lending industry and the insurance companies.

    Now I do not claim to understand the entire convoluted mechanics and who to actually point the finger of blame toward first,....which came first the chicken or the egg?. I just know that I fall into the catagory of those that are watching the American Dream slip away and there is not much to do about it.

    It is sad to work an entire life to secure a comfortable (not lavish) retirement plan and see it disappearing before your very eyes. I think if people could go back in time they would do things a tad differently.
  • jakep51 2010/12/16 04:16:26 (edited)
    Government regulation--C.R.A., Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac, Government Welfare
    jakep51
    While I agree that the liberal democrats perpetrated a myth that everyone and anyone should have a home, and in doing so they essentially held guns to the heads of Fannie and Freddie, and who knows who else, the underlying root cause was a citizenry fueled by greed over reaching their capability to handle the debt load they burdened themselves with. Democrats used the same old tactic which con men use to sucker you into a situation which will rarely ever have a good outcome for you. But for the democrats, they did not care one way or another whether any individual would be able to maintain the loan on a house, the responsibility for the democratic politician quite literally ended at the front door. "I got you into the house, it's up to you to do what is necessary to remain there" . Knowing full well the majority would never be able to keep up on the mortgage payments. It didn't matter though because the "tenant" was now supposed to be so overjoyed that the democrat politicians got them into a home of their own, they now have a lifetime voter firmly in their pockets.
  • A Found... jakep51 2010/12/16 07:31:04 (edited)
    A Founding Father
    +1
    Jesus, I was almost certain that both houses of Congress and the Oval Office were controlled by Republicans for 20 of the 28 years between 1980 (when the banks were "deregulated" and Wall Street took over control of the Treasury, SEC, and FDA,) and 2008 (when the ponzi schemes of worthless securities and fradulent "derivitives" collapsed.). You didn't even mention the word Republican. I'm going to refresh my recollections right now.
  • jakep51 A Found... 2010/12/16 14:08:29
    jakep51
    +2
    Oh my, you are absolutely right! I was remiss in that I did fail to mention Republicans at all. So here you go;
    Here is a time line from as far back as 2001 when Republicans were trying to get tighter controls pushed in regards to Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. Interesting how Barney Frank couldn't (wouldn't) see a problem


    And Here are the Republicans again in 2004 trying again,


    So now that I have mentioned Republicans, I hope that satisfies you.
  • A Found... jakep51 2010/12/16 22:58:57 (edited)
    A Founding Father
    Aside from their words, why didn't they complete the project? Republicans had control of all the agencies of Government (those left with powers and staff), the White House, the Justice Department, the SEC, and, most of all, unlimited access to public opinion through the media dogs sitting there day after day in anticipation of something to report. Barney Frank was just a committee member, later a chairman, and not very well thought of by the media ... I understand your references, but they don't explain why nothing happened. Did the Party of No actually wish "no" to happen, even back then? I think so.
  • jakep51 A Found... 2010/12/17 02:38:55
    jakep51
    Nothing happened because those on the left who opposed changing the way GSE's were managed by the government blocked this from happening at every turn. Simply because you are a majority does not mean that you have the ability to push through anything you desire. Democrats have a majority in congress at the moment but they aren't having much fun with their bloated budget plan right now are they? And as for Barney Frank, he is and was Chairman of the House Financial 'Services Committee, and he couldn't see the danger looming? Chris Dodd Chairman of the house Banking Committee didn't see anything wrong either? Hell if I used their strategies to balance my check book I'd be broke in no time, and my creditors would be sol wouldn't they. But then I could simply turn around and say, "Hey I don't see a problem." Then later claim to have had nothing to do with the situation. Hey but you keep on looking and voting the other way and hope that fixes things. A good definition of stupidity is doing the same thing over and over again in exactly the same way expecting to get different results, much like liberal / democratic voters do.
  • A Found... jakep51 2010/12/17 05:37:37 (edited)
    A Founding Father
    I understand that it was "conservative" voters that reelected to control of the House of Representatives just last month, the same Party of No that controlled the Congress
    for the past three decades. Just this week the incoming chairman to replace Barney Frank advise that he believes it is Government's role to support the banking system and not try to control it, even it's excesses. Now, that is exactly what allowed the economic melt down to happen, and it is obviously intended to happen again. Indeed, Dr. Einstein was correct in his description of a sure sign of insanity, duing the same things over and over, expecting different results.

    I have to laugh at your claim that the Bush Administration, with control of all three branches of Government, could not assert influence enough to control a committee chairman of the opposite party who was intent on helping the Wall Street "Reagan Banks", known to be the underpinning sponsors of the "conservative agenda" ... somehow that seems just too confusing to be believable. Frank and Dodd were not the "root cause" of the financial crisis. The greed of Wall Street's "Reagan BAnks" and Barons, and the lacking oversight by all the Bush Administration were the cause of the crisis. If the right-wing zealots and ideologues would just admit ...
    I understand that it was "conservative" voters that reelected to control of the House of Representatives just last month, the same Party of No that controlled the Congress
    for the past three decades. Just this week the incoming chairman to replace Barney Frank advise that he believes it is Government's role to support the banking system and not try to control it, even it's excesses. Now, that is exactly what allowed the economic melt down to happen, and it is obviously intended to happen again. Indeed, Dr. Einstein was correct in his description of a sure sign of insanity, duing the same things over and over, expecting different results.

    I have to laugh at your claim that the Bush Administration, with control of all three branches of Government, could not assert influence enough to control a committee chairman of the opposite party who was intent on helping the Wall Street "Reagan Banks", known to be the underpinning sponsors of the "conservative agenda" ... somehow that seems just too confusing to be believable. Frank and Dodd were not the "root cause" of the financial crisis. The greed of Wall Street's "Reagan BAnks" and Barons, and the lacking oversight by all the Bush Administration were the cause of the crisis. If the right-wing zealots and ideologues would just admit to that and say "Sorry", it would be possible to prevent a repetition and to begin closing the gaps in oversight. But, as long as the denial continues, Wall Street will continue to control the Governmnet, and to loot the American citizens and all the world. Greed and persons without moral compass have no bounds, no limits, and will continue their
    crimes until a greater power inhibits their actions.
    (more)
  • jakep51 A Found... 2010/12/17 16:39:05
    jakep51
    First of all, I never said Frank and Dodd were the root cause. I said this,

    "While I agree that the liberal democrats perpetrated a myth that everyone and anyone should have a home, and in doing so they essentially held guns to the heads of Fannie and Freddie, and who knows who else, the underlying root cause was a citizenry fueled by greed over reaching their capability to handle the debt load they burdened themselves with."

    While you may choose to interpret that any way you see fit, and there isn't a thing I can do about that, I can (and will) take my own advice on stupidity. Continuing to engage a conversation with someone as obviously blinded by Liberal Democratic loyalties as you are and expecting to enlighten you is stupid of me.
  • A Found... jakep51 2010/12/17 19:57:00 (edited)
    A Founding Father
    You can be either a part of the problem or a part of the solution. Remaining in a state of denial and attempting to persuade others to ignore the ravages of Wall Street's "Reagan Banks" and the destruction of Government's oversight identifies you as part of the problem. Indeed, Dr. Einstein had insight into human behavior.
  • bigeasy628 2010/12/16 04:00:22
    Government regulation--C.R.A., Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac, Government Welfare
    bigeasy628
    +2
    People bought houses they couldnt afford.
  • Bronx at Night 2010/12/16 03:53:24
    Other...
    Bronx at Night
    This guy:

    guy gilbert gottfried


    I have proof.
  • Joves the Instigator 2010/12/16 03:24:35
    Other...
    Joves the Instigator
    +1
    Well it was the same good organization that has been giving us great economies since 1914, the Federal Reserve. It was Greenspan who got the finacials unregulated and pushed for the money people to have a free reign. This made for an unstable market because while it allowed for looser lending it also made fo unsound lending priciples. It also spawned the scam pratice of serivatives which were and still are so complex that even seasoned money people dont know how they work. These derivatives allowed for speculation on loans and, spread the damage further when the housing bubble burst. This was the finacial end of it.
    Then there is the jobs end of it. This was directly caused by NAFTA. WHen NAFTA was passed many of us knew that for the first 4 to 7 years there would be a boon in jobs and profits. This was due to the tooling that the new manufacturing plants would require. But not only the tooling but the periphials for the plants. Most of Clintons good but false economy was due to the initial start of NAFTA and the Dotcom bubbles. Once again those bubbles burst but, not so much a bust as deflated. The new manufacturing plants in Mexico took the US jobs and, the Dotcom stocks far over valued died. This is why during Bush the economy started on its steady decline and, along with...

    Well it was the same good organization that has been giving us great economies since 1914, the Federal Reserve. It was Greenspan who got the finacials unregulated and pushed for the money people to have a free reign. This made for an unstable market because while it allowed for looser lending it also made fo unsound lending priciples. It also spawned the scam pratice of serivatives which were and still are so complex that even seasoned money people dont know how they work. These derivatives allowed for speculation on loans and, spread the damage further when the housing bubble burst. This was the finacial end of it.
    Then there is the jobs end of it. This was directly caused by NAFTA. WHen NAFTA was passed many of us knew that for the first 4 to 7 years there would be a boon in jobs and profits. This was due to the tooling that the new manufacturing plants would require. But not only the tooling but the periphials for the plants. Most of Clintons good but false economy was due to the initial start of NAFTA and the Dotcom bubbles. Once again those bubbles burst but, not so much a bust as deflated. The new manufacturing plants in Mexico took the US jobs and, the Dotcom stocks far over valued died. This is why during Bush the economy started on its steady decline and, along with the over borrowing since they had suckered in people to loans they should have never qualified for the rocket ride to economic hell started.
    So now we are where we are. And the worst thing is they are planning on two more of those Free Trade Agreements. One the South Korean agreement and it is the very same as NAFTA. As it stands SK exports more to the US than the US does to them. While at first that will change, it will change for the exact same reasons as NAFTA did then it will die off and, the Trade Deficit will double in SKs favor. Also there is an intial projected job loss of 150K in the first year of the signing, only to rise as the treaty takes full hold. Then there is the South American FTA which once again will be good but only for a short period. Then bye bye to more jobs and a bloated Trade Deficit. These two treaties must be blocked before they even get started.
    Im for Free Trade so long as it is Fair Trade and level for all parties. But our negotiators always seem to give away our rights in these treaties and, advantage the foreign countries. It is time this stopped.
    (more)
  • Aurora 2010/12/16 03:16:33
    Government regulation--C.R.A., Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac, Government Welfare
    Aurora
    +1
    barney frank, chris dodd, jimmy carter, bill clinton.
  • jackolantyrn356 2010/12/16 02:18:10
    Government regulation--C.R.A., Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac, Government Welfare
    jackolantyrn356
    +2
    Not Fand F, but two little Excutive orders. One by Jimmy Caryter which forced the Banks to give mortgages to the poor who could not keep up with the mortgage. Then the Addition of Bill Clinton's addition to the Jimmy Carter in whch the Banks were forced to restore Mortgages that the poor fell out of and could not pay. Then he sent peoppe to the Hispanic community to bring the Illegals into buying homes they would never keep up on the mortgage. Ctreatuing the most toxic paper in the Unoiverse. The Banks took this and began selling the paper stuffd with this toxic Illegal alien Toxic Paper. Soon therre was nothing to sell but TOXIC PAPER. andd of course Of course it was illegal to not restore the Illegals toxic Mortgages.


    Eventually it blew up ... Thank you Mr Jimmy and Mr. Bill May the Lord Cirse yoiu very much
  • jakep51 jackola... 2010/12/16 14:16:14 (edited)
    jakep51
    +1
    I agree that F and F were not the root cause, they were however the implement used by Jimmy and Billy and Maxine and Barney and Friends to effect their ponzi scheme though,
  • Icarus 2010/12/16 01:37:00
    Other...
    Icarus
    +1
    The price of oil.
  • 2468 2010/12/16 01:30:17
    Other...
    2468
    +2
    * Privatizing corporate profits and socializing their losses.

    * Deregulation of the derivatives market.

    * AIG could not cover the policies it profited from and was too big to fail.

    * Corporate power in the political arena has been increasing in the last 20 years.
    (they got what they wanted like children trick or treating and the got a stomach ache after eating all the candy) We need a balance between the corporations and the people.

    * Dishonest loans and loans at greater than 100% of equity. This is a very dangerous situation IF prices drop. Then people are underwater and walk away. I know of some people that are not paying their mortgage and the bank is not foreclosing as this will mess up their books and margin requirements.

    * People living on their credit cards beyond their means.

    * The FED.

    * Greed and opportunist people in a place to harm everyone.

    * Two wars at great expense.

    * Off-shoring labor.

    * Our trade imbalances.

    * Lobbyists corrupting the system.

    * Lazy and uniformed people that aren't paying attention and not voting.
  • Radical 1s1am1st 2010/12/16 01:08:21
    Other...
    Radical 1s1am1st
    +2
    The credit market dried up for the small businesses.
  • The Gipper~PWCM~JLA 2010/12/16 00:33:28
    Government regulation--C.R.A., Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac, Government Welfare
    The Gipper~PWCM~JLA
    +3
    barney frank and the boys at fannie and freddie! The amazing thing is, the idiots in Mass. re-elected him!
  • A Found... The Gip... 2010/12/16 07:40:15
    A Founding Father
    +1
    Even more amazing, these same idiots re-elected the Party of No to control of the U.S. House of Rreps, and again turned the agencies of Governmnet over to Wall Street's "Reagan Banks" and Barons. Want to see a rereun of the looting and pillage, just stay tuned.
  • The Gip... A Found... 2010/12/16 16:04:52
    The Gipper~PWCM~JLA
    You lost me... But from what I can gather, I assume you don't like the fact that the dems are no longer in "control" of the house. The problem isn't the lack of regulations or high enough tax rates. The problem is the runaway spending and waste! We're just going to have to grow up and take responsibility for our own actions. If we elect them then let them fleece us, we have no one to blame but ourselves. We are after all, for the most part, adults!
  • A Found... The Gip... 2010/12/16 23:12:53 (edited)
    A Founding Father
    I am very pleased that the Reps have control of the HOuse of Representatives. Having some responsibility is quite a different circumstance than just sitting in a seat and saying "No, we only are concerned with making Obama a one-term President". Now, the ball is in their court and all the world is watching for what they will do. Today, the bill that came up contains a reported 6,000 "earmarks", many from the Republican reps. Indeed, the spending frenzy is the problem, and must be controlled. But, it didn't commence in January 2009 with the entry of Barack Obama, but has been going on for decades. The National debt needs to be paid down or eliminated, which won't happen without increased tax revenues. Where do you think the money would come from to restore our fiscal health if not from tax revenues? Do you think China will just tear up those IOUs we have sold them for the past decade?

    If "we" grow up and take responsibility for our actions, it must commence with the admission that the "conservative agenda" and "Reganomics" are the root causes of our problems and Wall Street having control of our Government, and "the Government" is not "the problem", which is the ideological door by which these looter gained control and came to be worshiped by those who "believe" the failed policies. If we can't admit our mistakes, we are destined to repeat them, as evidenced by re-electing these same controlling forces just a few weeks ago.
  • The Gip... A Found... 2010/12/17 00:03:44
    The Gipper~PWCM~JLA
    Well I'm pretty sure the dem controlled congress, since 2006, http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/1... had themselves quite the spending spree. Don't have the figures, and I'm not about to waste my time digging them up to argue in vain with you!

    The ones who govern are the problem. The more they try to legislate "fairness" and "equality" into everyones' lives but theirs', the more time and money they throw down the crapper! Life is unfair, get used to it!

    I was mad as hell when Bush and the dem controlled congress started the bail outs! They never should have done it in my opinion. But, they did do it. Then along comes mr. "hope and change" and spends three times more than Bush did! Wow, he sure knows how to shake things up in DC, doesn't he?.

    You are so lost on the Reaganomics point I'm not even going to bother with it.

    The dems failed policies (fannie and freddie etc) led directly to this economic melt down. Try to watch the video links below to the end, and maybe you'll learn something. Please try to find something than can make the dems look less idiotic than they do about the way the economy works if you can...

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?...

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?...

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?...

    Adios
    Well I'm pretty sure the dem controlled congress, since 2006, http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/1... had themselves quite the spending spree. Don't have the figures, and I'm not about to waste my time digging them up to argue in vain with you!

    The ones who govern are the problem. The more they try to legislate "fairness" and "equality" into everyones' lives but theirs', the more time and money they throw down the crapper! Life is unfair, get used to it!

    I was mad as hell when Bush and the dem controlled congress started the bail outs! They never should have done it in my opinion. But, they did do it. Then along comes mr. "hope and change" and spends three times more than Bush did! Wow, he sure knows how to shake things up in DC, doesn't he?.

    You are so lost on the Reaganomics point I'm not even going to bother with it.

    The dems failed policies (fannie and freddie etc) led directly to this economic melt down. Try to watch the video links below to the end, and maybe you'll learn something. Please try to find something than can make the dems look less idiotic than they do about the way the economy works if you can...

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?...

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?...

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?...

    Adios
    (more)
  • Al C. 2010/12/16 00:26:16
    Government regulation--C.R.A., Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac, Government Welfare
    Al C.
    +4
    The government causes all these problems then blames it on everyone else!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
  • patriot... Al C. 2010/12/16 07:01:40
    patriotrooster
    http://www.republicoftheunite...

    come and check this out this is your new government
  • A Found... Al C. 2010/12/16 07:37:28
    A Founding Father
    Blaming "the Governmnet" for the thefts by Wall Street's "Reagan Banks" and Barons, is very similar to blaming 7-11 for the armed robbery of it's all-night little store.
  • jajanet Al C. 2010/12/16 13:37:36
  • THE LEF... Al C. 2010/12/16 16:13:05
    THE LEFT=DESTRUCTION
    The government takes our tax dollars and is suppose to provide services to benefit the American taxpayer; paying into the US government.
    One of those services is to keep the bullies/greedy and dishonest under control with regulation, and oversight.
    The democrats, which controlled the congress from 2006 to 2010 with a majority, failed miserably
    to do their job.
  • divajinx 2010/12/16 00:20:57
    Other...
    divajinx
    +2
    Greed. We Americans are the greediest people on Earth. We always have to be one step better than the next person. E.g. if "A" has an above-ground pool then "B" has to have an in-ground pool. "C" then has to have an in-ground pool with an attached jacuzzi! It just goes on and on...We are a greedy bunch! We need to get over our "keeping up with the Joneses" attitude. Simple is better (and less expensive)!
  • Conserv... divajinx 2010/12/16 01:12:49
    Conservative in California
    +1
    that sounds like freedom to me...

    Would you rather the government dictate what Americans are allowed to have and how hard they can work and how much money they are allowed to earn?
  • THE LEF... divajinx 2010/12/16 16:20:42
    THE LEFT=DESTRUCTION
    Yes, but what about the greedy/ crooked/ self centered foreign investors, bankers, brokers, appraisers, and real estate agents, and last but not least; greedy democrats, and RINOs that promise anything to get re-elected and keep their plush jobs?
  • lucky 2010/12/16 00:16:02
    Other...
    lucky
    +2
    Some of the above but also FTA's, irresponsible government spending, lack of competitiveness in retail. trade deficits.
  • AndrewTally 2010/12/16 00:11:00
    The free market
    AndrewTally
    +3
    I'd say a mix of the free-market and the fiscal vandalism by the Republicans.
  • Conserv... AndrewT... 2010/12/16 01:13:45
    Conservative in California
    +1
    capitalists simply followed the laws that government created to make money.
  • 2468 Conserv... 2010/12/16 01:31:34
    2468
    +1
    By gaming the system with lobbyists.
    Who is my lobbyist?
  • FAN 2010/12/16 00:06:53
    Other...
    FAN
    PPL like madoff and greedy bankers big bonuses and the like is in part what ruined the economy on a lower level.... the agreements with foreign countries..did not help we owe so much to China..
  • Conserv... FAN 2010/12/16 01:16:56
    Conservative in California
    +1
    Madoff did what the federal government does everyday with Social Security and Medicare, yet on a much smaller scale.

    if big bonuses by "greedy' bankers were bad, wouldn't the board of directors fire them or shareholders vote out the board of directors. Why didn't they? Answer: bonuses were a drop in the bucket and didn't adversely affect earnings. They were paid industry standard. If you make a company billions, what does a $10 million matter?

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