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Was It a Good Move to Change Soldier Attire at the Pentagon?

SodaHead News 2011/06/16 11:00:00
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No longer will Army soldiers be lost in the desert and jungle wallpaper in the cafeteria of the Pentagon.* Beginning this week, a couple changes went into effect in the building.

First, as Fox News reports, soldiers who once wore combat fatigues to work at the Pentagon will now be required to wear the formal service uniform. Additionally, the black beret, which proved deeply unpopular with American soldiers, will be replaced by a patrol cap for everyday wear, U.S. Army spokesman Col. Tom Collins said.

The black beret, it should be noted, is popular with the Army Rangers, who have traditionally worn the chapeau as a sign of distinction – as special forces have the green beret and the Airborne division have maroon.

After 9/11, then Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld had the soldiers at the Pentagon don combat fatigues to remind them we were at war.** However, the current SecDef, Robert Gates, last year ordered a change back to the more business-like attire for work in Washington. Some think this will give soldiers dealing with D.C. bureaucrats a greater level of respect in civilian situations.

The hat change also seems to be a-OK with soldiers. Chief Warrant Officer Mark Vino, at Joint Base Lewis-McChord in Washington state, told the Army Times, “I hate wearing a wet sock on my head…Plus it makes head/skin break out.”

With the ground wars under America's belt getting less and less daily attention in the press, was it a good idea to keep those “over there” on the tips of everyone’s sartorial tongues? Or is the change of garb a good move?

*We cannot confirm there are actually landscapes papered on the walls of the Pentagon cafeteria.
**New dress uniforms do not indicate an end to the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan.
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Top Opinion

  • bluelady 2011/06/16 13:46:53
    Yes
    bluelady
    +12
    On assignment to the pentagon, class A's should be the uniform... on duty in a combat zone.... fatigues ...finally makes sense
    Looks like someone at the Army got some sense...(sorry guys, Old Jarhead couldnt resist)

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  • Lerro DeHazel 2011/06/19 00:43:13
    Yes
    Lerro DeHazel
    It is kind of stupid to be wearing those camouflaged uniforms when working behind a desk, anyway. I wasn't even aware that was going on. In the Marine Corps we never wore our green utilities unless we were doing that kind of work; but NOT behind a desk, in an office setting. That is so stupid. No wonder the Army sucks so much. Semper Fidelis . . .
  • erik Lerro D... 2012/08/02 18:14:51
    erik
    +3
    Your a dumb arrogant roid head, semper stupid camera jocky!
  • Lerro D... erik 2012/08/02 21:10:51
    Lerro DeHazel
    I hope you are are NOT an S-2 Interpretor . . . If you are then I hope for sure it's not anything to do with the English Language, as we know it!! Go Navy!! Beat Army!!
  • angel Lerro D... 2013/04/15 00:39:31
    angel
    +1
    Dont say semper fidelis if you are not marines when you join the us military they teach you respect other decision liked or not stop trying to be a man dumbass little kid
  • Lerro D... angel 2013/04/15 01:14:00
    Lerro DeHazel
    There are lots of reasons that nothing you stated here made any sense . . . The main reason being that there are Labels that deserve Upper-Case identity such as Marine, U.S. Military, and Semper Fidelis . . . I happen to be a Former NCO and Sergeant in the United States Marine Corps . . . I would know that, puke! (Lower case for your identity) Semper Fi.
  • Quanchi 2011/06/18 02:27:34
    Yes
    Quanchi
    They have to be dressed to handle business with civilians.
  • kobidobidog 2011/06/17 16:03:06
    Yes
    kobidobidog
    Peace means to do not war.Matthew 5:7Blessed [are] the merciful: for they shall obtain mercy. There is no mercy in war.King James Bible 1 John 4:12
    No man hath seen God at any time. If we love one another, God dwelleth in us, and his love is perfected in us.The spirit of God needs to be in us. to love one another. Then the soul is saved. That is what is important for eternity.This interest in military attire is focusing on a dead lifeless things Like an Idol the Amorites would bow down to.
  • Joseph E. Bowker, CMSgt, US... 2011/06/17 15:34:44 (edited)
    No
    Joseph E. Bowker, CMSgt, USAF (Ret)
    +1
    As a Sgt (E4) I was Generals Aid, and had 15 pairs of Class B Uniforms, and 6 Class A Uniforms, and 2 sets of Fatigues. (I received a special Allowance for Uniforms and their Maintenance) At the Pentagon, men & women should at least be in a Class B Uniform, sharp and wearing a sharp Uniform reflects on the Uniform Service, and their Commander and staff, like First Sergent. There is no doubt a military member's pride is reflected in his/her uniform. The USAF allowed Pilots, not on Flying Status, still wear the "Bag" (Flight Suit.) Why? It was comfortable. They looked (look) like fools and also need to return to the Class A or B Uniform in garrison or Staff jobs. comfortable looked fools return class uniform garrison staff jobs USAF Flight Suit The Bag looked fools return class uniform garrison staff jobs bag USAF Class A Uniform Class A USAF Uniform. class uniform garrison staff jobs bag class usaf uniform USAF Class A Uniform Class B Uniform. garrison staff jobs bag class usaf uniform class uniform USAF Class A Uniform Class C Uniform (Kidding)
  • dublin9 Joseph ... 2011/06/18 16:47:53 (edited)
    dublin9
    I too believe that dress is important. If you dress like a slob, you think like a slob. I remember in basic training all too many decades ago, we would be lined up for formation inspection and our combat attire couldn't have as much as one thread sticking out.

    We each had a "gig" book and would be marked down for being sloppy if one piece of fuzzy thread was showing. Everyone had a pen knife to keep things looking sharp.

    As to the beret, I was always against its mass implementation. It used to be reserved for elite units. When it was expanded to include everyone, it created a "sameness reward." Besides, I've always preferred the Patrol cap. It's much more practical.

    P.S. NCO's keep everyone on their toes. I'm up from the ranks. I remember in my early days back in the stone age, referring to a Sergeant as "Sir." He looked at me with a scowl and firmly replied "Don't call me Sir. I'm not an officer. I work." That was one of my early mistakes, along with referring to a Guide On as a "flag." Boy, did I get hell for that.
  • Joseph ... dublin9 2011/06/18 21:12:23 (edited)
    Joseph E. Bowker, CMSgt, USAF (Ret)
    +1
    Well Sir, I made the same mistake. My favorite sayings when, because I was educated (A Degree in History) I was asked why I didn't apply for a Commission, I said they wouldn't accept me, my parents were married to each other. (Subtle - no not really) and being called sir got a sharp, hell man, I work for a living. But I worked for some exceptional officers, mostly O5 or above. Because of my position in several agencies, I was often hated by my Peers and young Officers, but generally, it was my own fault. I know you never noticed it [SIC!] but I can be a "Besser Wisser" (Ger. Trans:Better Knower, means "Know it all") and had no problem proving it. LOL! When an older couple of Texans in their 80s saw me wearing a Vietnam Veterans Hat, and a Obama/Biden Shirt, (in 2008) the lady said, "Don't-cha know, he will paint the White House Black, and demand Reparations" and her Husband said, "The Bible says that we, white folks are responsible for Black men because they are not smart enough t be leaders." I was, am quick to let them know that my Commander in Vietnam (2nd Tour) was a Black Major, and I am positive, he helped get me home alive. I also had a Black E9 First Sergeant, the finest Military Leader I have ever known, in Texas, and they said it wasn't possible. I also know,...
    Well Sir, I made the same mistake. My favorite sayings when, because I was educated (A Degree in History) I was asked why I didn't apply for a Commission, I said they wouldn't accept me, my parents were married to each other. (Subtle - no not really) and being called sir got a sharp, hell man, I work for a living. But I worked for some exceptional officers, mostly O5 or above. Because of my position in several agencies, I was often hated by my Peers and young Officers, but generally, it was my own fault. I know you never noticed it [SIC!] but I can be a "Besser Wisser" (Ger. Trans:Better Knower, means "Know it all") and had no problem proving it. LOL! When an older couple of Texans in their 80s saw me wearing a Vietnam Veterans Hat, and a Obama/Biden Shirt, (in 2008) the lady said, "Don't-cha know, he will paint the White House Black, and demand Reparations" and her Husband said, "The Bible says that we, white folks are responsible for Black men because they are not smart enough t be leaders." I was, am quick to let them know that my Commander in Vietnam (2nd Tour) was a Black Major, and I am positive, he helped get me home alive. I also had a Black E9 First Sergeant, the finest Military Leader I have ever known, in Texas, and they said it wasn't possible. I also know, we had Bars (Leaves) and Stripes to make us Alpha Dogs. President Obama was a Neighborhood Organizer, a natural leader of men, who required neither Bar or Leaf, or Stripes to make him a great Leader.
    neighborhood organizer natural leader required bar leaf stripes leader Military Ranks neighborhood organizer natural leader required bar leaf stripes leader Officer Military Ranks
    (more)
  • dublin9 Joseph ... 2011/06/18 21:56:13
    dublin9
    One of the best terms used in the Army is "We're not white or black. We're all green." I've never believed in judging individuals on race, family or lineage. We can take pride in our background, but only deserve to use it as an add on to our own accomplishments. Without personal accomplishment and conduct, we have cast a shaddow on our ancestors. Hiding behind ancestrry to feel "superior" means you have done nothing worthy for yourself.

    I'm a Jewish guy from Brooklyn. My family came her in the 1880's. My lovely wife of 28 years is a WASP with lineage going back to 1705. My family were the foundry workers who with their sweat, made the Iwo Jima Memorial Statue in Washington DC. Yup. It was made in Greenpoint Brooklyn. My wife's ancestors fought in the Revolutionary War and got a small amount of land for their efforts in Western New York State. They were small dairy farmers ever since.

    I loved her dad. He proudly called himself a "Redneck" and loved tooling around in the 1969 GTO I rebuilt with the help of a good old boy from Ohio. The Best Man at our Wedding was from Trinidad. Like me, he was a staunch conservative and like my brother. That's the beauty of America.

    Where we part company is in our interpretation of Barack Obama. I appreciate someone who accomplished someth...

    One of the best terms used in the Army is "We're not white or black. We're all green." I've never believed in judging individuals on race, family or lineage. We can take pride in our background, but only deserve to use it as an add on to our own accomplishments. Without personal accomplishment and conduct, we have cast a shaddow on our ancestors. Hiding behind ancestrry to feel "superior" means you have done nothing worthy for yourself.

    I'm a Jewish guy from Brooklyn. My family came her in the 1880's. My lovely wife of 28 years is a WASP with lineage going back to 1705. My family were the foundry workers who with their sweat, made the Iwo Jima Memorial Statue in Washington DC. Yup. It was made in Greenpoint Brooklyn. My wife's ancestors fought in the Revolutionary War and got a small amount of land for their efforts in Western New York State. They were small dairy farmers ever since.

    I loved her dad. He proudly called himself a "Redneck" and loved tooling around in the 1969 GTO I rebuilt with the help of a good old boy from Ohio. The Best Man at our Wedding was from Trinidad. Like me, he was a staunch conservative and like my brother. That's the beauty of America.

    Where we part company is in our interpretation of Barack Obama. I appreciate someone who accomplished something. A Community Organizer is not a leader in the true sense. They are rabble rousers who as with Obama, hide behind devisiveness and hate to manipulate the mob and shake people down through fear. I've seen a good deal of this over the years in my New York City.

    Years ago, I took riot training in uniform. One of the things I was taught is that you never really get the leaders. They stir up the mob and then pull back to avoid getting hurt. That's the concept of a community organizer. It's like that with the Jihadis. Then never put on an explosive belt themselves. They just get other people killed to further their own agenda and enhance their power.
    (more)
  • Joseph ... dublin9 2011/06/18 21:33:15 (edited)
    Joseph E. Bowker, CMSgt, USAF (Ret)
    +1
    I forgot, an old Story, the Sergeant Major of the Green Beret came to speak to my Junior NCO Graduating Class. He told the following story; "While sitting in the Bus Station near the Post, a women came up to him and said, I know what the Green Beret is, Special Forces, but what are the Maroon Berets we see now?" He answered, "Well Mam, a lot of Green Beret's got VD over seas, and we put them in Maroon Berets to keep track of them." He went on to say, "The Rangers, who got Maroon Berets at that point, couldn't figure out why they could not get a date the whole Week end." Thought you'd appreciate that. maroon berets track rangers maroon berets figure date week Green Beret
  • dublin9 Joseph ... 2011/06/18 22:05:55
    dublin9
    One of the best lines I'd ever heard came from an MSG of mine. I live in a very liberal neighborhood and he arrived in his car during one of their candle light vigels for "peace" around ten years ago (as I recall). I'm a big guy (6'2"), but my Sergeant is a 6'4" giant.

    In any event, he was wearing his BDU's back then and came to pick up something from my apartment and bring it back to our Armory. When he arrived, he asked me if my neighborhood was always "this nutty," explaining that when he passed by the "peace" group, they began shouting "baby killer."

    Not known for his passivity, I asked him if he responded. He said "I told them I only kill the ones I eat." He really shouldn't have said anything, but what a great Sergeant's comeback.
  • Joseph ... dublin9 2011/06/19 05:38:12
    Joseph E. Bowker, CMSgt, USAF (Ret)
    +1
    That is why I was always so proud to be a Sergent and not go to Officer Candidate School. You are an Officer and Gentleman by act of Congress. My mama kicked my ass to make me a Gentleman, but I could bloody well act the fool if it was needed. When I was a Budget Man (Resources Manager) for an O5 Commander, he asked how I got a certain amount of money and I told him, "Sir, you do not want to know - you could go to jail, but I am a Crude Enlisted Man and no o0ne will ever ask me and expect the truth."
    Did I tell you that I was originally from Philadelphia, PA. Yeah, I am pretty well used to the Jewish Kids from Brooklyn. We used to go there, and them to South Philly for Gang wars.
  • V~POTL~PWCM~JLA 2011/06/17 14:17:27
    Yes
    V~POTL~PWCM~JLA
    +1
    Fatigues are for field operations, not the Pentagon.
  • JCD aka "biz" 2011/06/17 13:42:05
    Yes
    JCD aka "biz"
    Can you please post a picture of the women' uniforms?
  • Joseph ... JCD aka... 2011/06/18 21:20:58
  • JCD aka... Joseph ... 2011/06/18 21:29:16
    JCD aka "biz"
    +1
    Thank you!
  • gibyob 2011/06/17 11:47:49
    Yes
    gibyob
    It is the wqay it was for years before 9/11 It is a professional office building and the military has uniforms for all occasions. it just isn't that big a deal.
  • Johnny Angel 2011/06/17 09:25:19 (edited)
    Yes
    Johnny Angel
    +1
    They should be dressed sharply not ready to lay in the mud.
  • BoJay 2011/06/17 07:50:59
    No
    BoJay
    +2
    I would love to see the ARMY go back to the old khaki uniform.
    love army khaki uniform us army ww2 uniform
    http://www.zazzle.com/cross_s...
  • Joseph ... BoJay 2011/06/18 21:23:38
    Joseph E. Bowker, CMSgt, USAF (Ret)
    I like the old style Uniform too. I would like to see a Tunic Style with Belt identical for each Service, with Army Green, Marine Brown, Navy - Navy Blue and Air Force, Air Force Blue.
    Tradition for the Navy and Coast Guard is too expensive, and not Practical.
  • RobertRowe 2011/06/17 07:31:03
    No
    RobertRowe
    +1
    it isn't the uniform that makes the soldier, it's their mind and heart. it's no problem if it's the formal wear they have had for years but if it's a new design of uniform i agree that it's worthless spending.
  • Joseph ... RobertRowe 2011/06/18 21:26:25
    Joseph E. Bowker, CMSgt, USAF (Ret)
    I once asked a Nun in 8th Grade why Catholics had to wear a Tie and White Shirt to school and she said, "If you dress like a slob, or like your on the Play Ground you will act accordingly. If you are fresh, clean and sharp, you will act accordingly." Don't know if I believed her then, but my DI (Drill Instructor) in Basic Training told me the same thing. Now, I agree with them both.
  • K.Kramer - BN-03 2011/06/17 07:30:08
    Yes
    K.Kramer - BN-03
    It's a return to tradition and makes the folks working in the offices appear more professional, thereby granting/requiring for them the respect they deserve. Class A's are perfect for the office environment of the Pentagon. Remember people: It's always necessary to wear the uniform appropriate to the environment, whether you're Military or Civilian.
  • ELLIE 2011/06/17 06:03:56
    Yes
    ELLIE
    No third option!!! In my eyes it doesn't make much difference what they wear as long as they are ready and alert to do battle on the spot,should the situation arise.
  • DavidK 2011/06/17 05:26:27
    No
    DavidK
    +1
    Just more foolish government spending.
  • Mariann... DavidK 2011/06/17 08:35:28
    Marianne723
    +1
    I'm surprized they don't look like this... surprized surprized
  • Op4 2011/06/17 05:17:14 (edited)
    Yes
    Op4
    Although I understand Rumsfeld's thought, class A's make more sense for the environment. However, I've never liked the idea of making the black beret the Army's general cover, and would like to see it go back to the Rangers.



    Sometimes something has more value when it has to be earned.
  • ILuvMonkeys 2011/06/17 05:13:16
  • Rachael Helms - BN01 2011/06/17 05:10:41
    Yes
    Rachael Helms - BN01
    Yes save the Camo for war time.
  • Jerry Rojas 2011/06/17 05:09:09
    No
    Jerry Rojas
    +1
    the army makes it look bad. Fat....

    Marines make it look better. 8)
  • Zak Smith Jerry R... 2011/06/17 20:13:19
    Zak Smith
    Hoo-rah!
  • Davebuc... Jerry R... 2011/06/17 22:13:56
    Davebuck186com
    +1
    Yea like I never saw a fat marine before:'/
  • ««Gingey, the Master Debate... 2011/06/17 03:57:54
    Yes
    ««Gingey, the Master Debater of Þ|-|Дэ†»»
    +1
    Camo is freaking ugly.
  • bullsballs 2011/06/17 03:42:41
    Yes
    bullsballs
    +1
    sorry, but the dress uniform is for formal/business, and fatigues are for battle.
    whoever decided fatigues were for the office was an ignorant fool...
  • Joseph ... bullsballs 2011/06/18 21:44:15
    Joseph E. Bowker, CMSgt, USAF (Ret)
    Remember, in Vietnam we called them BDU. (Battledress Uniform) Not ignorant, I can't accept that, but would suggest Lazy. To lazy to dress in the Uniform properly. When I was a junior enlisted man, we had to dress on base if we intended to stop at the Civilian Grocery Store on the way home. Either Dress Uniform or Civies. See them in BDUs all the time now. But, when ever I see a Soldier in BDU or Dress Uniform in the Grocery Store, I always invite him or her to the front of the line. and tell my fellow shoppers, "These people never get enough time at home, because of their service to us, let's get Her/Him Home." No one has ever said no (except the Soldier, but I do not accept a no, thank you.) As a retired man, I remember in the BX I used to hate it when Retirees blocked the BX Lines. Now, I feel a little different about it all.
  • Timmy 2011/06/17 03:39:40
    No
    Timmy
    +1
    Looks like Mall Security.
  • apachehellfire65 2011/06/17 03:14:41
    No
    apachehellfire65
    +1
    i liked the camo. but i am happy they are getting rid of that damn beret!
  • Leinad 2011/06/17 03:03:09
    No
    Leinad
    +1
    We are to take on the U.N.'s pansy-ass look, next it will be with fluorescent orange helmets.......A soldier is a SOLDIER, dress as a SOLDIER......

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