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Supreme Court Says Buy Health Insurance Or Be Taxed More. Do you agree?

ServantOfAllah 2012/06/28 14:15:13
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The Supreme court ruled that while Congress cannot make you get health insurance, you can be taxed more if you don't. Do you agree with their verdict?

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  • Philo-CommieHater! 2012/06/28 16:43:27
    I disagree with the verdict.
    Philo-CommieHater!
    +35
    Completely unconstitutional. SCOTUS cannot institute a tax, neither can POTUS. Bad law, worse medicine. Welcome to the USSA, comrades!
    flag of the untied soviet states of america

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  • gracious43 StarWar... 2012/07/13 15:18:20 (edited)
    gracious43
    I believe you are right. It will be modified as it goes along, more than likely, and that will probably be best.

    I am going to be watching the life expectancies of Japan after the earthquake disaster in 2011. My point being that there are many other causes of decreased life expectancy than lack of insurance and health care alone. I've scarcely used any health-care in my life. In fact, I am the only one my age at work who isn't on prescription medication of any kind. That's because I made other choices in my youth that benefited my health. None of them involved my doctor.

    And of course the environment influences our health too. Neither we nor the Japanese can control earthquakes and tsunamis.

    One of the problems with the insurance companies now is that they are dictating horrible birth conditions for mothers. There are just too many c-sections in the US, and too much intervention from the medical staff. If that doesn't change, morbidities and mortalities in the US from birth complications aren't going to change either.

    Everything done in a US hosital setting is designed for the purpose of staff, not the mother and the baby. And one reason that women can't opt out of the hospital birth setting is that their insurance won't allow it. They have paid all of this money for insurance a...





    I believe you are right. It will be modified as it goes along, more than likely, and that will probably be best.

    I am going to be watching the life expectancies of Japan after the earthquake disaster in 2011. My point being that there are many other causes of decreased life expectancy than lack of insurance and health care alone. I've scarcely used any health-care in my life. In fact, I am the only one my age at work who isn't on prescription medication of any kind. That's because I made other choices in my youth that benefited my health. None of them involved my doctor.

    And of course the environment influences our health too. Neither we nor the Japanese can control earthquakes and tsunamis.

    One of the problems with the insurance companies now is that they are dictating horrible birth conditions for mothers. There are just too many c-sections in the US, and too much intervention from the medical staff. If that doesn't change, morbidities and mortalities in the US from birth complications aren't going to change either.

    Everything done in a US hosital setting is designed for the purpose of staff, not the mother and the baby. And one reason that women can't opt out of the hospital birth setting is that their insurance won't allow it. They have paid all of this money for insurance and they don't have the funds to elect for birth outside of a hospital setting. I respectfully submit to you that this appears to be a collusion between insurance companies and hospitals.--And if it isn't, then regardless, it appears to be, and it is one and the same to women.

    What I learned during my first homebirth, was not to let my excitement overcome my need to rest. The minute I had my bloody show, I called my family and in an immature attempt to "speed up" the delivery, I started walking. My son had no intention of being "sped up" and to this day, he refuses to be hurried along."

    After a couple hours of nothing happening, I was exhausted, and fortunately, because I was at home, I just fell back to sleep and woke up between contractions and then went back to sleep. But that is not an option for laboring women in hospitals.

    I was walking to the cafeteria one night, and I happened into a woman in labor who was walking and in tears. I asked her what was wrong and she said that her doctor had put her on a two hour walk. After that, she would be be put in a hospital bed and the entire protocols of that hospital's birth process would be carried out step by step, minute by minute. Her pain and fatigue would be managed by drugs. There needs to be a total revamp of birth and delivery education in the US, so that the process doesn't benefit the hospital, instead of the patient. Because all of the health insurance in the world isn't going to change the culture of greed that is affecting women and children in our nation.
    (more)
  • Grandpa StarWar... 2012/07/03 12:41:06 (edited)
    Grandpa
    Your asking others to pay for someone who went out and partied ,drank to much and was not wearing a helment and crashed into a tree >> was the motor cycle insured ??? Where is his family and friends ????>> Did he not know better ?? We all have option in this world and we are all aware of insurance but it was HIS choice to not have it even though he was able and could easily afford it >> Why not hire a lawyer and sue the tree ??? Then it could pay the bill >> Time for the people to grow up and NOT EXPECT the goverment and the people of the world to say it OK if you screw up as we will care for You ?? Like welfare , have a child out of wed lock and we will give you money and pay for a place to live and if you need a raise just have another child or two >> Question for YOU are we supporting this type of behavior ????? And how many are working the system and why doesn't it stop as these people live better than those on Social Security >> We Support them as they have hospital care ,new clothes , heat ,gas,lights >. Guess we can add all the stupid people who don't care for themselfs to the list of the goverment DEPENDENTS
  • StarWar... Grandpa 2012/07/03 19:19:57
    StarWarsBob
    +1
    Yes, the motorcycle was insured, but normal insurance for medical payments is about $5,000. John had $100,000 of his own, and his insurance covered $5,000, so who pays the $245,000 balance on the hospital and doctor bills? What happens all the time is that John and people like him files for bankruptcy, the hospital and doctors absorb the losses, and hospitals increase their rates to outrageous levels and passes those increases on to the insurance companies and then they raise their premiums for those that have health insurance. That is the primary reason why health care costs $2.7 trillions a year in this country, when it only cost $256 billions in 1980.

    Read this study from Harvard Medical School about bankruptcies caused by health care costs:
    http://www.businessweek.com/b...
    "Medical problems caused 62% of all personal bankruptcies filed in the U.S. in 2007, according to a study by Harvard researchers. And in a finding that surprised even the researchers, 78% of those filers had medical insurance at the start of their illness, including 60.3% who had private coverage, not Medicare or Medicaid."
    "Medically related bankruptcies have been rising steadily for decades. In 1981, only 8% of families filing for bankruptcy cited a serious medical problem as the reason, while a 2001 stu...

    Yes, the motorcycle was insured, but normal insurance for medical payments is about $5,000. John had $100,000 of his own, and his insurance covered $5,000, so who pays the $245,000 balance on the hospital and doctor bills? What happens all the time is that John and people like him files for bankruptcy, the hospital and doctors absorb the losses, and hospitals increase their rates to outrageous levels and passes those increases on to the insurance companies and then they raise their premiums for those that have health insurance. That is the primary reason why health care costs $2.7 trillions a year in this country, when it only cost $256 billions in 1980.

    Read this study from Harvard Medical School about bankruptcies caused by health care costs:
    http://www.businessweek.com/b...
    "Medical problems caused 62% of all personal bankruptcies filed in the U.S. in 2007, according to a study by Harvard researchers. And in a finding that surprised even the researchers, 78% of those filers had medical insurance at the start of their illness, including 60.3% who had private coverage, not Medicare or Medicaid."
    "Medically related bankruptcies have been rising steadily for decades. In 1981, only 8% of families filing for bankruptcy cited a serious medical problem as the reason, while a 2001 study of bankruptcies in five states by the same researchers found that illness or medical bills contributed to 50% of all filings."

    """Unless you're Warren Buffett, your family is just one serious illness away from bankruptcy.""
    (more)
  • Grandpa StarWar... 2012/07/03 20:12:20 (edited)
    Grandpa
    So be it >. It is not the end of the world >> Perhaps he will have learned and i am sure the doctors or the hospital will survive >> Write it off as a tax loss And why can welfare person get so much care at no cost >>> The system needs overhaul >>> maybe a good lawyer could sue the tree or the people who planted it in his way >> And under the new plan we are fined if we don't buy ,Or a family of 4 can have thier taxes increased 2500.00 dollars a year to pay the doctors and hospitals plus some offical in washington will need to OK the procedure >>> So far all i've seen is numbers and not reality >> You sir need to read JAA coments to Elementer and learn what getting real means @ steps down
  • StarWar... Grandpa 2012/07/04 05:56:45
    StarWarsBob
    +2
    For 2014 and 2015 the penalty for not buying health insurance is $95 for an individual or 1% of income, whichever is greater, and $47.50 for each dependent. That fee increases to $695 in 2016. When everybody has insurance (or 99% of everybody), health care costs will go down, and those savings will be passed on to insurance companies. Hospitals and doctors will not lose money anymore. The unfunded mandate of the EMTALA will stop the cycle of cost increases in the health care system, and every sector of health care will be making more money.

    The way things work now is that the health insurance company decides what procedures are covered and which ones are denied. They have devised a hundred different ways to deny claims. I know this because I worked for one of the top five largest health insurance companies for seven years. The pre-existing clause that was used extensively by insurance companies will be gone in 2014.
  • Elementer Freedom... 2012/06/30 22:05:20 (edited)
    Elementer
    You just proved my assumption right.
  • JAA Elementer 2012/07/01 06:44:40 (edited)
    JAA
    It's not socialism because it's a verdict we disagree with. We disagree with it because not only is it socialism gone wild, but a bad, bad idea, & I think Donald Trump says it the best:

    "Let me get this straight . . . We're going to be "gifted" with a health care plan we are forced to purchase & fined if we don't, which purportedly covers at least ten million more people without adding a single new doctor, but provides for 16,000 new IRS agensts, written by a committee whose chairman says he doesn't understand it, passed by a Congress that didn't read it but exempted themselves from it, and signed by a Dumbo President who smokes, with funding administrerd by a treasury chief who didn't pay his taxes, for which we'll be taxed for four years before any benefits take effect, by a government which has already bankrupted Social Secuirty and Medicare, all to be overseen by a surgeon general who is obese, and financed by a country that's broke!!!"

    Liberalism is a mental disorder. Statism is a death sentence.
  • Grandpa JAA 2012/07/03 20:22:44
    Grandpa
    +1
    Very well written and so true >>> Pass it on to starwars he needs help
  • JAA Grandpa 2012/07/03 22:50:08
    JAA
    Done. Thanks.
  • jere.chievres 2012/06/30 17:28:38
    I disagree with the verdict.
    jere.chievres
    +1
    F^ck em.
  • evangel... jere.ch... 2012/06/30 19:29:11 (edited)
    evangelism_vision
    +1
    I AGREE WITH YOU

    ************************ LOCK AND LOAD FULLY ARMED AND READY **********************

    MAKE ME TAKE OBAMA CARE IF YOU CAN..
  • Phantom evangel... 2012/07/01 20:28:03
    Phantom
    +1
    Hey bad ass. You'll just pay the tax, and like it.
  • evangel... Phantom 2012/07/01 20:41:36
    evangelism_vision
    LET ME TELL YOU WHAT I WROTE TO OBAMA

    QUOTE: " SCREW YOU AND YOU COME YOURSELF AND MAKE ME "
  • Phantom evangel... 2012/07/01 22:47:44
    Phantom
    When the IRS come after your freeloading ass, you'll think differently
  • evangel... Phantom 2012/07/01 23:24:50
    evangelism_vision
    YA WE SURE WILL WON'T WE......... BRING IT ON BABY!
  • Grandpa Phantom 2012/07/03 20:24:42
    Grandpa
    No they only want MONEY they have enough a$$ in Washington already
  • ALofRI 2012/06/30 15:35:21
    I agree with the verdict.
    ALofRI
    +2
    If you don't, the rest of us are "TAXED" if you have an accident, get food poisoning, Pneumonia, etc. This is standard "teamwork" people! Everyone does their share, and the whole game goes better! Just like every other industrialized country on Earth, that are ALL rated ABOVE and less expensive than the stupid conservative American system!

    The WHO finds France gives the best health care, followed by Italy, Spain, Oman, Austria and Japan. The U.S., (up to now), spends a higher portion of GDP on healthcare, but ranks 37th out of 191 countries! We rank 14th, behind ALL European "Socialist medicine" countries in preventable death! AND 49th in the world in life expectancy!

    What should be HUGELY important, to the Religious Right especially, but to ALL, is the fact that the U.S. ranks 174th in TOTAL INFANT DEATHS per 1000 live births! THAT'S a LOT of "unintentional abortions", or should we say,"preventable abortions"! You'd ALL do better to protest that old system, than abortion clinics! Obama has done a great thing and , after all, you shouldn't object to paying a "tax" for "saving all those babies...should you??
  • ALofRI ALofRI 2012/06/30 18:43:22
    ALofRI
    Hmmm, there seems to be little to say about these facts, they don't fly with RW points of acknowledgement, I guess.
  • jere.ch... ALofRI 2012/07/01 13:41:53
    jere.chievres
    +1
    No just O'Bozo's opinion seems to be prevalent here.
  • ALofRI jere.ch... 2012/07/01 15:56:33
    ALofRI
    But what about the infant deaths, the life expectancy, the #1 in healthcare cost for a 37th ranked system?? I didn't mention, Britain spends 6% of GDP on healthcare, America spends 56%, the U.K. is only ranked 18th, but that's twice as good as the U.S. I've been insured all MY working life also, and I'm damned glad I didn't have to pay "out of pocket" for it even though it was FAR cheaper for most of that time. Now, about them thar abortions you was against before you was for..."O'Bozo" can reduce that considerably by supplying health care to those who couldn't afford pre-natal care. I REALLY can't see the objection of that....ESPECIALLY, from the right!
  • jere.ch... ALofRI 2012/07/01 16:14:53
    jere.chievres
    Tuff titty
  • evangel... jere.ch... 2012/07/01 20:46:29
    evangelism_vision
    +1
    Jere we look forward to November 6th
  • jere.ch... ALofRI 2012/07/01 13:40:35
    jere.chievres
    Not in my case I am insured.
  • Studied 2012/06/30 15:27:55
    Undecided / Other
    Studied
    +2
    I do not care what the verdict was, I care about a bill being crammed down the throats of ALL Americans that the majority was against. The entire bill should be thrown out and rewritten. This bills contains tons of controls that have absolutely NO reason to be in it. Let's tackle this the correct way. Get all the garbage out of the bill. Simply mandate the main problems and no credits to anyone. If you really believe the poor have no health insurance you are believing a lie. We should also specifically state under no circumstances will any Illegal person have any of these entitlements. Why not address tort reform, or opening insurance purchase across state lines or allowing purchase of prescription drugs from Canada, who by the way is being charged less by our drug companies than we are. This bill does very little to address the biggest problems of healthcare.
  • cfd007 2012/06/30 15:05:27
    I disagree with the verdict.
    cfd007
    +2
    Keep the government OUT of my life!
  • evangel... cfd007 2012/07/01 20:47:06
    evangelism_vision
    a man
  • merlinskiss 2012/06/30 14:53:21
    I agree with the verdict.
    merlinskiss
    +2
    The supreme court gave an opinion that basically allows the government to recoup from the deadbeats for health care. I live in a county that has one of the highest bunch of welfare recipient deadbeats around and you know what? If they can afford cigarettes, booze, are grossly overweight and diabetic, they can afford healthcare insurance! Personally, after taking the time to read the actual plan, I think it was way past due and not to bad considering all the compromises. What I don't see is anything close to being as viable being proposed by the Repubs except for diarrhea of the mouth. They should be focusing n what they can do for the American electorate instead of their corporate cronies pumping millions in to their coffers to screw the average American. Quite frankly, I am fed up with the Repubs and not liking the Dems any better!
  • JAA merlins... 2012/07/01 06:47:35 (edited)
    JAA
    +1
    "Let me get this straight . . . We're going to be "gifted" with a health care plan we are forced to purchase & fined if we don't, which purportedly covers at least ten million more people without adding a single new doctor, but provides for 16,000 new IRS agents, written by a committee whose chairman says he doesn't understand it, passed by a Congress that didn't read it but exempted themselves from it, and signed by a Dumbo President who smokes, with funding administered by a treasury chief who didn't pay his taxes, for which we'll be taxed for four years before any benefits take effect, by a government which has already bankrupted Social Security and Medicare, all to be overseen by a surgeon general who is obese, and financed by a country that's broke!!!" Donald Trump

    Liberalism is a mental disorder. Statism is a death sentence.
  • merlins... JAA 2012/07/01 16:26:50
    merlinskiss
    +1
    Obviously, you haven't read it and don't get it. And you don't get SS either.
  • JAA merlins... 2012/07/01 21:32:40 (edited)
    JAA
    I'm a registered nurse & hospital risk manager, sweetie, & have read it as much as I care to, but like even the legislatures who passed the damn thing, I can't understand most of it. It's a gobbley-gook mess. As far as SS, I "get it" as much as any senior citizen who has been lied to & stolen from by our own government. Stop trying to blame the wrong people, shortcakes.
  • merlins... JAA 2012/07/01 21:59:32
    merlinskiss
    Hmmm.. Blame the wrong people? Looks pretty much like what Romney did in old Mass doesn't it.

    Try this: http://www.npr.org/2011/10/14...

    Oh, sorry, as a registered nurse and hospital risk manager, this might also be to confusing and complicated to read, right sweetie?
  • JAA merlins... 2012/07/02 03:59:27 (edited)
    JAA
    I couldn't care less about Obama [no PBUH] or Romney, so chomp away at either of them all you want.

    Yes, darling, honey, sugar pie, your idiocy & poor breeding are not lost on me. ;-)
  • evangel... merlins... 2012/07/01 20:47:54
    evangelism_vision
    +1
    ya i wonder why? Obama? BINGO
  • merlins... evangel... 2012/07/01 20:54:45
  • All American 2012/06/30 14:37:53
    I disagree with the verdict.
    All American
    +2
    They can now penalize us if we don't jump through whatever hoop they want us jump through. Thanks a lot SCOTUS.
  • ALofRI All Ame... 2012/06/30 18:30:07
    ALofRI
    +1
    Nobody wants you to jump through any hoop, just join America as a team player. I know the conservative definition of compromise and cooperation is when Liberals decide to do everything conservatives want....but.....we simply don't like you. Change...and you may see some ...hope.
  • All Ame... ALofRI 2012/06/30 20:16:12
    All American
    +1
    They got you asking how high already, don't they?
  • JAA ALofRI 2012/07/01 06:49:31
    JAA
    +2
    "Let me get this straight . . . We're going to be "gifted" with a health care plan we are forced to purchase & fined if we don't, which purportedly covers at least ten million more people without adding a single new doctor, but provides for 16,000 new IRS agents, written by a committee whose chairman says he doesn't understand it, passed by a Congress that didn't read it but exempted themselves from it, and signed by a Dumbo President who smokes, with funding administered by a treasury chief who didn't pay his taxes, for which we'll be taxed for four years before any benefits take effect, by a government which has already bankrupted Social Security and Medicare, all to be overseen by a surgeon general who is obese, and financed by a country that's broke!!!"

    Liberalism is a mental disorder. Statism is a death sentence. There is NO "hope" in either.
  • All Ame... JAA 2012/07/01 14:47:00
    All American
    +2
    I think you summed it up nicely.
  • ALofRI JAA 2012/07/01 22:20:33
    ALofRI
    Whew, A lot of wasted time on THAT response. Mr Spok would have one word for you....."illogical"!

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