Stockton Ca. Like Detroit is going to go bankrupt. Who is to blame? The Tax payers, for refusing to pay any more taxes? The politicians and the unions, for signing contracts that were unsustainable?

And the rest of the nation's cities are very close behind. You live in Stockton. This should be obvious to you.

This is the problem with government unions. They believe they should be pampered and cared for at the expense of the private sector ! If ANYBODY should get the kind of deals they do it is the military !! They put a whole lot more on the line when they are deployed overseas !! The city needs to go through bankruptcy making the contracts void. They then need to tell them that they can either take a much smaller pension setup and benefits package or they are done. With the unemployment rate as high as it is I doubt they would have ANY trouble getting good people to replace them !!!

A no brainer!

they are not to be treated any differently we are all on the same boat here

Put the moronic libtards in that vote for this crap.You clowns deserve every thing thats happening to you. Yes the rooster have come home to roost

They knew it long ago. Do not reject other people's demands, if the concern about taxes.

Bankrupt the cities, close down the unions.

Total money mismanagement! You can not spend your way to prosperity! It's time to end pensions and replace them with 401(k)s!

oh great another blame the unions drum beat from the RW.

How about the politicians in Stockton that spent money like it was on fire because Stockton was ground zero for the housing bubble collapse? I bet you the "unions" didnt get jack in the way of more compensation. But now they want to start clawing back long term commitments.

Way to go Gingerbread on understanding the "whole" story.

You say it's a "blame the unions drum beat", but it is true. There is ZERO need for unions anymore, and across the board, all they do is take, take, take.

right ... I would expect nothing different coming from Orange County.
BTW - didnt the state have to bail out Orange County and continues to this day? Maybe economics and finance is just not your expertise. Just sayin.

No, it's not. Are YOU an economist??? As for bailing out OC, this bass-ackwards state bails out every stinkin' county, not just Orange. And, you need to watch your generalizations. Surprisingly, California has way more red counties than blue, it just that all of the major population centers are blue, e.g., San Francisco, Marin, Los Angeles...
Moreover, your answer was an uninformed attack on me, who doesn't even live in or near Orange County. You don't address the truth that union contracts are killing this country, not only in the public sector.

Then perhaps you should seek another subject for debate because clearly you are out of your element on this subject.
Name me another CA county that has gone bankrupt? Bzzzz.... incorrect. None was the right answer.
Why introduce red and blue counties and how is it even relevant to the discussion?

As to the subject ... there is no "truth" to your claim. You are ill informed again. Find another debate you will lose this one if you choose to pursue it. The author of this post knows jack about Stockton or its finances and judging from your posts economics, finance and labor is not your subject either.

You are mighty crafty with your words and attacks, are you? Yes I am uninformed. For example, Stockton is not a county; it is a city in California’s central valley. Stockton is in San Joaquin County. I actually knew that. I also am so uniformed to know that the CITY of Vallejo, IN Contra Costa COUNTY, filed for bankruptcy several years ago. Ooooohhh… Who’s incorrect now?

Why introduce red and blue counties into the discussion? You brought it up in your generalization of Orange County. I don’t know WHY you brought it up, but you did, and OC is a notoriously conservative stronghold in the state, so I am assuming this was part of your generality.

Lastly, what is my claim that holds no “truth”?

I never denied that cities have filed for BK. This is not some new phenomena confined to CA. Its been done before and will probably take down many other cities before it over.
Your claim was that CA "bails out every stinkin' county" was factually incorrect. No other county in CA ever has.

But to get to the meat of your statement regarding unions. You try to pass the myth that unions 1. have caused Stockton to get to this point, and 2. the myth that unions are not needed .... both factually incorrect.

The city unions did not cause Stockton financial hardship. As to the second that is entirely your opinion not rooted in fact.

When I said “bails out” I am referring to the ridiculous amount of financial support that nearly every city, town and county gets from Sacramento. Personally, I resent my Ventura Cty tax dollars being spent in Kern or Stanislaus Cty.

I am sorry to disagree with your premise about unions not being the ruination of cities, counties, states and corporations - but let’s also not leave the agreeing politicians and corporations - but unions are indeed the groups that demand higher salaries, richer pensions, greater benefits, all without offering anything more than showing up to work the next day. Pensions are not sustainable. As the populous ages, there is no way that anyone can keep paying a growing number of those individuals indefinitely. It’s not like people are routinely croaking off at 68 anymore. Salaries of prison guards, for example, in CA is the highest in the nation, and FIVE TIMES the salary of the same men and women in Oklahoma. It is insane! Cops retire at their highest level of income, and that includes the vacation they bank and cash out in their 20th year, nearly doubling their salaries for that year.

And where are unions really needed, in the US, in the 21st century?

Unfreaking believable...

Another one bites the dust!

hehehe

hee heee +1 - CCH

I blame both the politicians and the city unions. The deal is that the unions get the politicians elected and the politicians agrees to union demands, and the tax payers get screwed. Nice arrangement until the tax payers stopped bending over. Then the money ran out, the politicians ran out and the voters are left holding an empty bag

uh huh - tell me what the ratio is between union members and the voting public in Stockton? Do you know? Do you even have a clue in Albuquerque about what went on in Stockton CA? Or is it you just want to beat the same Corporate LAME drum about the labor class?

Oh, get over it. A lot of us are in or were in the "labor class." And most of us have children there that are no longer working. Thanks to the union, my son makes only 80% of what men working in the plant made 20 years ago. However, those who have been there (and are still union members) for more than 11 years are making 100% - regardless of the amount of work they do - or don't do. And my son, who is more honest than anyone I've ever know, works his a** off. Those who don't want to work, have their union stewards tell the co bosses, "he is doing the best he can."

Sack it to them, Joe!

Be that as it may, Stockton is still broke, and the city will renege on every body that they said will get paid. Now, you go ahead and tell me if the unions won anything? The politicians and the union bosses got their money, what will the union rank and file get? Oh I know, they just got the finger. So did the tax payers.

Is that what its all about to you, winning and losing?

Lets correct you right now ... the "union" is people. Your neighbors doing all those jobs that keep the infrastructure maintained. So "the people" who do those jobs may or may not be reneged on ... that remains to be seen on what happens under chapter 11.
The "union bosses" are also employees ... not "thugs" that many like to tie to the term.
Stockton is broke, there is no denying that but it had NOTHING to do with the employees compensation regardless of the spin that is trying to be put on this.

Tell that again when the city reneges on the employees compensation. Oh, that's exactly what they are doing. sigh, you loose another argument. OOPS, better drag out GW again. It's his fault you know.

You think so huh?

The bankruptcy of Vallejo, an old port city of 118,000 on San Francisco Bay, was widely watched as a possible way for struggling local governments to cut soaring pension costs.
But when Vallejo emerged from a 31/2-year bankruptcy last November, pensions were untouched. The city actually increased annual payments to CalPERS, reducing pension debt sooner.

Woops .... and another bitch slap for the ignorant. Want to go some more?

Well, let's see what we shall see.

Whats with the hate? Why do you want to see neighbors, friends and families lose what they have worked for all their lives?
You need to get some help or greatly reconfigure your assumptions.

That's another one. If you can't blame Bush, accuse people of HATE. You got to do better than that.

screw the damn unions the tax payers are tired of paying for there broken down asses.

however, if you keep putting the same idiots back into power every election cycle, what should you expect.

"Oh My, Yes"

Many tax payers have been over burdened by bad, self serving, greedy decisions made by politicians. Many politicians here in Florida seem to think that tax payers are bottomless pits for them to fleece.

Like anyone , you must live within your means...



If you want stuff (or more stuff) you have to work for it....



Going into debt , that is non-recoverable is just ignorant....



Politicans spend "other peoples money" , they do not care what for , why or how much...



Just as long as it keeps them in power....



Does that sound like anyone you know?

Hey there's that surplus you guys keep claiming Clinton didn't hand to Bush.

And the cost of Bush's wars tacked onto Obamas debt.