I would originally have stated that, no matter what good or bad is represented by Scientologists, Tom Cruise is (kind of) in the end his own person.
BUT, that actually hinges on whether the first answer against that you posted here is true:
Tom Cruise personally promotes Holocaust revisionism.
IF THAT IS TRUE, the SWC, named for someone who spent his life tirelessly and until its end bringing those responsible for the holocaust to justice, has absolutely no place giving him an award. That one single point of advocacy on Cruise's part undermines the essential reason for the SWC's existence.
Should Tom Cruise of been given a Humanitarian award at the Simon Wiesenthal Center's annual dinner?
reaper
2011/05/07 09:38:11
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As reported by Danielle Berrin, in her blog for the Jewish Journal, Tom Cruise is about to be given a humanitarian award at the Simon Wiesenthal Center's annual dinner. It is to be held at the Beverly Wilshire Four Seasons Hotel in Los Angeles on Thursday.
Cruise's own personal deeds, as well as his intimate relationship with Scientology's leadership, have led to reactions to this decision. Human rights activists and ex-Scientologists have said they will protest the event, and some supporters of the SWC have in their disgust re-directed their support to other organizations.
I will sum up the cases for and against giving this award to Tom Cruise. Each point will first be listed in short, and then be elaborated on. My position is not neutral, but even so I will try to refrain from creating obvious straw man arguments here. If you have better arguments on either side, feel free to post them as comments below.
FOR:
- F1 He gave them money, and we don't care what he believes or supports beyond that.
- F2 Who cares about this award anyway, can't we let him and his friends have a little award show in peace and quiet?
- F3 Perhaps by giving Tom Cruise this award, he might do the right thing in the future.
- F4 Holocaust studies are more important than any abuses committed by Scientology.
- F5 Tom Cruise deserves the award because Scientology owns a lot of nice real estate. (This should have been a straw man, but it's actually a real and repeated argument.)AGAINST:
- A1 Tom Cruise personally promotes Holocaust revisionism.
- A2 Tom Cruise personally promotes "PTS/SP" and the "Tone Scale" - instruments for justifying despotism and even genocide.
- A3 Tom Cruise personally had his motorcycles, truck and airplane hangar worked on by trafficked and captive labor. Tom Cruise has also lived as a pampered guest at a labor camp in Riverside, CA.
- A4 Tom Cruise is a close personal friend of Scientology's leader David Miscavige, who was even the best man at his wedding. Tom Cruise is far from powerless to stop the abuses and fraud that Scientology commits. He's not any old member. He could speak out. Of particular concern to the SWC should be:
-- A4A Church of Scientology's long-standing Holocaust revisionism and trivialization.
-- A4B It being a totalitarian organization with dystopian designs on the world.
-- A4C It forms alliances with extremist groups like Louis Farrakhan's racist Nation of Islam
-- A4D Its intolerance of independent Scientologists
you can read more about it here http://littlegreenfootballs.com/page/245944_The_absurd_Wiesen...
It should also be noted that scientology was in fact responsible for forging bomb threats in the name of a young journalist named Paulette Cooper back in the 1970's. What makes this significant is the fact Paulette Cooper is a jewish women who happened to be born in Auschwitz and her parents were killed soon after by nazis.
these are the facts people, discuss, and yes even the scientologist can post as they want. I am for free speech, unlike some people that prove themselves to have an agenda but i'm not going to stop you from speaking about how you feel.
Top Opinion
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iamthemob ~ the 444th Guru ~ 2011/05/07 11:55:37
Otherwise, no: What did he do to deserve it? This is very damaging to the Wiesenthal Center's credibility!
"A truly Suppressive Person or group has NO RIGHTS OF ANY KIND and actions taken against them are NOT PUNISHABLE."
- L. Ron Hubbard, Hubbard Communications Office Policy Letter, 1 March 1965, HCO (Division 1) "Ethics, Suppressive Acts, Suppression of Scientology and Scientologists"
[SP = Suppressive Person a.k.a. critic of Scientology]
"There are only two answers for the handling of people from 2.0 down on the Tone Scale, neither one of which has anything to do with reasoning with them or listening to their justification of their acts. The first is to raise them on the Tone Scale by un-enturbulating some of their theta by any one of the three valid processes. The other is to DISPOSE OF THEM QUIETLY AND WITHOUT SORROW."
- L. Ron Hubbard, SCIENCE OF SURVIVAL, p. 170
"In any event, any person from 2.0 down on the Tone Scale SHOULD NOT HAVE, in any thinking society, ANY CIVIL RIGHTS OF ANY KIND, because by abusing those rights he brings into being arduous and strenuous laws which are oppressive to those who need no such restraints."
- L. Ron Hubbard, SCIENCE OF SURVIVAL, 1989 Ed., p. 145 [The "Tone Scale" is Scientology’s measure of mental and spiritual health. People like ...
"A truly Suppressive Person or group has NO RIGHTS OF ANY KIND and actions taken against them are NOT PUNISHABLE."
- L. Ron Hubbard, Hubbard Communications Office Policy Letter, 1 March 1965, HCO (Division 1) "Ethics, Suppressive Acts, Suppression of Scientology and Scientologists"
[SP = Suppressive Person a.k.a. critic of Scientology]
"There are only two answers for the handling of people from 2.0 down on the Tone Scale, neither one of which has anything to do with reasoning with them or listening to their justification of their acts. The first is to raise them on the Tone Scale by un-enturbulating some of their theta by any one of the three valid processes. The other is to DISPOSE OF THEM QUIETLY AND WITHOUT SORROW."
- L. Ron Hubbard, SCIENCE OF SURVIVAL, p. 170
"In any event, any person from 2.0 down on the Tone Scale SHOULD NOT HAVE, in any thinking society, ANY CIVIL RIGHTS OF ANY KIND, because by abusing those rights he brings into being arduous and strenuous laws which are oppressive to those who need no such restraints."
- L. Ron Hubbard, SCIENCE OF SURVIVAL, 1989 Ed., p. 145 [The "Tone Scale" is Scientology’s measure of mental and spiritual health. People like homosexuals, mentally challenged people and critics are below 2.0]
"ENEMY SP Order. Fair game. May be deprived of property or injured by any means by any Scientologist without any discipline of the Scientologist. May be tricked, sued or lied to or destroyed."
- L. Ron Hubbard, Hubbard Communications Office Policy Letter, 18 October 1967
"The sudden and abrupt deletion of all individuals occupying the lower bands of the Tone Scale from the social order would result in an almost instant rise in the cultural tone and would interrupt the dwindling spiral into which any society may have entered."
- L. Ron Hubbard, SCIENCE OF SURVIVAL, p. 170
"Unfortunately, it is all too often true that suppressors to a creative action must be removed before construction and creation takes place. Any person very high on the Tone Scale may level destruction toward a suppressor."
- L. Ron Hubbard, SCIENCE OF SURVIVAL, p. 159
"We're playing for blood, the stake is EARTH."
- L. Ron Hubbard, Hubbard Communications Office Policy Letter, 7 November 1962
Does that mindset sound familiar to you?
Also google "homo novis", $cientology's version of the "ubermensch", which "towers above mere homo sapiens like a skyscraper".
So I ask again... WHY would Tom Cruise even be considered for this award?
BUT, that actually hinges on whether the first answer against that you posted here is true:
Tom Cruise personally promotes Holocaust revisionism.
IF THAT IS TRUE, the SWC, named for someone who spent his life tirelessly and until its end bringing those responsible for the holocaust to justice, has absolutely no place giving him an award. That one single point of advocacy on Cruise's part undermines the essential reason for the SWC's existence.
Unless Tom Cruise is saying it, I'm going to give him the benefit of the doubt.
Which is always sort of a conversation stopper.
I read most of the article, it didn't seem to have much in the way of cons-
except in a general anti-scientology way.
I try to be careful not to condemn people for the whole scope of actions of a group they may belong to.
i just find it hard to believe that a person can get an award for supporting a taking part of an organization who makes to be highly moral and ethical, but is responsible for medical malpractice, covering up criminal acts like raping a 16 year old girl
and harassment campaigns on people who speak out. i personally have been stalked, threatened, assaulted, had people go around my place telling bogus crap about me to my neighbors, my personal info posted online a number of times, and even someone go on my youtube page and call me a sex offender, and thats just being nice. i have never seen this kind of behavior condemned by any other scientologist, only encouraged. and there is a lot of videos online of people get homes protested, accused of being drug dealers, child molesters, and being attacked by scientologist
If Tom Cruise did any of these things- I'd have a problem.
But it sounds like you're waging your wn personal battle with some individuals- and I hope you can find resolution.
O, for the record, not trying to pick or anything- your title-
Should Tom Cruise of been given a Humanitarian award at the Simon Wiesenthal Center's annual dinner?
I am pretty sure you must mean
"Should Tom Cruise HAVE been given" not OF.
It sounds like 'of', but is have.
and what else i've noticed was the work they are doing to keep people from reading critical posts, by replying to each other diving posts like that from someone like me down so people won't even notice or read it. my reason for speak out against scientology at first had to do with someone going to my place and threatening me just because i happened to be at a protest checking out what was going on, then as i learned more of hat they do to other people i decided to stay and try yo help them out from the intense harassment they got
Yes, they probably have admin on the job of censoring posts full time I bet.
Ah, that's a shame. I know they have some strong political pull in S.CA.
They were literally heading people out on buses- to sea I believe.
I'm a little familiar with their dianetics and methods.
It's odd. I think they play hard on people's emotional problems.
last year in LA there was a press conference with a number of ex-sea org speaking out about there experiences while in, here it is, all over 2 hours of it http://www.youtube.com/user/S...
but yeah, they will do a lot to push buttons and get you in punch them. i've had a guy in my face, insulting me the whole time, pushed me, and said i was harassing him.
Then they were herding people onto a schoolbus- I said to heck with this- and just took off.
It was pretty creepy.
I also experienced some of their dianetic propaganda-
L.Ron Hubbard was a really substandard writer any way.
Pushing buttons is their talent, I think. Or trying to any way.
You should ignore them as much as possible.
as for hubbards writings i've never read any of it so can't say if it's any good or not. but i can't care for it anyways so it doesn't matter.
and umm, ignore them, no. got to hit them up some how, and the more they say to me the better. got to figure out the behavior and catch them where they are lying about something.
They explained the hierarchy of their weird pseudo-naval structure to me.
I see, well- much good luck on your mission!
If ever I see any- I'll remember your name and find you.