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Should Child Protective Services be allowed to search your home without a warrant if no clear danger to the children is evident?

Assassin~ Badass Buzz Guru 2012/03/27 13:33:30
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Justices on the supreme court have refused to intervene in a case where deputies threatened parents with
the forced removal of their children unless they agreed to let social
workers, who did not have a warrant or probable case, search their home.

supreme court
Social workers received a complaint about the Loudermilks children being in Danger. TWO MONTHS after receiving the complaint they decided to do a search. The Loudermilks refused them entry, asserting their legal right to be protected from unlawful search. They did allow the social workers to speak with each of the children.

Unsatisfied, the social workers demanded entry to the home. Here s a description of what followed: “For 40 terrifying minutes, this
homeschooling couple had asserted their Fourth Amendment right to be
free from an unreasonable search of their home. The two investigative
social workers were eventually joined by six uniformed sheriff’s
deputies who were called because the social workers considered the
Loudermilks to be ‘uncooperative.’”

police invasion

It was social workers Rhonda Cash and Jenna Cramer who appeared at
the home unannounced and threatened to take the family’s five children.


“She (Cash) appeared to believe that her simple inability to
determine the children’s living conditions was sufficient grounds for
her to remove the children from their parents,” the petition to the high
court explained. That’s even though the social workers were allowed to
talk to the children to see that they were fine.


So Does Child Protective Custody have the right to search your home even after ascertaining that your children are unharmed?


Read More: http://www.wnd.com/2012/03/war-on-u-s-homeschooler...

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  • Anabellauxmal 2013/01/07 04:30:34
    No they shouldn't.
    Anabellauxmal
    I had kids in CPS the worker refused to give me visits first 6 months after they took them ,went on vacation, did not give me programs referrals i needed to attend rt
    to get kids back, even though there was a court order to give me visits, Afterwards she said I was crazy and she send me referrals when she confessed to me she did have for me a wrong address, Then long term took my tickets to go see them when I argued worker incompetency. they said I abandoned the kids in a house with 25 women and two supervisors, childcare workers in the shelter, CPS is just a business,,,
  • Annie~Pro American~Pro Israel 2012/04/03 06:35:36
    No they shouldn't.
    Annie~Pro American~Pro Israel
    NO!
  • Verbal 2012/03/31 13:33:16
    No they shouldn't.
    Verbal
    The issue is consistently speculative and abused by those with less than honorable intentions. Until Social Workers can remove themselves from this unfortunate manipulation, they need to obtain a warrant first.

    Or get met at the door with the same prejudice that the person blowing the whistle holds for the parent being investigated
  • splodge 2012/03/30 18:29:47
    No they shouldn't.
    splodge
    +1
    Social sevices do not have any right whatsoever to take children from their parents without authorizing the aouthorities and the justice system first. Besides, the police would have them arrested if they tuck children for without a seriously obligation.
  • Dana 2012/03/29 19:56:54
    No they shouldn't.
    Dana
    +1
    Apparently anyone can call CPS, and have you investigated. And you have to defend yourself. I understand that the law is loose so that that the children will be protected. But, many innocent people are dragged through the coals because some nutty neighbor or someone else w/ a grudge wants to cause the parents hell. So, I think yes, they should have to have just cause before they can search your home.
  • handeman 2012/03/28 06:57:51
    No they shouldn't.
    handeman
    +1
    Look up the 5th amendment
  • Assassi... handeman 2012/03/30 18:31:16
    Assassin~ Badass Buzz Guru
    +1
    Um the 5th amendment is the right not to incriminate yourself in a court of law.

    Unlawful search is the 4th amendment.

    Look that up.
  • handeman Assassi... 2012/04/02 22:16:51
    handeman
    sorry, missed that one
  • Pat 2012/03/28 06:30:39
    No they shouldn't.
    Pat
    +2
    No one has the right to enter my home unless there's a warrant. But, in cases where they have strong evidence that a child is in danger, that may not apply. Even the police can enter without a warrant if someone is in danger or if there's a fight or something. So, perhaps they did have the right if they thought a child was in danger.
  • Keeping It Real 2012/03/28 05:25:12 (edited)
    No they shouldn't.
    Keeping It Real
    +1
    There's so many reason why not but I will not go into it. no no no no
  • Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄ƷTisdragonflyƸ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ 2012/03/28 03:55:33 (edited)
    No they shouldn't.
    Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄ƷTisdragonflyƸ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ
    +1
    No, they need to take care of children who are actually abused and neglected and believe me they fail on this a lot. They need to put criminals and people who hurt children in jail the real ones. Not people who aren't bothering anyone. Some families are poor and love their kids dang it, like in my family but they have to work, and survive they don't have the things my cousins had two parents , two three big houses two cars, and a great life and lots of kin folk. Rich clothes , get real not every kid is born a silver spoon child. Leave children alone in good homes and work on the ones that are truly abused. Another waste of money and another bunch of nosy**** . Stay out of my home!....And mind ya own biz.

    .
  • Huntclan 2012/03/28 03:42:06
    No they shouldn't.
    Huntclan
    +1
    When my kids were little I heard of things like this circulating. I asked myself what I would do if CPS came for my children. I decided I would do everything in my power to keep them away from my children. Nobody is touching my kids.

    Now that they are teens, I wish CPS would come and take them away:)
  • La 2012/03/28 01:02:15
    Yes they should.
    La
    +2
    They can take your kids away for violence towards them OR for unsafe living conditions. How can they assess living conditions without checking the house? They must be there for a reason, ie someone reported that the parents needed investigating. If the house was fine, why wouldn't they just let the people inside to check?
  • Assassi... La 2012/03/28 01:32:03
    Assassin~ Badass Buzz Guru
    It was fine. The police searched and left and the children remained in the home. If the threat was imminent, then it shouldn't have taken two months to get there. Also, that is not sound reasoning. How will they ever tell if someone has crack in the house if they don't just go ahead and search. If they had probable cause they should've gotten a warrant.
  • CG La 2012/03/29 13:25:39
    CG
    +1
    What you fail to realize is that these people will show up at your door for any reason. Your neighbor may not like that your dog crapped on his lawn so he'll make a call just to stick it to you and then for the next year you have these home invaders destroying your life. Your children hear a knock on the door and panic thinking that today is the day that someone is going to come take them away, just because your dog crapped in the neighbors grass. I've seen it happen. I know it happens. These people have too much freedom. You have no rights when it comes to your children and they can remove your child simply because they disagree with your parenting. The vast majority of these complaints have no legitimate cause. Don't be so quick to give up your freedom. Once it's gone, it's close to impossible to get back.
  • La CG 2012/03/30 01:03:31
    La
    Just because they should be able to search your house doesn't mean they should be able to take your kids away without cause. We don't have a problem with kids getting snatched in my country :/
  • CG La 2012/03/30 01:06:36
    CG
    Didn't look at your profile so I didn't realize that you weren't in the US. In any case, they do have the right to remove your children here and there is close to nothing you can do about it.
  • La CG 2012/03/30 12:23:12
    La
    Yeah, I think I've heard a few stories about that sort of thing happening over there :/ Anything you can do about it?
  • CG La 2012/03/30 13:13:03
    CG
    Yeah. Make sure that you avoid anyone who could possibly become vindictive for any reason and turn you in. It's happened to me, my best friend, my sister in law and brother (though there's was legitimate) and a few others. Meanwhile the drug addict next door goes unpunished.
  • Assassi... CG 2012/03/30 18:33:58
    Assassin~ Badass Buzz Guru
    +1
    It is VERY unsual for parents to lose custody of their children. This case is the exception not the rule. Most parents that lose their children, deserved to lose them.
  • CG Assassi... 2012/03/30 18:43:05
    CG
    Losing custody and having your child removed are very different things. In 98% of the cases that DCF are involved in, the children are removed from the home and placed temporarily with foster care or a family member. That isn't the same as severing parental rights. You're right, it's extremely rare that they do that but it is extremely common that they remove the children from the home. When I went through my situation I spoke to an attorney and he told me that he was shocked that my kids were still in my home and it even used it as evidence that the allegations were false.
  • Assassi... CG 2012/03/30 18:44:58
    Assassin~ Badass Buzz Guru
    +1
    98% sounds very high.
  • Assassi... CG 2012/03/30 18:50:34
    Assassin~ Badass Buzz Guru
    +1
    Also in order to remove your children they need a court order and must prove grounds of neglect or abuse. I understand that its fairly rare.
  • CG Assassi... 2012/03/30 19:54:45
    CG
    You have to understand the differences in these cases. Just because a complaint is made doesn't mean that there is an active case. The complaint means that an investigator is coming in to see if there is cause to forward to the states attorney's office. The investigator will and can remove your kids if you refuse them entry or access to your kids. If you cooperate and they determine that there is no cause here then they will close it without forwarding it to the state but yes, 98% of cases that the investigator forwards to the state do result in the children temporarily removed from the home. And again, this is not the same as having parental rights severed.
  • CG Assassi... 2012/03/30 19:56:44
    CG
    And no, they don't need a court order. It is very easy for DCF to remove the children from the home. These families are destroyed without ever hearing a miranda warning until they show up in court and a judge decides if they can have their children back.
  • Assassi... CG 2012/03/31 13:25:40
    Assassin~ Badass Buzz Guru
    That is not true in the VAST majority of states. Also if they take them there has to be an imminent threat. Also you are allowed an emergency hearing within 48 hours. Hyping up fear of DCFS is wrong. One or two people experience does not equate to the majority.

    BTW you can refuse to have them even in your house LEGALLY. They need a search warrant. You may refuse them to search any PART of your house as well. For example. You may allow them in, but not into your bedroom. If there is no IMminent threat they MAY not take your children.

    Madam I would advise you to et a better lawyer.
  • CG Assassi... 2012/03/31 19:27:41
    CG
    I'm fully aware of the laws because I fought them completely. I went through the experience, my brother and his wife went through the experience and a very good friend of mine went through it. You're just plain wrong.
  • Honeybuns 2012/03/27 22:55:23
    Yes they should.
    Honeybuns
    +3
    I say yes because sometimes kids are really in danger.In people have good ways of hiding stuff like that. and if you have nothing to hide .Then you should mind child protective services searching your home.But some people do like their privacy and don't like people to be all in their business.
  • Assassi... Honeybuns 2012/03/28 01:33:02
    Assassin~ Badass Buzz Guru
    +1
    Thats nonesense. I have nothing to hide in my home regardless but I don't want the cops traipsing through it any time they see fit. Thats your fourth amendment right. If you choose to give that up, its up to you, but many would NOT make that choice.
  • Honeybuns Assassi... 2012/03/28 01:34:52
    Honeybuns
    +1
    Oh i did not know that was the fourth admendment now i change my mind.I would not let the police just come in my house for no reason and no warrant.
  • disclaimer 2012/03/27 21:36:36
    No they shouldn't.
    disclaimer
    +1
    Fourth Amendment. Enough said.
  • hayesml47 2012/03/27 20:30:17
    No they shouldn't.
    hayesml47
    +1
    Hasn't anyone heard of the Constitution?
  • Just Another Girl (5) 2012/03/27 20:21:58
    No they shouldn't.
    Just Another Girl (5)
    +2
    We have a constitutional right against unlawful search and seizure. They should have to have a warrant to enter any home unless they happen to hear or see something that gives them probable cause to enter without one and second hand information from an anonymous tip is NOT probable cause!
  • Assassi... Just An... 2012/03/28 01:33:36
    Assassin~ Badass Buzz Guru
    VERY disturbing.
  • Maria 2012/03/27 19:18:54
    No they shouldn't.
    Maria
    +1
    where is warranty? that's concept...
  • Mrkando 2012/03/27 19:08:35
    No they shouldn't.
    Mrkando
    +7
    Child protective services has a good and valid mandate in that they, at times, are the only defense children have against bad parents. However, that does not mean they should be above the law. If they believe they have a valid reason to insure the safety of children then they should always be required to get a court order. This requires proof that they have a valid reason for searching just like law enforcement are required to do.

    To assume that simply because they receive a tip from a neighbor that something may be wrong provides no basis for assuming it is true. If the parents would not allow even contact with the children, let alone, a search of their home then they may indeed have the provocation to continue their investigation but not the ability to go above the law and trample on peoples rights.
  • Assassi... Mrkando 2012/03/27 19:36:31
    Assassin~ Badass Buzz Guru
    +1
    Well Stated.
  • Mrkando Assassi... 2012/03/27 21:22:30
    Mrkando
    +1
    Thank you! :)
  • Shae 2012/03/27 18:47:31
    No they shouldn't.
    Shae
    +2
    Get the warrent unless you can plainly see immient danger.
    This case is BS. The social workers should be fired.
  • Assassi... Shae 2012/03/27 19:36:51
    Assassin~ Badass Buzz Guru
    +1
    Yes!!!

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