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Should Child Circumcision Be Allowed?

SodaHead News 2012/06/28 22:50:47
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Circumcision has been a religious tradition for many years, but has often been the subject of controversy because of the effect it could potentially have on children. On Tuesday, a German court ruled that child circumcision can be classified as "grievous bodily harm." The issue went to court when a 4-year-old boy began bleeding profusely as the result of a circumcision. Naturally, religious communities that practice circumcision are upset.

The court ruled, "[The] fundamental right of the child to bodily integrity outweighed the fundamental rights of the parents ... The religious freedom of the parents and their right to educate their child would not be unacceptably compromised, if they were obliged to wait until the child could himself decide to be circumcised."

In response, the head of the Central Committee of Jews said the ruling is "an unprecedented and dramatic intervention in the right of religious communities to self-determination ... [an] outrageous and insensitive act. Circumcision of newborn boys is a fixed part of the Jewish religion and has been practiced worldwide for centuries."

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  • xcheshirecat 2012/06/28 23:19:19
    No
    xcheshirecat
    +41
    religious freedom is about the baby's religion. I don't see how he can have one at that age...

    Baby have the right, like any other human, of body integrity

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  • Mamaknows SOUL4REAL 2012/06/29 06:55:05
    Mamaknows
    LOL I know:) I am in Cali after all the land of fruits and nuts...
    no all kidding aside we had a LOT of pressure to get it done with my son, and since we had him at home with a midwife our pedi was kinda pushing for it when we brought him in at his check up but we thought he was fine the way he is.
    And as long as he knows how to keep his body clean I do not forsee any health issuses (and he does not slut around) and have had none.
    My baptist side of the family were shocked...LOL my very Catholic MIL took it better then my side!
    I think it should be left to the parents...not the government to dictate although I think they will stick their noses in soon with bans and what not.
  • SOUL4REAL Mamaknows 2012/06/29 13:25:28
    SOUL4REAL
    +1
    You are absolutely right about leaving it up to the parents. One thing though,once he get older, men will be men,I hope for your sake he want be like most men when it comes to women. I agree with you about the government,they can't help themselves about putting their noses somewhere it don't belong. It was a pleasure speaking with someone who has some sense,have a wonderful day! :)
  • Rusty Shackleford 2012/06/29 01:45:05
    Yes
    Rusty Shackleford
    +3
    In America, we have freedom of religion. Of course I do realize that the progressives are working on ending that.

    They are doing the same thing Hitler did.
  • Joey Rusty S... 2012/06/29 02:02:45
    Joey
    +1
    Can a Muslim get their this done to their Baby girl ?
  • Rusty S... Joey 2012/06/29 02:06:07
    Rusty Shackleford
    +1
    As far as I'm concerned, yes. I respect parental rights and people's freedom of religion. Do you?
  • Joey Rusty S... 2012/06/29 02:08:38
    Joey
    +1
    Not when it comes to cutting up a baby . If someone who is older wants to get that done .. no issue . But it should be the choice of the person how is having the operation .
  • ☠ Live ... Rusty S... 2012/06/29 03:03:04
    ☠ Live Free Or Die ☠
    You're sick. Do you know what female circumcission does? The clit is removed and the labia are sown shut until the girl is married and her husband cuts them back open.
    I am for freedom of religion, as well. But not when it takes away the rights of individuals. You know, a lot of people's "gods" tell them to murder certain people. Should that be allowed? A Jew stoning an adulterer to death is just him practicing his freedom of religion, right?
  • Rusty S... ☠ Live ... 2012/06/29 11:33:10
    Rusty Shackleford
    I would never circumcise a child, but I respect your rights as a parent and will not tell you what to do.

    Why is leaving other people alone to live their own lives so offensive to other people?
  • ☠ Live ... Rusty S... 2012/07/07 01:56:51 (edited)
    ☠ Live Free Or Die ☠
    Child abuse is illegal. It doesn't matter WHAT the reason is. Scarring your child's genitals for life is child abuse, plain and simple. It's even worse if it's a girl child. It baffles me how you, or anyone else can support something so painful and cruel. I guess it's because you're a man.... You just don't get it.
  • Rusty S... ☠ Live ... 2012/07/07 02:15:47
    Rusty Shackleford
    So you want the right of decision to be taken away from parents and given to the government?
  • ☠ Live ... Rusty S... 2012/07/07 02:24:43 (edited)
    ☠ Live Free Or Die ☠
    As long as you're not beating, killing, raping, molesting, pimping out, exploiting, drugging and mutilating your child, or forcing them to do crime, you can do whatever the hell you want with it for all I care.
  • Rusty S... ☠ Live ... 2012/07/07 02:27:40
    Rusty Shackleford
    But you didn't answer my question.

    Do you want the power to decide whether or not your children are circumcised to reside with you, or with the government?
  • ☠ Live ... Rusty S... 2012/07/07 02:29:42
    ☠ Live Free Or Die ☠
    Yes, I did. As long as you aren't MUTILATING your children, I don't care what you do with them. Circumcision falls under that category.
  • Rusty S... ☠ Live ... 2012/07/07 02:32:01
    Rusty Shackleford
    OK, now that you have given the power to the politicians, what are you going to do when 0bamacare determines that it should be done for health reasons?
  • ☠ Live ... Rusty S... 2012/07/07 02:38:03
    ☠ Live Free Or Die ☠
    Well, I know some folks would eagerly stand in line for it, but I wouldn't let anyone get their hands on my crotch, or that of anyone close to me! But since that won't happen, I have to ask... are you saying, that if the government bans something, they'll also force you to do it at the same time?
  • Rusty S... ☠ Live ... 2012/07/07 02:42:33
    Rusty Shackleford
    I'm saying that if you give the power to the government instead of keeping it yourself, they may very well force you to do something against your will.

    I am advocating freedom, I do not want to interfere with your decision on what you do with your children. You obviously don't want to offer me the same courtesy.
  • ☠ Live ... Rusty S... 2012/07/07 02:48:59
    ☠ Live Free Or Die ☠
    Your freedom to swing your fist ends where other people's faces start. In this country, the rights of the individual to have life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness outweigh the rights of the parent and the rights of people to practice their religion.
  • Rusty S... ☠ Live ... 2012/07/07 02:59:36
    Rusty Shackleford
    Do I have the right to interfere with how you raise your children?
  • ☠ Live ... Rusty S... 2012/07/07 03:02:57 (edited)
    ☠ Live Free Or Die ☠
    If I am ever hurting or abusing my children in any way shape or form, then It is a sign that I am officially out of my mind. By all means, you have permission to put me and my hypothetical children out of their misery, and take me out!
  • Rusty S... ☠ Live ... 2012/07/07 03:04:46
    Rusty Shackleford
    You mean abuse that fits your definition of abuse, or abuse that fits my definition?
  • ☠ Live ... Rusty S... 2012/07/07 03:11:07
    ☠ Live Free Or Die ☠
    Abuse means to use (something) to bad effect or for a bad purpose; misuse. Or the improper use of something.
  • Rusty S... ☠ Live ... 2012/07/07 03:24:17
    Rusty Shackleford
    Ahh, so you get to determine what abuse is, I got it.

    Some people believe that indoctrinating children into religion is abuse. If I see you taking your children to church, perhaps I will have to "take you out".
  • ☠ Live ... Rusty S... 2012/07/07 03:25:44
    ☠ Live Free Or Die ☠
    LOL, if you don't agree with the definition of abuse, you can take it up with the dictionary, because I did not post what I thought abuse was, I posted what it is.
  • Rusty S... ☠ Live ... 2012/07/07 03:37:42
    Rusty Shackleford
    OK, if someone you know says they are going to circumcise their child, what are you going to do about it? Are you just going to sit by and let them do it?
  • ☠ Live ... Rusty S... 2012/07/07 03:39:19
    ☠ Live Free Or Die ☠
    All I could do was try as I could to change their mind, since the law isn't on my side...
  • Rusty S... ☠ Live ... 2012/07/07 03:57:28
    Rusty Shackleford
    You should be ashamed of yourself, allowing a child to be permanently mutilated because you are afraid of getting in trouble.
  • mikeeonly 2012/06/29 01:39:50
    Yes
    mikeeonly
    +3
    Yes, for hygienic reasons. Less maintenance. LOL
  • shotgun the 3rd 2012/06/29 01:38:23
    Yes
    shotgun the 3rd
    Its no ones Business but the families..
  • jason 2012/06/29 01:34:35
    Yes
    jason
    +2
    Question the state for injecting themselves into our lives. Buy rifles and ammo now!!!
  • ShamshirMkII 2012/06/29 01:34:06
    Yes
    ShamshirMkII
    +3
    So, cutting of an infant's foreskin counts as "grievous bodily harm"? Seriously, random German court, leave religious laws alone -_-'
  • Kidasha 2012/06/29 01:34:00
    No
    Kidasha
    +8
    Any surgery has risks and those risks should not be put on a child especially at a young age when the child has no freedom to speak for himself.
  • UnmitigatedJubilation 2012/06/29 01:28:43
    No
    UnmitigatedJubilation
    +9
    If someone wants to have a piece of skin chopped off then they can make an informed decision when they're older.
  • volley15 2012/06/29 01:27:55
  • Joey 2012/06/29 01:26:57
    No
    Joey
    +9
    Funny when people not of a Christian or Jewish faith do it to their females . It is seen as something so bad . Yet when someone from the West does it to a male it is ok. And before you say when it is done to a female it is worse. Yes in some cases .. no in others. There are different ways that they do this. I say don't cut on anyone until they can make the choice.
  • biggerman Joey 2012/06/29 03:40:10 (edited)
    biggerman
    Male circumcision and female circumcision are two entirely different things. Male circumcision simply involves cutting off some skin and exposing a sexually sensitive area of his penis. Female circumcision actually involves cutting the clitorus to prevent sexual stimulation. Please don't confuse these two issues. There is no legitimate comparison. Male circumcision can legitimately be regarded as hygenic and allows for normal sexual pleasure; female circumcision is done soley to control a girl's behavior and prevent her from having sexual interest and pleasure. Everyone mature adult on this site knows this but you.
  • Joey biggerman 2012/06/29 03:47:03
    Joey
    I love the argumentum ad populum, that you used there. So I should direct you this since you are misinformed a lot of the information that you just stated.

    Circumcision causes pain, trauma, and a permanent loss of protective and erogenous tissue ... Removing normal, healthy, functioning tissue for no medical reason has ethical implications: circumcision violates the United Nations' Universal Declaration of Human Rights (Article 5) and the United Nations' Convention on the Rights of the Child (Article 13)."
    Leo Sorger, To ACOG [American College of Obstetrics and Gynecology]: Stop Circumcisions, Ob Gyn News, 1 Nov. 1994, p. 8.

    After a two year investigation, the American Academy of Pediatrics(AAP) concluded that the "potential medical benefits" of infant circumcision aren't significant enough and therefore, they do not recommend it as a routine procedure.

    And this was the reason we started doing this in America

    "There can be no doubt of [masturbation's] injurious effect, and of the proneness to practice it on the part of children with defective brains. Circumcision should always be practiced. It may be necessary to make the genitals so sore by blistering fluids that pain results from attempts to rub the parts."
    Angel Money, Treatment of Disease in Children. Philadelphia: P. Blakist...



    I love the argumentum ad populum, that you used there. So I should direct you this since you are misinformed a lot of the information that you just stated.

    Circumcision causes pain, trauma, and a permanent loss of protective and erogenous tissue ... Removing normal, healthy, functioning tissue for no medical reason has ethical implications: circumcision violates the United Nations' Universal Declaration of Human Rights (Article 5) and the United Nations' Convention on the Rights of the Child (Article 13)."
    Leo Sorger, To ACOG [American College of Obstetrics and Gynecology]: Stop Circumcisions, Ob Gyn News, 1 Nov. 1994, p. 8.

    After a two year investigation, the American Academy of Pediatrics(AAP) concluded that the "potential medical benefits" of infant circumcision aren't significant enough and therefore, they do not recommend it as a routine procedure.

    And this was the reason we started doing this in America

    "There can be no doubt of [masturbation's] injurious effect, and of the proneness to practice it on the part of children with defective brains. Circumcision should always be practiced. It may be necessary to make the genitals so sore by blistering fluids that pain results from attempts to rub the parts."
    Angel Money, Treatment of Disease in Children. Philadelphia: P. Blakiston. 1887, p. 421.

    Here is some more information .

    http://www.circumstitions.com...
    (more)
  • biggerman Joey 2012/06/29 05:31:20 (edited)
    biggerman
    If the AAP does not recommend circumcision, that's their opinion and I certainly support the right of any parent to opt not to have it done. But the AAP is just giving a "recommendation." They are not urging the government to ban it or declaring it to be a harmful or dangerous procedure and, evidently do recognize some benefit albeit minor. That nonsense about masterbation wasn't even worth reading. I don't believe that the practice of circumcision began anywhere near 1887. It has been practiced by people in both Eastern and Western civilizations for centuries for various reasons.

    But, that still has nothing to do with the support of female circumcision which truly is barbaric and is nothing more than the attempt of an insecure male population to control its women. There is no comparison between the two.
  • Joey biggerman 2012/06/29 06:42:08
    Joey
    Before the late 1800s .. it was not really done in America on such a wide scale. You can say that you don't buy it, however I backed up my statement . And there is a comparison between the two. There are many different types of Female Circumcision . The most common type of female circumcision is removing the clitoral hood, this is a homologous organ to the male foreskin. While it is called skin.. the foreskin is not just skin. It has many nerve endings on it . And by taking that away you are taking away nerve endings. You end by saying that males want when to have this barbaric thing done . Did you know in many places it is the woman who thinks this should happen. Funny how people support things just due to cultural norms isn't it .
  • biggerman Joey 2012/06/29 07:11:45
    biggerman
    If you're trying to justify female genital mutilation, you are talking to the wrong guy. If FGM was what you are saying it is, I'd not have a problem with it. But we all know that it isn't.
  • Joey biggerman 2012/06/29 08:26:39
    Joey
    Look at the last line of what I wrote ..

    "I say don't cut on anyone until they can make the choice."

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