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Should a foreigner with a fake birth certificate and stolen identity social security number who usurped the presidency be prosecuted for espionage and other crimes, not impeached, because impeachment only applies to a U.S. citizen?

tncdel 2012/06/24 03:59:54
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The Rosenbergs were EXECUTED for far less serious espionage.
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  • Kaleokualoha 2012/06/24 06:20:36 (edited)
    NO [explain why not].
    Kaleokualoha
    +34
    Foreigner? Faked birth certificate? My, what an ACTIVE imagination. You might as well accuse Obama of being a Klingon spy, or claim that the moon landing or Holocaust were faked. No leading conservative is a Birther, which relegates Birtherism to the lunatic fringe.

    Obama is a Natural Born Citizen, in line with Black's and Congressional definition. NOTE: The Minor v Happersett claim is hogwash. For a detailed legal analysis, see http://www.obamabirthbook.com...

    The operative definition within the United States is: "Natural born citizen. Persons who are born within the jurisdiction of a national government" (i.e. in its territorial limits, or those born of citizens temporarily residing abroad). — Black’s Law Dictionary, Ninth Edition ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... ). It is similar to the earlier Black's Law definition: Natural born citizen. Persons who are born within the jurisdiction of a national government, i.e. in its territorial limits, or those born of citizens temporarily residing abroad. (Black's Law Dictionary, 6th Ed., 1991, p.1026) - http://people.mags.net/tonche...

    This is perfectly reflected in a 2011 Congressional Research Service report:

    "The weight of legal and historical authority indicates that the term “natural born” citizen would mean a person wh...






















    &

    Foreigner? Faked birth certificate? My, what an ACTIVE imagination. You might as well accuse Obama of being a Klingon spy, or claim that the moon landing or Holocaust were faked. No leading conservative is a Birther, which relegates Birtherism to the lunatic fringe.

    Obama is a Natural Born Citizen, in line with Black's and Congressional definition. NOTE: The Minor v Happersett claim is hogwash. For a detailed legal analysis, see http://www.obamabirthbook.com...

    The operative definition within the United States is: "Natural born citizen. Persons who are born within the jurisdiction of a national government" (i.e. in its territorial limits, or those born of citizens temporarily residing abroad). — Black’s Law Dictionary, Ninth Edition ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... ). It is similar to the earlier Black's Law definition: Natural born citizen. Persons who are born within the jurisdiction of a national government, i.e. in its territorial limits, or those born of citizens temporarily residing abroad. (Black's Law Dictionary, 6th Ed., 1991, p.1026) - http://people.mags.net/tonche...

    This is perfectly reflected in a 2011 Congressional Research Service report:

    "The weight of legal and historical authority indicates that the term “natural born” citizen would mean a person who is entitled to U.S. citizenship “by birth” or “at birth,” either by being born “in” the United States and under its jurisdiction, even those born to alien parents; by being born abroad to U.S. citizen-parents; or by being born in other situations meeting legal requirements for U.S. citizenship “at birth.” Such term, however, would not include a person who was not a U.S. citizen by birth or at birth, and who was thus born an “alien” required to go through the legal process of “naturalization” to become a U.S. citizen."
    - http://www.fas.org/sgp/crs/mi...

    NOTE FOR THOSE WITH IMPAIRED READING COMPREHENSION: Congress says that Natural Born Citizens include "even those born to alien parents"!

    Further, the State of Hawaii already confirmed Obama is a Natural Born Citizen (see http://www.usatoday.com/news/... ), and confirmed that both the short and long form certificates are authentic (see http://hawaii.gov/health/vita... ) . The State has also posted answers to FAQs regarding his certificate at http://hawaii.gov/health/vita... .

    [QUOTE]
    Hawaii Gov. Lingle answers the birthers, who remain surprisingly unconvinced

    Via Joe Kovacs, we have a fresh answer to the birthers from Hawaii Gov. Linda Lingle (R), given to -- of all people -- former Michael Jackson confidante Rabbi Shmuley Boteach. The comments come around 77 minutes into this interview, after Boteach asks Lingle about legislation that would protect state employees from having to answer the endless questions about President Obama's birth certificate.

    "You know, during the campaign of 2008, I was actually in the mainland campaigning for Sen. McCain. This issue kept coming up so much in the campaign, and again I think it's one of those issues that is simply a distraction from the more critical issues that are facing the country. And so I had my health director, who is a physician by background, go personally view the birth certificate in the birth records of the Department of Health, and we issued a news release at that time saying that the president was, in fact, born at Kapi'olani Hospital in Honolulu, Hawaii. And that's just a fact. And yet people continue to call up and e-mail and want to make it an issue. And I think it's, again, a horrible distraction for the country by those people who continue this. ... It's been established. He was born here."
    [END QUOTE http://voices.washingtonpost.... ]

    The "faked" birth certificate is a delusion, straight out of Right-Wing Fantasyland. Even Fox News reports expert opinion that the BC is authentic. See: http://www.foxnews.com/politi... ).

    NOTE: Fox's expert subsequently took issue with Fox's "authentic" claim, and posted “In my humble opinion, what I see about how the PDF is built does not prove any falsification. If there was tampering, we must look elsewhere and not how the PDF was created.” ( http://www.wnd.com/2011/06/31... ) Tremblay's double negative ("does not prove any falsification") may be reasonably interpreted as an endorsement.

    Coupled with a similar opinion from The National Review ( http://www.nationalreview.com... ), which also found no evidence of falsification, the consensus from leading conservative media is irrefutable.

    Birther inability to recognize this authenticity suggests they are schizophrenic. Their belief in a grand conspiracy to foist an ineligible Obama upon the nation suggests they are paranoid. Such paranoid schizophrenia is typical among the deluded denizens of Right-Wing Fantasyland (see http://kaleokualoha2878577.ne... ).

    The fact that ALL leading conservatives reject Birtherism indicates that Birthers are on the lunatic fringe, along with Truthers, Holocaust & AGW Deniers, and the Flat Earth Society.

    "All truths are easy to understand once they are discovered; the point is to discover them." - Galileo Galilei (1564 - 1642)
    (more)

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Opinions

  • V~POTL~PWCM~JLA 2012/09/01 16:05:33
    YES [comment as you wish].
    V~POTL~PWCM~JLA
    That's a very interesting question. Ordinarily, the only law enforcement applicable to a sitting President is impeachment -- culminating in removal from office after conviction in the Senate. But a non-citizen "impostor President" should not be exempt from traditional law enforcement (fraud, grand theft, embezzlement, conspiracy, espionage).

    This also creates a window of vulnerability -- after his term expires and before the statute of limitations runs out. Such an impostor could theoretically be sued in civil court for all of the expenditures he authorized while impersonating a President. It would be the biggest lawsuit in US history.

    The Obama administration is following the same pattern as the JFK assassination. The shadow government covers its track as best they can. People buy the BS long enough for the perpetrators to get to the next stage -- where nobody wants to discover the truth because it creates a problem that nobody can really solve.

    The Warren Commission crafted their own version of the assassination story to conveniently terminate any further search for the truth. Lee Harvey Oswald was deemed the sole assassin, and he was dead, so everybody goes home. This is exactly what you need to pull off a coup d'etat. But there was that pesky guy who film...



    That's a very interesting question. Ordinarily, the only law enforcement applicable to a sitting President is impeachment -- culminating in removal from office after conviction in the Senate. But a non-citizen "impostor President" should not be exempt from traditional law enforcement (fraud, grand theft, embezzlement, conspiracy, espionage).

    This also creates a window of vulnerability -- after his term expires and before the statute of limitations runs out. Such an impostor could theoretically be sued in civil court for all of the expenditures he authorized while impersonating a President. It would be the biggest lawsuit in US history.

    The Obama administration is following the same pattern as the JFK assassination. The shadow government covers its track as best they can. People buy the BS long enough for the perpetrators to get to the next stage -- where nobody wants to discover the truth because it creates a problem that nobody can really solve.

    The Warren Commission crafted their own version of the assassination story to conveniently terminate any further search for the truth. Lee Harvey Oswald was deemed the sole assassin, and he was dead, so everybody goes home. This is exactly what you need to pull off a coup d'etat. But there was that pesky guy who filmed the whole thing, and witnesses that wouldn't shut up about the grassy knoll.

    As the years went by, the official cover story fell apart. But it worked long enough to the point where nobody wanted to wrestle with the prospect of Lyndon Johnson as replacement President installed by the Mafia, FBI, and CIA.

    Today, we have Obama's mysterious birth certificate with bizarre issues (like the vital statistics codes). And then we have the Connecticut SSN that fails E-verify. These things are the modern-day equivalent of the Zapruder film -- troubling evidence that just won't go away. As time goes by, I expect a repeat of the JFK aftermath. In the future, people will look back at the Obama years, wondering why nobody acted on the clues available at the time.
    (more)
  • ChrisHollyMusic 2012/08/09 12:39:32
    NO [explain why not].
    ChrisHollyMusic
    America Street VOTE! http://youtu.be/PiPYv4NIOEg
  • dominic garcia 2012/08/02 20:25:40
    YES [comment as you wish].
    dominic garcia
    They need to do a thorough investigation on all presidential candidates. Perhaps they need to change regulations and rule. They should make it a prerequisite, that no one who, has or has had ties to radical muslims or terrorists be eligible to run for President. They should also make, passing a lie detecter test, a requirement. That way we will avoid our secrets from getting spread around the world, as if it was plain gossip! Now, if Obama is proven to have lied about who he really is, then he has to be charged according to our laws.
  • XENON23 2012/07/27 03:50:08
    NO [explain why not].
    XENON23
    I still think this is all fishy yet I know many that just scoff at the thought and think you mad it you say any of this might be the truth.
  • RED DAWN 2012/07/25 19:52:30
    YES [comment as you wish].
    RED DAWN
    +2
    Yes I think he should be prosecuted for useing fake ID.I really don't think he ever used his fake S/S card.I really don't think that nappy headed sob has ever had a public job him and his bitch has lived off the government most all their lives.
  • KilrQueen 2012/07/25 16:57:18
    YES [comment as you wish].
    KilrQueen
    +2
    Of course, if this person existed then they should be held accountable for their crimes.
  • Don Leuty 2012/07/25 16:31:25
    NO [explain why not].
    Don Leuty
    +1
    You are shouting at the surf.
  • D.C.Verdone 2012/06/28 18:28:09
    NO [explain why not].
    D.C.Verdone
    Seriously? Do you think, FOR A SECOND that the government would pass up a chance to flay someone out like that if it really was true? They would come out as the heros for catching him which all the more proves that this is a crazy accusation. I don't even freaking like they guy and I'm not so out of my mind to jump to a nut job conclusion like that. Damn people seriously need a new topic, this one is old and has been proven that he is in fact IS an american.
  • Jane 2012/06/28 02:37:56
    NO [explain why not].
    Jane
    +1
    If that should happen but I doubt it ever would.
  • MlssCue =Go Blue= 2012/06/26 16:10:07
    NO [explain why not].
    MlssCue =Go Blue=
    +1
    You are sadly mistaken.
  • Glfer65 2012/06/26 16:09:15
    YES [comment as you wish].
    Glfer65
    +1
    If we ever have one that is proven. Till then birthers need to let it go and lick their wounds. They can't get past the fact he is who he is.
  • Xerxes 2012/06/26 14:53:48
    NO [explain why not].
    Xerxes
    +1
    Well its an interesting hypothetical but since there IS no foreigner with a fake birth certificate and stolen identity social security number who usurped the presidency, its a pointless question.
  • Bastion 2012/06/26 14:10:46
    NO [explain why not].
    Bastion
    +2
    No, the world should NOT run in accordance with your meth delusions.

    meth delusions
  • Roger47 2012/06/26 14:07:31
    NO [explain why not].
    Roger47
    +3
    Because the evidence he has done anything wrong exists only in deluded right wing minds.
  • SilverWings 2012/06/26 11:49:24
    NO [explain why not].
    SilverWings
    +1
    Its simple. Your claimes have been defeated by the very evidence you use to support them. The facts of the evidence do not support anything you say but yet you refuse to accept it and therefore you should be procequted for treasion. At the very least you should be comepletely and utterly shunned.
  • polkastria 2012/06/26 09:19:48
    NO [explain why not].
    polkastria
    +1
    But hey.. sounds like a heck of a cheesy spy novel.

    The Borne Identity.. White House Invasion!
  • Harjot 2012/06/26 09:01:25
    YES [comment as you wish].
    Harjot
    +1
    Yes, if such a person were to exist. Are you thinking of anyone in particular?
  • FeelHood H. Obama~BN28 2012/06/26 07:49:29
    YES [comment as you wish].
    FeelHood H. Obama~BN28
    +2
    ...and twice on Sunday. I wholeheartedly agree.

    Good thing, this hasn't happened in America yet.

    Obama/Biden 2012!
  • Carl 2012/06/26 01:10:14
    YES [comment as you wish].
    Carl
    +3
    And those who helped him should be tried for treason.
  • none 2012/06/25 18:19:40
    YES [comment as you wish].
    none
    +2
    Sounds like a plan to me.
  • Wag 2012/06/25 15:48:03
    YES [comment as you wish].
    Wag
  • Steve 2012/06/25 15:20:24
    NO [explain why not].
    Steve
    +3
    The State of Hawaii vouches for the birth certificates. End of story on that.

    Lots of rumors abound about Obama's social security number, but it's not public and there's no hard evidence he falsely used a number.

    Lies and insane conspiracy theories amount to nothing.
  • MO.gal 2012/06/25 02:07:37
    NO [explain why not].
    MO.gal
    +4
    This birther crap is getting really old. Get over it! birther crap
  • DFA 2012/06/24 22:52:16
    NO [explain why not].
    DFA
    +1
    Conspiracy theories much?
  • ☆ElenaDiamond☆ 2012/06/24 21:01:58
    YES [comment as you wish].
    ☆ElenaDiamond☆
    If that were true I would agree. Personally I would just like to see him gone.
  • Kibbles 2012/06/24 20:55:27
    NO [explain why not].
    Kibbles
    +2
    Oh my mistake I wanted to click yes, I always hated that socialist Muslim Marxist who's sabotaging this great country for his overlords with a grand plan to destroy america!(heavy sarcasm if you couldn't tell)
  • Shadow13 Kibbles 2012/06/26 15:01:39
    Shadow13
    Be mindful of Poe's Law here. It is in full effect around this topic.
    http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/...
  • Brother Bo 2012/06/24 20:24:21
    YES [comment as you wish].
    Brother Bo
    For the deniers, consider that it took him over 2 years for someone to finally fake a birth certificate (which still has abnormalities) for him. You also have to ignore his grandmother who says she was in the hospital in Kenya with his mother when he was born. You also should consider that he has a social security number from a state where he never lived and that number fails the E-Verify test (due to the real holder of that number being long time dead)

    just sayin
  • aherbert 2012/06/24 20:09:00
    NO [explain why not].
    aherbert
    +8
    Birthers are the most ignorant humans in the world ... You people really need a hobby … the more you make idiotic comments about the President it only cements the fact that GOPers got to go … your reality is farfetched.

    http://badfiction.typepad.com...

    ignorant birthers
  • American☆Atheist 2012/06/24 19:34:19
    NO [explain why not].
    American☆Atheist
    +3
    What is your point?
  • Tresa 2012/06/24 19:28:37
    NO [explain why not].
    Tresa
    +2
    Didn't anyone tell you that things like that don't happen in the real world?
  • Dave 2012/06/24 18:59:57 (edited)
    NO [explain why not].
    Dave
    +7
    This polling is so funny! What is wrong with you Right Wingnuts? Give that weird crap up and go after Obama for his policies. OR - wait! It's easier to hate him when you don't have to think!

    Thank the Lordy Jesus! That when Mittens is elected president he'll be wearing his magical Mormon underwear.
  • Heptarch 2012/06/24 17:33:47
    YES [comment as you wish].
    Heptarch
    +6
    If that ever happened, they should be prosecuted to the furthest extent of the law. But since it hasn't your question is kind of silly.
  • jackolantyrn356 2012/06/24 16:18:59
    YES [comment as you wish].
    jackolantyrn356
    +1
    That is at least fake BCs and at least 3 Social Security Cards and the Media and the Congress have nothing to say about i=thisd????? Perhaps a revolution hat brings them all down and let us start over with the Constitution alone
  • flrdsgns jackola... 2012/06/24 18:11:38
    flrdsgns
    +5
    What is a revolution hat?
  • The Wro... flrdsgns 2012/06/24 18:47:04
    The Wrong Guy
    +10
    One with tea bags dangling from it, presumably.

    Is conservatism doomed to fail
  • Q flrdsgns 2012/06/24 19:02:59
  • mustangluver 2012/06/24 16:11:50
    YES [comment as you wish].
    mustangluver
    +1
    Of course! But first we have to find a judge and a prosecutor willing to take him on!!!
  • Shadow13 2012/06/24 15:40:30
    NO [explain why not].
    Shadow13
    +7
    Wow, someone is surely butt hurt due to the fact that the President is Black.
  • rustysh... Shadow13 2012/06/24 20:19:28

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