Should a 12-year-old go to prison for murder?

by L.A. Times Posted 2013/01/15 16:00:00

Related Topics: Nazi, Murder, Family, Boy, Guilty, Felony, Prison, Father, Court, Gun, Image, Neo-nazi

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	Yes	538 votes	39%
	No	856 votes	61%

A Riverside County judge on Monday found a 12-year-old boy responsible for murdering his neo-Nazi father, taking a swipe at both the family and social workers for failing to protect the troubled youngster before he felt compelled to reach for a gun.

"There were so many warning signs,'' Superior Court Judge Jean P. Leonard said from the bench. But the judge said the evidence showed that the Riverside boy, who was 10 years old when he pulled the trigger, possessed the mental capacity to know that killing his father was wrong. He plotted the murder and then tried to conceal his guilt by stashing the .357 magnum revolver under his mattress, Leonard noted.

Leonard found the boy guilty of second-degree murder and of using a gun while committing a felony.

+21

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Aqua Surf 2013/01/15 19:45:09

Yes

+20
Unless it's self defense, they are old enough to know right from wrong and serve a prison term. If they are mental, they should be put in an institution where they can be treated. Too many little punks are literally getting away with murder because of liberal laws and CPS sticking it's nose in the wrong places. Parents should also be held accountable for their childrens' actions. Having a killer, no matter the age, walking around is irresponsible and dangerous.
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More polls by L.A. Times

Lady Stardust 2013/02/05 23:43:29 (edited)

No

But he shouldn't be running around either. If he was mentally capable of knowing that right and wrong though, then he should go to juvy.

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WhereIsAmerica? ~PWCM~JLA 2013/01/21 00:22:16

No

He needs intensive psychiatric treatment, he sounds extremely damaged, jail will just make it worse..in that case might as well just keep him there if he does not get any help.

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KeriLynn 2013/01/19 07:45:40

Yes

When you're 12 you know right from wrong. You should know you can't murder people and get away with it. If they can murder their parents then they can sit there in prison. I don't think they should be in the cells with other adult inmates though

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Tina 2013/01/19 01:54:12

No

There's this thing called intensive therapy.

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GARY 2013/01/18 22:43:03

Yes

Age should mitigate not absolve. In some cases, absolutely. (This is only a generality. The judge and jury have the ulimate say in the case below, i.e. mental capacity, mitigating circumstances such as abuse and of course the child's age): case in Britain where two ten year olds tortured and murdered a four year old. I know they did time; forget how much thougth.

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democoach 2013/01/18 18:24:20 (edited)

Yes

+1
yes, it was premeditatded, not self defense. you cant just murder someone and get away with it

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Ahzz 2013/01/18 17:48:05

Yes

Juvenile Detention is prison. If a kid kills.. then yes, they need to go to a correctional facility.

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Embalmer 2013/01/18 17:45:35

No

+1
If the kid had the mental capacity to know killing his father was wrong, why did he hide the gun between his mattress?

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democoach to Embalmer 2013/01/18 18:26:02 (edited)

he hid the gun because he knew it was wrong and he wanted to get away with it, like any other criminal. if he didn't know it was wrong he would have posted it on facebook (maybe not but he would not have gone though any measure to keep what he did hidden), and he would not have bothered hiding the gun. your logic is flawed

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Embalmer to democoach 2013/01/19 14:36:15

No it's not. If I planned on killing someone I would hide or get rid of the gun in a place that wouldn't incriminate me. He didn't, he hid it under his own bed.

FaceBook? You're assuming he's stupid, obviously he's not THAT stupid.

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Bob 2013/01/18 17:17:30

No

+1
I like Singapore's punishment: caning these youth nowadays.

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Tom 2013/01/18 16:30:27

Yes

I suspect that beside the dead Dad and the son, the Judge may have the most knowledge about what really happened. And so I have to accept that he is right in his sentence and his criticisms.

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G'Ma 2013/01/18 16:27:30

Yes

+1
Here is where a trained school psychologist may have been able to spot problems this kid was having, but his moral compass was formed at age 6 or 7. Murder is murder and punishable by whatever remedy the local court has in place. If it's prison, off he goes! We will have to start building prisons for our younger population. Not juvenile detention and not adult detention but prisons appropriate for the younger criminal. Crime is crime. Juvie is too soft, adult is far too hard and downright dangerous. We need something in between.

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Chaya2010 2013/01/18 14:21:41

Yes

+1
There were two ten year old boys here in Britain that intentionally murder a toddler called James Bulger.

Children know right from wrong maybe not with all its implications. A child should know its bad and wrong to hurt, hit and kill. A general sense of good a bad in most cases.

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tikiteek to Chaya2010 2013/01/18 16:05:17 (edited)

+1
It is very dangeous! cause some children don't realize if you do certain things to a person they don't get up like a cartoon or a trained wrestler!

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Chaya2010 to tikiteek 2013/01/18 20:40:53

Its certainly true the some children may not understand the full implications of violence and there are no doubt incompetent parents. Dealing within the range of reasonable children and parents one can assume that a very young child will know right from wrong. Things like don't play with fire, don't speak to strangers, don't use bad language or hit are instilled well before ten and a twelve year old knows better.

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tikiteek to Chaya2010 2013/01/19 19:53:06

12 year olds also get the opposite from kids in school!

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mrdog 2013/01/18 11:32:35

Yes

Dead is dead....last time I check on it.... bark

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phil.olding.3 2013/01/18 10:45:02

No

A 10 year old shot his neo-nazi father.

Clearly, there were issues besides what's going on in this 12 year old's head.

Jailing this kid is unacceptable - he needs treatment and a loving family, not jail.

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tikiteek to phil.ol... 2013/01/18 16:08:21 (edited)

He may have been tired of being raped we don't know the whole story. Putting him in prison now would really make hi someone's wife!

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democoach to phil.ol... 2013/01/18 18:27:52

ah yes, the liberal mentality, thats why rapists get out of frickin jail after 4 years while someone who stole a movie off the web gets 25 years. SICK, and unjust

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rc.fowler.3 2013/01/18 10:26:50

Yes

+1
Anyone rightfully convicted of murder--should not only go to prison--but be executed!

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Manuel 2013/01/18 04:39:35

Yes

But he's white...so shouldn't they let him go? If they don't...well then life is getting fairer in America....but this is just another example of a white conservative family with guns in the house....when will the craze end?

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sglmom 2013/01/18 04:29:11

Yes

This one knew right from wrong ..
it was not self-defense either ..
it was a CONSCIOUS Decision ..
the notation was he PLOTTED this ..
then also DELIBERATELY HID the weapon too ..
(which was recovered)

MURDER is what he is ..
and he should receive sentencing to an ADULT Institution ..
There's nothing redeeming here ..

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Andrea 2013/01/18 03:16:38

Yes

YES and NO. If the Neo Nazi father was abusive to the child, then no. He has the right to defend himself. If the father was no, then yes.

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democoach to Andrea 2013/01/18 18:29:17

uh, you cant kill someone who has attacked you, unless you kill him in defending yourself against the attack.

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Andrea to democoach 2013/01/19 16:26:09

You can and people have and gotten off. It is called battered person defense.

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gregaj7 2013/01/18 03:00:21

No

+1
This "crime" is about the issue of the boy needing to remove a problem that no one else was willing to solve. His actions, including attempting to cover-up the "crime", wasn't about right/wrong or guilt/innocence, but was about knowing the perspective of those that would judge him erroneously for doing this. It is the "why" behind this that I find the boy "Not Guilty" of murder. This completely reads as though the municipal "ball" was completely dropped and forced the 10-yr-old's hand at what was done.

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Transman 2013/01/18 02:43:16

No

+1
Well........ on second thought, we have a 12 year old in the White House !

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AFRICAN_$WAG 2013/01/18 02:26:38

Yes

+1
Just beacause he/she is young, doesnt give them the right to murder people and get away with it.

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democoach to AFRICAN... 2013/01/18 18:29:57

+1
kids are a lot smarter then liberals think at age 12, they know whats right and wrong, they can make discisions, you are right

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Ken Bennett 2013/01/18 02:19:09 (edited)

No

+2
First! Putting a 12 yr old in prison is sick. That judge is sick and every single one of you that agrees with that sub human are sick and pathetic as well ! Very few people should go to prison. It doesn't work it serves only the rich and people that are a part of the parasite that is our criminal justice system. Putting a person in prison to fix their behavior is like parking your car in your garage for twenty years cause the brakes don't work. when you get it out the brakes will still be broken, and ti will have ten more critical problems too. Sick society we live in.

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democoach to Ken Ben... 2013/01/18 18:31:04

so what do you suggest? pay greedy "psycologists" to put killers or rapists back on the street just to do it again? no wonder our justice system is effed up.

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Tylurr 2013/01/18 01:29:04

Yes

+3
I understand that he's a kid, but a crime is a crime. Unless there was a history of abuse (And honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if there was) there's not much of an excuse for him to take his father's life. Even if he WAS a Neo-Nazi.

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Ken Ben... to Tylurr 2013/01/18 02:20:11

yes there was he was a neo nazi.. duh.

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Tylurr to Ken Ben... 2013/01/18 02:23:43

+1
So you're going to tell me free thought isn't encouraged? If someone wants to be an intolerant ass, the first amendment protects that.

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Ken Ben... to Tylurr 2013/01/18 02:37:14

Nope just saying I don't mind if anyone kills a neo nazi's. First amendment allows you to speak your mind. not inflict it upon other citizens. These are people that bend the minds of their children into thinking that a black man has less value than a white one. These are sub humans... bent on holding back our country. To hell with them all.

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Tylurr to Ken Ben... 2013/01/18 02:43:26

+1
You are allowed to say what you will, nobody can deny you that, but realistically, condemning them in such a way (e.g. wishing death on them) is about the same thing they do. Justified or not, it's still wishing death.

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Ken Ben... to Tylurr 2013/01/18 03:14:27

Then I am guilty... I don't care. Screw them sub humans. Some people just should not be allowed to exist much less procreate. I may very well be one of them. IDK but I have no christian fear of death nor need to protect the lives of people that have no other goals than making other people subservient because they have a different skin tone. Nor did I wish anyone dead. I just don't care if they all die. I bet they all feel exactly the same way about me.

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Tylurr to Ken Ben... 2013/01/18 03:15:45

Fair enough assessment.

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