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RON PAUL'S IGNORANCE AND NAIVETY REGARDING JIHAD

BlueMax372 2011/09/18 17:37:53

By Raymond Ibrahim

Earlier on Pajamas Media (via RaymondIbrahim.com) I discussed how Ron Paul appears to be ignorant and naïve when it comes to the goals of the jihad: ignorant because his statements are not based on accurate knowledge and naïve because he thinks they are – more to the point, because he takes al-Qaeda's propaganda at face value:

Among other qualities, a good presidential candidate must be knowledgeable and able to think outside the box; equally important, he must not be naïve or gullible — certainly not swallow everything the enemy says hook, line, and sinker.

During the recent Republican candidate debate, Congressman Ron Paul exhibited his ignorance and gullibility when the panel was asked "Do you plan to decrease Defense spending, to balance spending, or do you believe high spending is essential to security?"

After Paul explained how he was "tired of all the militarism that we are involved in," and his plan on cutting back, he said, "But we're under great threat, because we occupy so many countries…. The purpose of al Qaeda was to attack us, invite us over there, where they can target us…. but we're there occupying their land. And if we think that we can do that and not have retaliation, we're kidding ourselves."

This is, of course, an old and well known narrative.

Read More: http://www.jihadwatch.org/2011/09/raymond-ibrahim-...

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  • ol_crank_arm 2011/09/18 18:27:47
    ol_crank_arm
    +9
    I have to carry Dr. Paul's statement further, as he has in the past when his commentary isn't restricted to stop-watch type sound-bite fodder, to be later taken out of context.

    What is our own instinctive response when Islamists migrate here and take over local governments, schools and coerce police to treat them according to Sharia law, rather than under American law? We get pissed. Now, imagine they're heavily armed and barging into our homes searching out those of us who are especially pissed about their presence? You get the 'picture' a little more clearly?

    No, Dr. Paul isn't 'gullible' or 'naive'. He's correct. The truth is that the international bankeing cartel has us imposing their phony credit 'money' boondoggle on the Mid-East in order to dump inflated banknotes into those countries, so they won't push up prices in domestic markets. The 'Petro-Dollar' is a scam that exports price 'inflation'. That's why there's exhorbinate food prices and riots in those countries and why there have to be Euro-American military forces throughout the area ... to be sure the ever-increasing flood of those 'Petro-Dollars' won't stop inflating THEIR economies rather than OURS.

    Look, I grant that Islamic fundamentalists are repulsive neanderthals, but I won't let that contort my logic or...

    I have to carry Dr. Paul's statement further, as he has in the past when his commentary isn't restricted to stop-watch type sound-bite fodder, to be later taken out of context.

    What is our own instinctive response when Islamists migrate here and take over local governments, schools and coerce police to treat them according to Sharia law, rather than under American law? We get pissed. Now, imagine they're heavily armed and barging into our homes searching out those of us who are especially pissed about their presence? You get the 'picture' a little more clearly?

    No, Dr. Paul isn't 'gullible' or 'naive'. He's correct. The truth is that the international bankeing cartel has us imposing their phony credit 'money' boondoggle on the Mid-East in order to dump inflated banknotes into those countries, so they won't push up prices in domestic markets. The 'Petro-Dollar' is a scam that exports price 'inflation'. That's why there's exhorbinate food prices and riots in those countries and why there have to be Euro-American military forces throughout the area ... to be sure the ever-increasing flood of those 'Petro-Dollars' won't stop inflating THEIR economies rather than OURS.

    Look, I grant that Islamic fundamentalists are repulsive neanderthals, but I won't let that contort my logic or blind me to emotive brainwash intended to make a dupe of me. Disgust with Islamists isn't a reason to help the equally repulsive international bankers, who, if you haven't figured it out yet, already hold us in economic slavery.

    Rather than to keep us in the condition of having to pick our Master, Dr. Paul's intent is to free us from all Masters. He's the ONLY candidate for the presidency standing on that platform. He's the ONLY ... Liberty ... candidate.
    (more)

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  • angelbaby 2011/09/23 05:10:25
    angelbaby
    +2
    His views on this subject is the reason I don't want to see him as the GOP nominee!!
    It IS a fact that there are those who will seek to harm America and we need someone who clearly understand that..
  • STU~PWCM~JLA~POTL~AFCL 2011/09/19 05:50:56
    STU~PWCM~JLA~POTL~AFCL
    +1
    Had to read your link; your comments are redacted.

    Paul may not be wrong in a technical sense. Sunni radicals do in fact have a deep hatred of the fact that the US has forces in areas they consider holy. The issue is what to do about it. I agree with Paul that we are in too many places, and economic considerations demand that we at least for a time reduce from strategic (toppling governments) to tactical (reprisals) preparedeness. As examples, exiting Iraq and AFPAK quickly makes sense as we are not accomplishing anything. Iraq will become an Iranian satellite no matter when we leave, so we might as well leave now. AFPAK (the Taliban) cannot be defeated via conventional means - they are too dug-in in rough terrain for conventional warfare to eliminate them. A tactical nuclear strike would be the only option to defeat them, but that would result in massive, unacceptable collatoral damage.

    The opposite side of the coin is that total withdrawal from critical observation posts, overseas military camps, and seagates would pose an unacceptable security risk. The loss of intelligence, and potential for blockades and attacks against allies by radicals and Eastern block countries, poses too great a risk for a return to total isolationism. A blockade of the Persian Gulf by Ir...



    Had to read your link; your comments are redacted.

    Paul may not be wrong in a technical sense. Sunni radicals do in fact have a deep hatred of the fact that the US has forces in areas they consider holy. The issue is what to do about it. I agree with Paul that we are in too many places, and economic considerations demand that we at least for a time reduce from strategic (toppling governments) to tactical (reprisals) preparedeness. As examples, exiting Iraq and AFPAK quickly makes sense as we are not accomplishing anything. Iraq will become an Iranian satellite no matter when we leave, so we might as well leave now. AFPAK (the Taliban) cannot be defeated via conventional means - they are too dug-in in rough terrain for conventional warfare to eliminate them. A tactical nuclear strike would be the only option to defeat them, but that would result in massive, unacceptable collatoral damage.

    The opposite side of the coin is that total withdrawal from critical observation posts, overseas military camps, and seagates would pose an unacceptable security risk. The loss of intelligence, and potential for blockades and attacks against allies by radicals and Eastern block countries, poses too great a risk for a return to total isolationism. A blockade of the Persian Gulf by Iranian satellites is an especially serious potential threat. And sadly, our policy of taking down North African and Middle East secular strongmen, as corrupt and brutal as they are, will result in more Iranian satellites, and the possibility of a Mediterranean Sea blockade threatening European trade (Central Europe would attack radical Islamic states with a scorched earth policy, possibly leading to WWIII).

    The right answer is somewhere in the middle. Even former Defense Secretary Gates and Joint Chief's Chairman Adm. Mike Mullen agree that our greatest threat right now is economic, not military; we simply can't afford to go back to the "pre peace dividend" military spending level. I really think Dr. Paul is correct - we have to reduce, since we've bulked backed up (partway) after reaping the dividend. The question is how much.

    Stu
    (more)
  • DDogbreath 2011/09/19 03:37:43
    DDogbreath
    +4
    Raymond Ibrahim proves he is a clueless jerk confusing "defense spending" with "military spending" they are actually two different things. He sounds a lot like the Big government, tax and spend, to hell with the constitution, "conservatives" (self proclaimed) here on Soda Head.

    Ron Paul is far from clueless on foreign policy. He wants to change our bad policy to one that will benefit us. His policy will benefit everyone world wide with exception to the "military-industrial complex" Eisenhower warned us about.

    We are less respected as a nation being the aggressor in never ending military actions around the globe. We need to secure our borders first. Not doing so is nothing but stupidity, that has been perpetuated over the past SEVERAL administrations.
  • seriously 2011/09/19 03:26:50
    seriously
    +2
    We pay 400 bucks a gallon for gas in Afghanistan- you bet we can cut military costs while having a more robust defense. Maybe we should have listened to Ron Paul before 9/11 when he said our bombing and base building was going to stir up trouble we did not want or need to get a piece of.

    War mongering is a joke, just a way to take more of your money- its incredibly sad. It all goes to crony contracts at the cost of printing money which destroys the value of money you and your family has saved up. While inciting hatred of us- a lose lose situation unless you are one of the cronies.
  • easyeduri~PWCM~JLA 2011/09/19 02:20:36 (edited)
    easyeduri~PWCM~JLA
    +4
    Share


    Paul needs a history lesson. David Ben Gurion would have had given him one.
  • ☆The Rock☆ * AFCL* The Sher... 2011/09/19 01:26:24 (edited)
    ☆The Rock☆ * AFCL* The Sheriff!!
    +6
    Okay, but if Chinese foreign national were on our soil, telling us and demanding us what to do, how would Americans feel? I am sorry but these Muslim countries are not going to embrace freedom as much as we want them too! I mean if we ever have the UN patrolling our streets I will be targeting Blue Helmets.LOL...Sorry but the fact of the matter is we can not keep being the World Police and yes, we do meddle to much in other countries affairs..This must and has to stop!!
  • sobersouljah 2011/09/19 00:03:34
    sobersouljah
    +3
    ---"because he takes al-Qaeda's propaganda at face value:"---

    What propaganda is the writer speaking of?

    Supporting the perpetual war syndrome is to play the role of the bankers useful idiot while advancing their globalist agenda... There is much more going on here than can be seen on the surface,,, you won't see the truth on your color TV.

    Ignorant is to call Paul ignorant
  • Wolfman soberso... 2011/09/19 05:21:08
    Wolfman
    +2
    The propaganda that the writer speaks of is the "blame America first" attitude that Ron Paul embraces.
  • soberso... Wolfman 2011/09/19 12:45:41
    sobersouljah
    +2
    there is so much more to it than that, so to say blame America first is inaccurate.
  • Wolfman soberso... 2011/09/20 04:46:18
    Wolfman
    +2
    It is quite exact. Ron Paul blames America for 9-11, just as Iran and CODE PINK do.
  • soberso... Wolfman 2011/09/20 12:39:17 (edited)
    sobersouljah
    True or false - the U.S. gave Osama billions of dollars and trained him?

    True or false - in the letter Osama wrote to America he stated that some of the reasons for the 9-11 attacks was due to us occupying their lands, killing the people there, and destroying what they think of as holy land/temples?
  • Wolfman soberso... 2011/09/20 16:56:52
    Wolfman
    +2
    False and true.

    True or false - al Queda, Code Pink and Ron Paul all believe that the US should leave the Middle East.
  • soberso... Wolfman 2011/09/20 21:32:15
    sobersouljah
    The answer is true to the first question I asked - the U.S. did give Osama and the mujahideen billions of $'s and training so they would be more effective in fighting the Russians - a classic case of the unintended "blowback" caused from intervening... Osama was made by the U.S.A.

    Now to answer your question - Ron Paul and code pink = true
    Al Qaeda maybe not - they are using the same tactics they learned from us vs. Russia... They want us over there spending/wasting money.They want to kill U.S. soldiers, which is easier for them to do there than it is here. -

    The foreign policy you support makes for a weaker defense while allowing us to destroy ourselves from within. It is exactly what Osama wanted us to do.
  • BlueMax372 soberso... 2011/09/20 22:57:02
    BlueMax372
    I am most familiar with the bullsh*t presented in your first paragraph. The Mujahadeen was NOT al-Qaeda. Your historical narrative is, at its very best, MOST innacurate.
  • soberso... BlueMax372 2011/09/21 00:29:20
    sobersouljah
    +1
    Why do you call it BS? - What do I have wrong?

    bs wrong


    You are right, the mujahideen was/is not Al Qaeda - but Al Qaeda came from/out of the mujahideen.

    "Al-Qaeda has its origins in the uprising against the Soviet occupation of Afghanistan. Thousands of volunteers from around the Middle East came to Afghanistan as mujahideen, warriors fighting to defend fellow Muslims. In the mid-1980s, Osama bin Laden became the prime financier for an organization that recruited Muslims from mosques around the world. These "Afghan Arab" mujahideen, which numbered in the thousands, were crucial in defeating Soviet forces."
    http://www.infoplease.com/spo...
  • BlueMax372 soberso... 2011/09/21 21:36:04
    BlueMax372
    The "history" quoted by infoplease is at best disjointed. Al-Qaeda had its origins in the Muslim Brotherhood. You know, 0v0mit's buddies or cousins or whatever. The pic you present, presumably as evidence, cannot be trusted. What is the uniform the alleged bin Laden is pictured in?
  • soberso... BlueMax372 2011/09/24 14:23:29
    sobersouljah
    It's true that many Al Qaeda members, and 9/11 conspirators can trace their roots through the Muslim Brotherhood at one time. But this doesn't change the fact that the U.S. helped empower Al Qaeda when using the mujahideen to weaken Russia.



    You are right about the pic - who really knows for sure if it is Osama, it very well could be, or maybe it is not. I think the uniform is a Pakistan uniform... Hey, isn't Pakistan where Obama allegedly found and had Osama killed?
  • BlueMax372 soberso... 2011/09/24 15:48:58
    BlueMax372
    Any U.S. empowerment of al-Qaeda was at best indirect. OBL had a history of abject hatred of anything American. As for the uniform, it seems to me that it's reversed. The wings should be above the left breast pocket.
  • soberso... BlueMax372 2011/09/24 16:59:04
    sobersouljah
    - - "Any U.S. empowerment of al-Qaeda was at best indirect" - -
    EXACTLY!!!!!!!!!!!!

    I didn't say that the government tried to create terrorist, enemies, or people to attack us. It was an unintended consequence - it is a good example of what Ron Paul calls blow back
  • Wolfman soberso... 2011/09/21 03:32:58
    Wolfman
    The US did not give ObL $billions. Training - yes, equipment - yes, but $billions weren't necessary.

    al Qaeda supports Ron Paul's foreign Policy. We are beating the snot out of them.

    True or false? Al-Jazeera, and Iran's Press TV support Ron Paul.
  • soberso... Wolfman 2011/09/21 12:39:21
    sobersouljah
    Because our giverment lies to us, we may never know exactly how much our government gave them. Bottom line, moral of the story is the blow back that Ron Paul speaks of is proven to be valid...

    I will guess true - why is that bad?
  • Wolfman soberso... 2011/09/21 18:10:03 (edited)
    Wolfman
    The GAO knows.

    You do not think that having a foreign policy that agrees with radical Muslim newspapers is bad? I think it is very bad. Voting for Paul is the same as voting for Iran. You think that's a good thing?
  • soberso... Wolfman 2011/09/22 20:27:31
  • Wolfman soberso... 2011/09/23 04:30:51
    Wolfman
    Catch 22.
  • BlueMax372 soberso... 2011/09/20 22:53:53
    BlueMax372
    1. False.
    2. True
    3. So what?
  • WannaBeRSC the Contrarian SOB 2011/09/18 23:58:04
    WannaBeRSC the Contrarian SOB
    +8
    Max, I love you like a Brother, but I will not be voting for a typical "republican" again, if indeed we are allowed to vote at all in 2012 (that is no longer a given, imho).
    I have noticed that, my votes for the lessor of two evils has propagated evil all across the face of this world. Looking through the facades of the various "top tier" candidates leads me to but one conclusion;
    Only Ron Paul has a 30+ (thirty +) year record of standing for the Constitution. No one else has that record, nor comes close.
    I have withdrawn my support from the "Empire", and make public my support for my Constitutional Republic. Nothing else holds any value to me.
  • BlueMax372 WannaBe... 2011/09/19 00:02:27
    BlueMax372
    +3
    WB, don't shoot the messenger. I threw this out there for debate and comment and to inform. I'm still supporting Bachmann for the primaries, but we'll see where it goes. I'm not yet ready to go to war, except to say Romney and Huntsman are totally unacceptable.
  • ☆The Ro... BlueMax372 2011/09/19 01:30:02
    ☆The Rock☆ * AFCL* The Sheriff!!
    +2
    And I am sorry but I can not stand the CFR, Bilderberg puppet, Perry either! I am really considering Bachman as well!
  • BlueMax372 ☆The Ro... 2011/09/19 01:39:00
    BlueMax372
    +3
    LOL! Santorum just went to my "Unacceptable Under Any Circumstances" list a few minutes ago! I love Bachmann.
  • ☆The Ro... BlueMax372 2011/09/19 01:44:06
    ☆The Rock☆ * AFCL* The Sheriff!!
    +2
    Me too I just I wish she would of not supported the Patriot Act!
  • BlueMax372 ☆The Ro... 2011/09/19 02:12:07
    BlueMax372
    +3
    I'm not sure if she was in Congress for the original act but I know she supported its 4-year extension this year, as did, by the way, Allen West. My concern with the act is not its constitutionality but rather its potential for abuse by the current regime. But then, Rock, we're not electing a Pope, we're electing a president, so we might not agree with EVERYTHING they think or have ever done! I'm waiting to see what Palin might do, and I think I might have a handle on it! LOL!
  • WannaBe... BlueMax372 2011/09/19 11:58:59
    WannaBeRSC the Contrarian SOB
    +1
    Understood.
  • DDogbreath WannaBe... 2011/09/19 03:40:06
    DDogbreath
    +2
    Well said.
  • WannaBe... DDogbreath 2011/09/19 11:59:23
    WannaBeRSC the Contrarian SOB
    +1
    Thank you, DD.
  • Ken 2011/09/18 23:36:28
    Ken
    +4
    Ignorant fool.
  • Chris 2011/09/18 21:42:14
    Chris
    +2
    good article, go vote in 2012 for Ron Paul!

  • nightlight 2011/09/18 20:55:14
    nightlight
    +3
    Raymond Ibrahim says it better than I could so here is his article that he posted on www.jihadwatch.org:

    Raymond Ibrahim: Ron Paul's Ignorance and Naivety Regarding Jihad



    Earlier on Pajamas Media (via RaymondIbrahim.com) I discussed how Ron Paul appears to be ignorant and naïve when it comes to the goals of the jihad: ignorant because his statements are not based on accurate knowledge and naïve because he thinks they are – more to the point, because he takes al-Qaeda's propaganda at face value:

    Among other qualities, a good presidential candidate must be knowledgeable and able to think outside the box; equally important, he must not be naïve or gullible — certainly not swallow everything the enemy says hook, line, and sinker.

    During the recent Republican candidate debate, Congressman Ron Paul exhibited his ignorance and gullibility when the panel was asked "Do you plan to decrease Defense spending, to balance spending, or do you believe high spending is essential to security?"

    After Paul explained how he was "tired of all the militarism that we are involved in," and his plan on cutting back, he said, "But we're under great threat, because we occupy so many countries…. The purpose of al Qaeda was to attack us, invite us over there, where they can target us…. but we're th...




















    Raymond Ibrahim says it better than I could so here is his article that he posted on www.jihadwatch.org:

    Raymond Ibrahim: Ron Paul's Ignorance and Naivety Regarding Jihad



    Earlier on Pajamas Media (via RaymondIbrahim.com) I discussed how Ron Paul appears to be ignorant and naïve when it comes to the goals of the jihad: ignorant because his statements are not based on accurate knowledge and naïve because he thinks they are – more to the point, because he takes al-Qaeda's propaganda at face value:

    Among other qualities, a good presidential candidate must be knowledgeable and able to think outside the box; equally important, he must not be naïve or gullible — certainly not swallow everything the enemy says hook, line, and sinker.

    During the recent Republican candidate debate, Congressman Ron Paul exhibited his ignorance and gullibility when the panel was asked "Do you plan to decrease Defense spending, to balance spending, or do you believe high spending is essential to security?"

    After Paul explained how he was "tired of all the militarism that we are involved in," and his plan on cutting back, he said, "But we're under great threat, because we occupy so many countries…. The purpose of al Qaeda was to attack us, invite us over there, where they can target us…. but we're there occupying their land. And if we think that we can do that and not have retaliation, we're kidding ourselves."

    This is, of course, an old and well known narrative.

    By questioning Paul, however, Rick Santorum exposed the latter's problematic foreign policy approach:

    On your [Paul's] Web site on 9/11, you had a blog post that basically blamed the United States for 9/11. On your Web site, yesterday, you said that it was our actions that brought about the actions of 9/11. Now, Congressman Paul, that is irresponsible. The president of the United States — someone who is running for the president of the United States in the Republican Party should not be parroting what Osama bin Laden said on 9/11. We should have — we are not being attacked and we were not attacked because of our actions. We were attacked, as Newt [Gingrich] talked about, because we have a civilization that is antithetical to the civilization of the jihadists [full transcript here].

    After rejecting Santorum's thesis, Paul made his fatal blunder:

    Osama bin Laden and al Qaeda have been explicit — they have been explicit, and they wrote and said that we attacked America because you had bases on our holy land in Saudi Arabia, you do not give Palestinians fair treatment, and you have been bombing – [audience booing] I didn't say that. I'm trying to get you to understand what the motive was behind the bombing.

    This exchange clearly revealed Paul's lack of knowledge concerning the nature of the enemy. It's one thing for some Americans to believe that the source of all conflict is the United State's presence in some countries, it's quite another for a potential president to think, and speak, this way.

    Ironically, Paul even contradicted himself: minutes earlier, when discussing the need to cut back on the military, he complained that we had a military presence in 130 countries — bringing to mind the question: if U.S. military presence is the source of problems, why haven't these countries lashed out?

    But what's worse is Paul's naivety — that he would actually swallow and regurgitate verbatim the propaganda al-Qaeda has been dishing for years, to wit, "Osama bin Laden and al Qaeda have been explicit — they have been explicit, and they wrote and said"; and "I'm trying to get you to understand what the motive was behind the bombing."

    Did it ever occur to the Congressman that al-Qaeda could be, um, lying?...


    Posted by Raymond on September 17, 2011 11:30 AM
    (more)
  • Wolfman nightlight 2011/09/19 05:16:35
    Wolfman
    +1
    The Paul-zombies will never read this.
  • nightlight Wolfman 2011/09/27 03:49:43
    nightlight
    +1
    You are probably right. Isn't it sad how, once a person has accepted an idea or belief, it is extremely difficult to get them to change their mind about that idea or belief no matter how much irrefutable evidence one piles up in front of them that proves beyond a shadow of a doubt that their idea or belief is a fallacy? Sad how some peoples' minds work almost like a write once CD.
  • dubbie 2011/09/18 20:17:20
    dubbie
    +4
    To brush off the threats from Iran as nothing to worry about is insane as they are . These phys-co`s mean everything they are saying and given the oppurtunity they will do what they are saying.
    This jester of releasing the hostages is just another ploy to buy time to continue their quest to destroy Isreal and the west if possible . To take their threats lightly would be a grave mistake in my opinion

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