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On day of contempt vote Eric Holder skips town, heads to Disneyworld

Quietman ~PWCM~JLA 2012/06/28 20:50:52

On the day in which the U.S. House of Representatives has determined that Attorney General Eric Holder’s actions are egregious enough to warrant a criminal contempt vote, the AG has skipped town and headed to … Disneyworld.


According to the National Journal’s Daybook, Holder will be addressing the League of United Latin American Citizens (LULAC) during a convention at a Disneyworld Resort in Lake Buena Vista, Florida.


Members of Congress will decide in a series of contempt votes whether Attorney General Holder will be held in contempt of Congress for his refusal to turn over a substantial number of the documents related to the Fast and Furious scandal that caused the death of U.S. Border Patrol Agent Brian Terry.


Last week, Obama claimed executive privilege on the documents related to the Fast and Furious Investigation, a move that has angered many Americans and indicated the possibility of a cover-up.

Read More: http://redalertpolitics.com/2012/06/28/on-day-of-c...

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  • sglmom 2012/06/28 21:37:42
    sglmom
    +9
    I'm sorry ..
    Can't help laughing ...
    (wasn't there enough 'Mickey-Mouse-ing' around in his office .. now he's got to go to the Corporate Fantasy Land?)

    This is par for the course ..
    doesn't matter the locale ..
    "Mickey-Mouse"-ing around .. is what Holder as DoJ does best ..

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  • Edwin 2012/07/06 05:10:53
    Edwin
    Why would he stay in town? The vote was pretty much along NRA lines (those districts controlled by the NRA voted yes, the rest voted no).

    The committee members didn't admit that. Instead they said they were holding him in contempt because Obama had a secret anti-gun agenda (they really said that). The agenda was clearly hidden because Obama has never put forth ANY anti-gun legislation or anti-gun executive orders... but somehow the committee *knew* Obama and Holder were in on a hidden agenda against gun owners... so they inferred that the purpose of Fast & Furious was to make gun ownership look bad.

    I am not making this up -- I saw it on a LIVE interview on CNN with a committee member. My jaw dropped when he said this. They believed Holder had done nothing wrong -- he said that, too -- but they were holding him in contempt anyways -- not because he did anything wrong but because he had never *told* them he had done nothing wrong.

    It was very mixed up and confused. Maybe it was a bad day for that Congressman. But he should have had SOME kind of clearer reason to have pushed for this vote.

    So... it was a witch hunt. Why would Holder stay in town?
  • Quietma... Edwin 2012/07/06 15:21:46
    Quietman   ~PWCM~JLA
    Wanting to know about a program that got a US border agent killed is witch hunt?! Right, you moron libs are such hypocrites. If this had happened during the Bush years you'd be screaming bloody murder!
  • Edwin Quietma... 2012/07/06 16:30:24
    Edwin
    Remember: guns don't kill people -- people kill people... this is a very significant position by the NRA.

    Further, THINK about it. If that particular gun had not been available to the thugs, do you really think they would not have gotten others? The main reason we do not restrict gun ownership in the United States is because conservatives point out that criminals have easy access to guns already. So... if this gun HAD been confiscated, it would not have kept the agent from being shot.

    But... you should understand how Fast & Furious actually worked before spewing. Here is the main synopisis:

    Arizona laws prevent the federal government (ATF) from confiscating weapons during most raids. That's right -- state laws make it illegal for the ATF to actually take the weapons from criminals.

    So... Fast & Furious was designed to *track* the guns they could not confiscate: since they could not legally take the guns, the ATF figured they could do research on where the guns went.

    Some agent screwed up once, and let some guns go that *could* have been confiscated. This happened once, by mistake. It was not by plan -- in fact, the plan had always been to confiscate when possible. Research by conservative journalists has indicated this happened exactly once.

    Guns from that mistake did get aw...



    &

    &

    &

    Remember: guns don't kill people -- people kill people... this is a very significant position by the NRA.

    Further, THINK about it. If that particular gun had not been available to the thugs, do you really think they would not have gotten others? The main reason we do not restrict gun ownership in the United States is because conservatives point out that criminals have easy access to guns already. So... if this gun HAD been confiscated, it would not have kept the agent from being shot.

    But... you should understand how Fast & Furious actually worked before spewing. Here is the main synopisis:

    Arizona laws prevent the federal government (ATF) from confiscating weapons during most raids. That's right -- state laws make it illegal for the ATF to actually take the weapons from criminals.

    So... Fast & Furious was designed to *track* the guns they could not confiscate: since they could not legally take the guns, the ATF figured they could do research on where the guns went.

    Some agent screwed up once, and let some guns go that *could* have been confiscated. This happened once, by mistake. It was not by plan -- in fact, the plan had always been to confiscate when possible. Research by conservative journalists has indicated this happened exactly once.

    Guns from that mistake did get away, were they were purchased/stolen, etc. and ended up in the hands of the criminals who killed the agent.

    But again, if those guns had been confiscated, the criminals would have acquired guns another way, and the agent would still have been shot.

    The REAL HYPOCRITES here are the NRA, who have denied any involvement in this fiasco, and who have pushed the contempt vote along, even knowing that Holder and Fast & Furious were not to blame for the agent's death. The ones to blame were the Arizona legislature for their laws protecting criminals who own stashes of guns... and the lobbies who pushed them to pass the legislation.

    Many of the republicans who voted for contempt knew that Holder and F&F were not to blame but pushed it anyways, to score political points. That is pretty rotten, too -- but not really worse than democrats have done in similar situations. In America, that is politics as usual.

    But an agent died, and the really bad part of this is that instead of focusing on the REAL reason for it (lax laws), the republicans are focusing on Holder. This is brilliant strategy by the NRA, who would lose big time if the country started really noticing. But even though mainstream media picked up the conservative research exonerating F&F, the country as a whole doesn't care. And conservative bloggers don't like research that contradicts their positions, so they don't care about the facts, either.

    It is ironic that conservatives are slamming a conservative magazine because it wrote uncomfortable truths. But not surprising (and probably no different that what liberals might do in a similar situation).
    (more)
  • Quietma... Edwin 2012/07/06 16:47:45
    Quietman   ~PWCM~JLA
    The point is what the Obama administration was doing is ILLEGAL!! Try dealing in REALITY!!
  • Edwin Quietma... 2012/07/08 21:24:26
    Edwin
    Where did you get the fact that it was illegal? It wasn't illegal -- and Congress does not think so. They just wanted to know how it screwed up.
  • Quietma... Edwin 2012/07/09 15:26:55
    Quietman   ~PWCM~JLA
    Allowing guns be to moved across the border into Mexico is illegal. As stated above, try dealing with reality!
  • Edwin Quietma... 2012/07/09 16:39:05
    Edwin
    Allowing guns to be moved across the border is actually legal when Arizona law prevents the ATF from confiscating them...

    and because of the laws, *stopping* the guns would have been illegal. There was exactly one screw-up, where guns could have been stopped but weren't. The rest were cases where the guns could not have been taken away without violating Arizona law.

    Even the feds are not above state law, so they could not stop the guns without breaking laws.
  • Quietma... Edwin 2012/07/09 16:43:50
    Quietman   ~PWCM~JLA
    Your BS spin doesn't change the truth. Now don't go away mad just go away!
  • Edwin Quietma... 2012/07/10 00:23:00
    Edwin
    I'm not mad. And I got my information from a very reliable CONSERVATIVE news magazine that did extensive interviews and research. They concluded that the hype about F&F is wrong.

    I'm sorry if the facts this magazine uncovered don't fit into what you had heard was true. I wouldn't be surprised if you dismissed the Fortune article -- many conservatives have criticized it for using facts to defend Fast and Furious -- but it would be hard for you to really justify that position.

    The article is based on large amounts of data. It concludes that of the two cases were the ATF supposedly encouraged guns to go into the hands of criminals, one was false (the primary witness gave two completely contradictory accounts of what happened, but the secondary witnesses all corroborate the actions of the ATF), and the other did not actually occur (it was a phone conversation encouraging a single sale -- because the ATF believed they could bust the criminal later -- and no sale ultimately occurred).

    I do not expect you to believe me. I do not expect you to even read the article. You will claim I am either spinning BS or ignoring the truth.

    The truth is this: the ATF ran a program, F&F, very similar to one run under Bush II. The program embarrassed the NRA. One of the tagged guns ended up in the...



    I'm not mad. And I got my information from a very reliable CONSERVATIVE news magazine that did extensive interviews and research. They concluded that the hype about F&F is wrong.

    I'm sorry if the facts this magazine uncovered don't fit into what you had heard was true. I wouldn't be surprised if you dismissed the Fortune article -- many conservatives have criticized it for using facts to defend Fast and Furious -- but it would be hard for you to really justify that position.

    The article is based on large amounts of data. It concludes that of the two cases were the ATF supposedly encouraged guns to go into the hands of criminals, one was false (the primary witness gave two completely contradictory accounts of what happened, but the secondary witnesses all corroborate the actions of the ATF), and the other did not actually occur (it was a phone conversation encouraging a single sale -- because the ATF believed they could bust the criminal later -- and no sale ultimately occurred).

    I do not expect you to believe me. I do not expect you to even read the article. You will claim I am either spinning BS or ignoring the truth.

    The truth is this: the ATF ran a program, F&F, very similar to one run under Bush II. The program embarrassed the NRA. One of the tagged guns ended up in the hands of thugs who murdered a federal agent. And there is no evidence that the tagged guns could have been stopped at the border, though the republicans in Congress got very upset.

    If you read the committee reports, though, you will discover that they do not claim or even believe that Holder authorized, knew, or was involved in anything illegal. This is from their own reports. Nobody in Washington believes that Holder did anything illegal.

    Why do you? Do you have more evidence than they do?
    (more)
  • CHUCK 2012/06/29 23:45:54
    CHUCK
    +1
    MY CAT IS HEADED FOR DISNEY WORLD ALSO..
    CAT KNITTING
  • OPOA912 2012/06/29 14:34:04
    OPOA912
    +1
    How fitting, one Mickey Mouse meets another.
  • Arizona1950 2012/06/29 13:02:48
    Arizona1950
    +1
    We should never settle for less than ALL of the truth ...

  • D Hanes 2012/06/29 02:39:10
    D Hanes
    +1
    That's exactly where that gorilla belongs. What a fool!
  • Temlakos~POTL~PWCM~JLA~☆ 2012/06/29 02:30:47
    Temlakos~POTL~PWCM~JLA~☆
    +4
    How appropriate. Fantasyland.
  • Prairie Wind 2012/06/29 02:26:19
    Prairie Wind
    +3
    Why didn't the House Sergeant-At-Arms place him under arrest? Holder was found in criminal contempt!
  • KrSpo Prairie... 2012/06/29 03:25:40
    KrSpo
    +2
    Because a contempt order from Congress only has political ramifications, unless it is forwarded to the US Attorney of Dc, to send to grand jury. Holding him in Contempt without a Grand Jury finding of True Bill, and then a Civil or Criminal trial is basically saying you're a baaaaaad boy Mr Holder...
  • beachbum KrSpo 2012/06/29 10:24:54
    beachbum
    Thnx for the clarification on that........I wasn't sure what happened next.
  • Prairie... KrSpo 2012/06/29 20:44:59
    Prairie Wind
    +1
    It's not over yet and the precedence already exists.
  • KrSpo Prairie... 2012/06/29 21:46:38
    KrSpo
    Unless they go to the Grand Jury, it is over. We'll see what they do.
  • Prairie... KrSpo 2012/06/29 21:48:50
    Prairie Wind
    Yes, we will.
  • Quietma... KrSpo 2012/06/29 21:51:57
    Quietman   ~PWCM~JLA
    Will the House arrest Holder with inherent contempt power?
    http://www.sodahead.com/unite...
  • KrSpo Quietma... 2012/07/01 16:05:53
    KrSpo
    I read up on the contempt proceedings. Even if they want to, it is going to be terribly hard for them to do it. They do not even have a jail, the SCOTUS is unlikely to set a precedent for this through their docket, and they can only delve out punishment to be served until Congressional session is over.
  • CHUCK KrSpo 2012/06/29 23:47:19
    CHUCK
    GREAT KNOWLEDGE.. THANKS

    CAT KNITTING
  • Kat ♪ ~BTO-t-BCRA-F~ ♪ 2012/06/29 02:26:06
    Kat ♪ ~BTO-t-BCRA-F~ ♪
    +3
    He is contempt, his picture should be in the dictionary as a definition.
  • Ozzyboy 2012/06/29 01:33:37
    Ozzyboy
    +5
    When the vote was being taken on the contempt charge, it's too bad that the Pissylousy led gang that walked out didn't just keep walking. What an insult to Brian Terry's family.
  • WhereIsAmerica? ~PWCM~JLA 2012/06/29 01:10:18
    WhereIsAmerica? ~PWCM~JLA
    +4
    Holder is a creep.
  • PoliticallyIncorrect 2012/06/29 00:18:06
    PoliticallyIncorrect
    +6
    Basically what we have is the AG, a POTUS, Nancy Pigleosi, and the black caucus telling the Terry family to go to hell. I agree with Mr. Terry. If there's nothing to hide let them see the documents. Just because the DOJ including Holder have already been caught in two lies, doesn't mean that there's anything bad. Yeah right. It could all be a power play from the Bitter Twins, Holder and Obamass. They both have an arrogance about them that refuses to accept criticism or questioning.
  • Bob DiN 2012/06/28 23:32:30
    Bob DiN
    +5
    Holder is always in FantasyLand.
  • A Founding Father 2012/06/28 23:29:17
    A Founding Father
    After the circus in Washington by Pluto and Issa, perhaps Disneland will seem like a
    place filled with sane and sound people?
  • fuzzy K... A Found... 2012/06/29 13:11:39 (edited)
    fuzzy Ken "In G*d We Trust"
    +1
    Yeah! Who cares about the hundreds of brown people and one Federal Agent who were killed by guns we supplied to vicious killers?
  • A Found... fuzzy K... 2012/06/29 21:35:03 (edited)
    A Founding Father
    The NRA has told you a thousand times over that "GUNS DO NOT KILL PEOPLE, PEOPLE KILL PEOPLE". What don't you understand or believe about this? Or,
    perhaps, such tings are different in Mexico than in the U.S.? Could that be?

    Quite frankly, there have been about 35,000 "brown people" killed in the drug cartel wars there in the past five years. Is that a good thing, or bad? If not dead there, would they all be here selling their drugs and packing guns into our cities?

    What do you think about these dead drug cartel members?
  • fuzzy K... A Found... 2012/07/02 13:07:50
    fuzzy Ken "In G*d We Trust"
    So when it's a Democrat you choose to throw out your ideology?
  • A Found... fuzzy K... 2012/07/02 22:21:40 (edited)
    A Founding Father
    I don't have an "ideology" to throw away. Sorry, but that's not in my book. I'm all for dead drug cartel members, whether here or there, preferably there.
  • fuzzy K... A Found... 2012/07/03 13:03:27
    fuzzy Ken "In G*d We Trust"
    +1
    The dead include a great deal of innocent bystanders as well as a Federal Agent.
    Would they have been shot and killed had it not been for our program? Most likely, but that's not the point. The point is that WE bought guns and gave them to some of the most violent animals in a foreign country. This was done without that country's knowledge and with no way to track the weapons.
    The question is "WHY?" That's what Senator Issa is trying to find out and what the White House is trying to block.
    The only theory I've heard so far is that the ATF and the DOJ were trying to prove Obama right when he said that 90% of the guns used by the Mexican cartels come from America.
  • A Found... fuzzy K... 2012/07/04 03:48:20
    A Founding Father
    What you refuse to acknowledge, but the issue will never go away, is - the details of the covert operation would contain names of persons embedded in our employ in Mexico, and details of how the operation was conducted, with names of agents here. All these would be placed in danger and some would be killed, all would be worthless for any future assistance. Just yesterday Issa gave to the media what little new information came his way. He and his little act are seditionists, intent on opposing the best interests of the U.S. Government. It is not for a small mind like him or the Republicans on his Committee to decide if the covert operations of the Justice Department are suitable or need to be revealed to the media and Mexican Cartels. Allow him this one chance and he will tomorrow be the "Inquisitor", the "Grand Wizard" of the Party of No, pretending to be doing some "patriotic duty" but fooling no one. He is a political hack, a small time hack, and doesn't do even a good job of that. I think both Obama and Holder have shown remarkable restaint to not tell him where to shove his subpoenas and "contempt" citation".
  • fuzzy K... A Found... 2012/07/05 13:18:16
    fuzzy Ken "In G*d We Trust"
    +1
    um.... are you aware that sensitive information like agents' info can be and is regularly redacted, right? Holder had 18 months to do that but instead just lied and stonewalled.
    Besides that Issa is not looking to find out who the field agents are. He's looking to find out whose idea it was and when Holder knew about it.
  • themadhare ~IJM 2012/06/28 22:30:36
    themadhare ~IJM
    +5
    He should keep going south until he's in Cuba where he belongs.
  • Ozzyboy themadh... 2012/06/29 01:34:43
    Ozzyboy
    +6
    Or Columbia where his really good friends are.
  • Allbiz - PWCM - JLA 2012/06/28 21:57:48
    Allbiz - PWCM - JLA
    +4
    Good. That's where he belongs. Right there with all the other Fairy Land lovers.
  • sglmom 2012/06/28 21:37:42
    sglmom
    +9
    I'm sorry ..
    Can't help laughing ...
    (wasn't there enough 'Mickey-Mouse-ing' around in his office .. now he's got to go to the Corporate Fantasy Land?)

    This is par for the course ..
    doesn't matter the locale ..
    "Mickey-Mouse"-ing around .. is what Holder as DoJ does best ..

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