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Obama's Advice From Putin - What Do You Think ?

MS 2009/02/04 05:39:00
No - Obama's Plan is Different.... Somehow.... Maybe
Yes - Putin has BTDT and Knows Where This Goes
This is What I think ...........
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Putin To West: We Tried Socialism, Didn’t Work

In what’s quite a surprising development, Russian Prime Minister and former President Vladimir Putin warned the West not bail out too many companies and to stop interfering in their economies.

“Interference of the State, the belief in the omnipotence of the state: that is a reaction to market failures,” Mr Putin said in his keynote address at the opening of the four-day meeting. “There is a temptation to expand direct interference of state in economy. In the Soviet Union that became an absolute. We paid a very dear price for that.”

Putin’s words are surprising because he and President Dmitry Medvedev have started copying the behavior of the Soviet Union in quite some ways. It is clear that Putin believes that interference in the economy was the Soviet Union’s true mistake (about which he is probably correct; the Soviet Union would have been a far more dangerous adversary if it would have developed a free and strong market economy).

It’s also surprising because Putin doesn’t normally about other countries. The world has changed however; we have all become increasingly dependent on each other. If Western economies crumble, Russia too will suffer.

There’s another (domestic) aspect to Putin’s remarks; the Russian economy too has suffered major blows in the last year or so. It’s likely that many Russians want their government to do what the American government did yesterday; invest heavily in the economy. Russians are more used to an active government than Americans are - when the going gets rough, people want what they know, no matter how destructive it has been in the past.

Putin may not be speaking as much to the West as he speaking directly to those Russians. He makes clear to them that he believes that bailout and major stimulus packages will hurt the economy in the long run.

And he’s right.

Western lawmakers are in serious trouble when a Russian leader tells them they are interfering too much in the markets. It’s a sign that they’re overreaching. Republicans understood this, as did 11 Democrats; the majority of them, however, voted for a bill that would make Americans more dependent on the government, that hurts the economy in the short to middle run and does little to nothing in the long run. Other Western governments could follow suit, although most ’stimulus packages’ consist out of merely bailout out banks in Europe. At this point in time, that is. Now that America passed a major stimulus package, European laborites and socialists will undoubtedly demand their governments do the same.

If so, we’re all putting a tremendous burden on ourselves, our children and our grandchildren.

Lets listen to Putin for once.
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  • krayzrick 2009/03/01 14:54:04
    This is What I think ...........
    krayzrick
    "Spirits Rebellious", by Kahlil Gibran (English version)
    Might be a good book for all Americans to read about now. We have a President, and a Congress, that is leading us all down the wrong road. In so many ways. This election was the most manipulated one I have ever seen in my life. A sham(check definiton). congress leading wrong road ways election manipulated life shamcheck definiton If Americans are not diligent, in this day and age, it might be the last election you ever see in America.
  • jakep51 2009/02/10 12:52:33
    This is What I think ...........
    jakep51
    +2
    Analysis: Obama says GOP can't criticize stimulus. Obama repeatedly reminded a national television audience that federal spending and deficits soared under George W. Bush's presidency. He used the point to undermine GOP lawmakers opposing his plan and calling it too costly and wasteful.


    Published: January 7, 2009 Changes in Social Security and Medicare will be central to efforts to bring federal spending in line, President-elect Barack Obama said on Wednesday, as the Congressional Budget Office projected a $1.2 trillion budget deficit for the fiscal year.“We expect that discussion around entitlements will be a part, a central part” of efforts to curb federal spending, Mr. Obama said at a news conference. By February, he said, “we will have more to say about how we’re going to approach entitlement spending.”

    Alluding to the projected deficit, which was accompanied by grim unemployment predictions, Mr. Obama said: “And we know that our recovery and reinvestment plan will necessarily add more. My own economic and budget team projects that, unless we take decisive action, even after our economy pulls out of its slide, trillion-dollar deficits will be a reality for years to come.”

    So that's His plan? Trillion dollar deficits for years to come? While at the same time blasting Repub...""

    '



    '''
    Analysis: Obama says GOP can't criticize stimulus. Obama repeatedly reminded a national television audience that federal spending and deficits soared under George W. Bush's presidency. He used the point to undermine GOP lawmakers opposing his plan and calling it too costly and wasteful.


    Published: January 7, 2009 Changes in Social Security and Medicare will be central to efforts to bring federal spending in line, President-elect Barack Obama said on Wednesday, as the Congressional Budget Office projected a $1.2 trillion budget deficit for the fiscal year.“We expect that discussion around entitlements will be a part, a central part” of efforts to curb federal spending, Mr. Obama said at a news conference. By February, he said, “we will have more to say about how we’re going to approach entitlement spending.”

    Alluding to the projected deficit, which was accompanied by grim unemployment predictions, Mr. Obama said: “And we know that our recovery and reinvestment plan will necessarily add more. My own economic and budget team projects that, unless we take decisive action, even after our economy pulls out of its slide, trillion-dollar deficits will be a reality for years to come.”

    So that's His plan? Trillion dollar deficits for years to come? While at the same time blasting Republicans for daring to buck hi9m on the "Stimulus" package? Stimulus means bloated government spending plain and simple. Never in the history of any government has that solved anything.

    WASHINGTON — The government's budget deficit will surge past a half-trillion dollars next year, according to gloomy new estimates, a record flood of red ink that promises to force the winner of the presidential race to dramatically alter his economic agenda.

    July 28, 2008 The deficit will hit $482 billion in the 2009 budget year that will be inherited by Democrat Barack Obama or Republican John McCain, the White House estimated Monday.

    So, George Bush's predicted Deficit was $482Bn Obama has now run that up to 1.2 Trillion, and by all accounts is planning to push it even higher. That 1.2 trillion is 2 1/12 times what was expected in Juky 2008, and he still has the audacity to criticize republicans?!?! Man talk about the pot calling the kettle black! Oh wait!!! I forgot that he's a Democrat and a liberal so he must really, Really, REALLY care for the little guy right? I wonder if any Liberal Democrats have ever considered the amount of jobs that will be lost when US Companies and Corporations start heading elsewhere to avoid Mr. Obama's tax and spend policies?
    (more)
  • DocSafety 2009/02/09 03:04:13
    Yes - Putin has BTDT and Knows Where This Goes
    DocSafety
    +2
    The democrates and Obama want listen because they are on their own high and mighty joy ride.
  • noBama 2009/02/09 01:52:24
    This is What I think ...........
    noBama
    +1
    this bill smells like a rotten Corpse the longer it lays around smells rotten corpse lays
  • Eppie 2009/02/08 02:29:35
    This is What I think ...........
    Eppie
    +4
    O is certainly screwing things up if Putin is telling how to do things! Wow--I knew O was incompetent, and this proves it.
  • Marek 2009/02/06 06:22:06 (edited)
    Yes - Putin has BTDT and Knows Where This Goes
    Marek
    +4
    Putin simply took advantage of Obama's pathetic performance on the world stage with his speech to muslims on Al Arabiya TV and is assuming the position of the World leader. By giving free advice and lecturing Obama he highlights Obama's inexperience and foolishness.
  • RKS 2009/02/05 15:20:17
    This is What I think ...........
    RKS
    +7
    It's actually pretty scary when a man of this nature sees where America is going and the mass majority of Americans can't...
  • MS RKS 2009/02/08 04:01:11
    MS
    +4
    You got that right
  • holliday04 2009/02/05 03:14:00 (edited)
    Yes - Putin has BTDT and Knows Where This Goes
    holliday04
    +7
    I think Putin knows where this will lead because he has "been there, done that".

    so·cial·ism
    Pronunciation: \ˈsō-shə-ˌli-zəm\
    Function: noun
    Date: 1837
    1: any of various economic and political theories advocating collective or governmental ownership and administration of the means of production and distribution of goods
    2 a: a system of society or group living in which there is no private property b: a system or condition of society in which the means of production are owned and controlled by the state
    3: a stage of society in Marxist theory transitional between capitalism and communism and distinguished by unequal distribution of goods and pay according to work done.

    . . .and that's where we are heading . . .we are in the transitional stage between capitalism and communism now . . .
  • Casey holliday04 2009/02/05 04:17:58
    Casey
    Putin is a murdering communist and it makes sence that obama hangs with him .
  • Maj. C. D. Hardy 2009/02/05 02:37:25
    Yes - Putin has BTDT and Knows Where This Goes
    Maj. C. D. Hardy
    +4
    Listen to those who have been there and done that !!!!! Pretty good advice.
  • Casey 2009/02/05 02:12:26
    This is What I think ...........
    Casey
    +4
    THIS IS WHAT I THINK. HE SHOULD LISTEN TO GEORGE WASHINGTON, JOHN ADAMS, THOMAS JEFFERSON, AND BEN FRANKLIN AND OTHER GREATS LIKE RONALD REAGAN. THESE PEOPLE SPENT THEIR LIFES STUDYING THE PLACE OF GOVERNMENT.
  • EF Casey 2009/02/08 06:20:01
    EF
    +4
    Obama is to arrogant. He thinks he knows better then the founders.
  • daydreamer 2009/02/05 02:06:25
    This is What I think ...........
    daydreamer
    Propaganda..............
  • Pecos Sal 2009/02/05 00:46:00
    Yes - Putin has BTDT and Knows Where This Goes
    Pecos Sal
    +3
    It is funny that third world countries feel the need to give this president Economy 101 classes.
  • MS Pecos Sal 2009/02/08 04:01:49
    MS
    +2
    I find nothing funny about it
  • Eppie Pecos Sal 2009/02/09 04:12:22
    Eppie
    +1
    I don't think Russia is a third world country-I think someplace like SriLanka would be considered third world(?)...and it speaks volumes when Putin feels the need to advise O on how to run our country.
  • Marty 2009/02/05 00:33:16
    Yes - Putin has BTDT and Knows Where This Goes
    Marty
    +6
    there you have it.. if our greatest nemesis understands how slippery the slope is, then how can we believe otherwise? They are openly concerned that our downfall makes their economy worse which will cause even greater unrest within their borders.. Also, I say that the government spends our money to freely, given that they take are able to take it too easily.. These aspects must change now, or change later under even more duress.
  • Jess 2009/02/05 00:02:00
    This is What I think ...........
    Jess
    +7
    Putin is right and is probably worried we do more damage to the market than we already have. Can you imagine what the world thinks about this down turn knowing that Congresses intervention into the mortgage market are at the heart of the reason for it.

    What I find interesting is how the world leaders are addressing Obama in a public forum and in a way that seems they are concerned about his experience.
    India says, “He is barking up the wrong tree, Putin seems to think he needs economic advice, Iran and Korea send messages with ICBM launches and strong propaganda. Its his own fault as he set the tone as he spoke to the world on Arabic TV in his arrogant appeasement tone.

    Biden was right…...they are lining up to test him.
  • Mattynr 2009/02/04 23:49:46
    This is What I think ...........
    Mattynr
    +1
    I think it sucks to post important stuff without a link or source so we can cross post.
    Good stuff come to SH to die.
    Too many bright, smart people fail to do this.................
  • MS Mattynr 2009/02/04 23:57:46
  • Angelhe... MS 2009/02/08 08:10:35
  • diaverde08-AmericanKilljoy 2009/02/04 23:30:24
    Yes - Putin has BTDT and Knows Where This Goes
    diaverde08-AmericanKilljoy
    +2
    I'm not too clear on what BTDT means, but I'm guessing this answer means that we should follow Putin's advice, and that of Smith and Mises. putin btdt clear btdt guessing answer putins advice smith mises
  • MS diaverd... 2009/02/04 23:58:20
    MS
    +2
    Means; Been There, Done That
  • diaverd... MS 2009/02/06 02:41:56
    diaverde08-AmericanKilljoy
    +2
    I see.
  • Sarge 2009/02/04 20:54:59
    This is What I think ...........
    Sarge
    +9
    America is faltering on bankruptcy and now we have a brain dead Congress proposing more bail-out monies (with little to no transparency or accountability) for initiatives that have thus far not “stimulated” anyone, except the Country Club good ‘ol boys. Do the words “pork” and “greater taxes” come to mind for anyone?

    I’m having a great deal of trouble getting this picture to hang straight on the wall.

    Part of this “stimulus” package offers about $104B in new government construction projects, while our current Administration (and Congressional decision-makers) have announced intentions of discontinuing the effective E-verify program. Should that come to pass those monies would likely aid about 300,000 Illegal Aliens in the construction markets.

    Another part of this so-called “stimulus” package offers $200B to states that have spent themselves into the deficits they are now facing. Surely these states will also be seeing the need to raise their state taxes. Why should American taxpayers subsidize the states irresponsible spending sprees? If many of these states had immediately suspended any assistance to Illegal Aliens their deficits may not have been so great….daaahhh!!!

    STIMULUS is a misnomer. State taxpayers are also Federal taxpayers so this is nothing more than a ...





    America is faltering on bankruptcy and now we have a brain dead Congress proposing more bail-out monies (with little to no transparency or accountability) for initiatives that have thus far not “stimulated” anyone, except the Country Club good ‘ol boys. Do the words “pork” and “greater taxes” come to mind for anyone?

    I’m having a great deal of trouble getting this picture to hang straight on the wall.

    Part of this “stimulus” package offers about $104B in new government construction projects, while our current Administration (and Congressional decision-makers) have announced intentions of discontinuing the effective E-verify program. Should that come to pass those monies would likely aid about 300,000 Illegal Aliens in the construction markets.

    Another part of this so-called “stimulus” package offers $200B to states that have spent themselves into the deficits they are now facing. Surely these states will also be seeing the need to raise their state taxes. Why should American taxpayers subsidize the states irresponsible spending sprees? If many of these states had immediately suspended any assistance to Illegal Aliens their deficits may not have been so great….daaahhh!!!

    STIMULUS is a misnomer. State taxpayers are also Federal taxpayers so this is nothing more than a shell game and a con, perpetrated on the unsuspecting American people.

    If our government really wants to stimulate the economy, with their $825B proposals, they should seriously consider eliminating capital gains and dividend taxes. That would inspire more Americans to invest, and provide a constructive means of sparking greater economic renewal.

    I hate to admit that Putin may be more sensible then the members of our 111th Congress. Then again it may simply be just another ploy to bring the western world onto the stage of the New World Order while relying on the UN to care for the needs of the US citizens. What a sobering thought thanks to expert “leadership” down through the ages.

    America really needs to regain herself and get these jack-asses out of decision-making roles in Washington. They put us into this mess but now seem puzzled as to how to get us out of it.
    (more)
  • MS Sarge 2009/02/05 00:00:06 (edited)
    MS
    +8
    The budget should be balanced, the Treasury should be refilled, public debt should be reduced, the arrogance of officialdom should be tempered and controlled, and the assistance to foreign lands should be curtailed, lest Rome become bankrupt.

    People must again learn to work, instead of living on public assistance.’

    Cicero ~ 55 BC

    No one thought Rome could ever fall..................
  • The Bee Guy 2009/02/04 20:07:21 (edited)
    This is What I think ...........
    The Bee Guy
    +2
    The only thing the bailout may do in the way of good, would be to give the American Public a sense of feeling good about the economy for a short time. The long range would be to leave the nation so deeply in debt that at a later time the problem will become worse, and harder to correct. The second "bailout, indeed the first corporate bailout should have been to refinance those who have been gouged with hyper mortgages to a lower interest rate, paying off the banks who these folks were indebted too. And providing a lower rate mortgage to pay back. This would have put the banks on a firmer footing, and would have allowed the purchasers to keep their homes, reducing the number of homes on the market. This would have buoyed up the home values, and generally have kept the confidence of the American people in the economoy. Which as I have said before functions only on blind faith in a system which like the wings of a bumblebee are not in theory capable of working. So long as we, and the bumblebee think our systems work and use them, they do. The minute we lose faith they don't.
    Allow me to address the BIG picture. This is that we are making a god out of our government. The one true God, the creator of the universe, will not allow us (a professing Christian nation) to continue in that...
    The only thing the bailout may do in the way of good, would be to give the American Public a sense of feeling good about the economy for a short time. The long range would be to leave the nation so deeply in debt that at a later time the problem will become worse, and harder to correct. The second "bailout, indeed the first corporate bailout should have been to refinance those who have been gouged with hyper mortgages to a lower interest rate, paying off the banks who these folks were indebted too. And providing a lower rate mortgage to pay back. This would have put the banks on a firmer footing, and would have allowed the purchasers to keep their homes, reducing the number of homes on the market. This would have buoyed up the home values, and generally have kept the confidence of the American people in the economoy. Which as I have said before functions only on blind faith in a system which like the wings of a bumblebee are not in theory capable of working. So long as we, and the bumblebee think our systems work and use them, they do. The minute we lose faith they don't.
    Allow me to address the BIG picture. This is that we are making a god out of our government. The one true God, the creator of the universe, will not allow us (a professing Christian nation) to continue in that path unjudged. I. E. (in other words) If we as a Christian nation would as individuals repent before a holy God, and ask for his forgiveness, he is very capable of doing what our leaders cannot ever do. My offer still stands that anyone is welcome to email me your snail mail address for a free booklet, on our responcibility to God and how to get right in his presence. This is not something we do, but a position we take in accepting his free offer, the rewards are out of this world. email pilgrimsongs@yahoo.com
    (more)
  • budd2007 2009/02/04 19:54:54
    Yes - Putin has BTDT and Knows Where This Goes
    budd2007
    +4
    I agree with Putan. I also worry about this country surviving the this first 100 days, let alone the first year.
  • MS budd2007 2009/02/05 00:01:51
    MS
    +1
    Yup, oh time to see if Lou Dobbs has noticed anything of interest today.
  • Archconservative 2009/02/04 19:53:08
    This is What I think ...........
    Archconservative
    +5
    Putin is telling us that Obama is to the left of an ex-KGB communist. I don't know why that doesn't scare the living h*** out of every American.
  • MS Archcon... 2009/02/05 01:06:48
    MS
    +6
    As Dono says below

    "The biggest realization here is Putin has told us we are putting on his old clothes and he is trying to put on ours! Damn did you hear what I said???

    HE KNOWS OUR SYSTEM WORKS !! AND HIS DID NOT! "
  • Eppie Archcon... 2009/02/08 02:36:03
    Eppie
    +4
    It has scared me ever since Oprah introduced this fraud to the American public. Hollywood bought this election, and now we have a total fraud in the White House. It is a travesty at best and a fright show at worst. This guy doesn't know what he is doing and the Know-nothing Democratic Congress approves every dumb idea he puts forth.
  • MS Eppie 2009/02/12 03:03:26
    MS
    and vice versa, what do they call that? mutually assured destruction, except it is now our government at work.
  • SageBrush 2009/02/04 19:08:03 (edited)
    This is What I think ...........
    SageBrush
    +7
    Does any one hear the what was just said?? A Communist leader has told us not to go statism . Does that register ? This means don't let the government control your countries economy. The Russians tried and failed miserably with this socialistic plan.



    Did you hear the other echo? Even Putin sees what he already knows well , we as Americans are running a trial experiment in socialism .

    Taken from" Justin Raimondo" article Antiwar(Quote)



    Unlike Barack Obama and his advisers, whose faith in government action is near religious, Putin warns against "excessive intervention in economic activity and blind faith in the state's omnipotence." It may be a "natural reaction" to turn to an increased state role in such times as these, yet "instead of streamlining market mechanisms, some are tempted to expand state economic intervention to the greatest possible extent. The concentration of surplus assets in the hands of the state is a negative aspect of anti-crisis measures in virtually every nation.



    The entire economic growth system, where one regional center prints money without respite and consumes material wealth, while another regional center manufactures inexpensive goods and ..."



    """"""""""



    '



    "'







    Does any one hear the what was just said?? A Communist leader has told us not to go statism . Does that register ? This means don't let the government control your countries economy. The Russians tried and failed miserably with this socialistic plan.



    Did you hear the other echo? Even Putin sees what he already knows well , we as Americans are running a trial experiment in socialism .

    Taken from" Justin Raimondo" article Antiwar(Quote)



    Unlike Barack Obama and his advisers, whose faith in government action is near religious, Putin warns against "excessive intervention in economic activity and blind faith in the state's omnipotence." It may be a "natural reaction" to turn to an increased state role in such times as these, yet "instead of streamlining market mechanisms, some are tempted to expand state economic intervention to the greatest possible extent. The concentration of surplus assets in the hands of the state is a negative aspect of anti-crisis measures in virtually every nation.



    The entire economic growth system, where one regional center prints money without respite and consumes material wealth, while another regional center manufactures inexpensive goods and saves money printed by other governments, has suffered a major setback."



    Putin accurately describes the bubble of American supremacism and diagnoses its cause. It was "brought about ," he avers, "by excessive expectations. Corporate appetites with regard to constantly growing demand swelled unjustifiably. The race between stock market indices and capitalization began to overshadow rising labor productivity and real-life corporate effectiveness." The industrial West engaged in an orgy of consumption, without producing any more – indeed, while producing much less. Our entire system was and is based on the generation of "unearned wealth, a loan that will have to be repaid by future generations." It all "would have collapsed sooner or later," and "in fact, this is happening right before our eyes."



    Unfortunately, we are increasingly hearing the argument that the buildup of military spending could solve today's social and economic problems. The logic is simple enough. Additional military allocations create new jobs.



    "At a glance, this sounds like a good way of fighting the crisis and unemployment. This policy might even be quite effective in the short term. But in the longer run, militarization won't solve the problem but will rather quell it temporarily. What it will do is squeeze huge financial and other resources from the economy instead of finding better and wiser uses for them (unquote)



    The biggest realization here is Putin has told us we are putting on his old clothes and he is trying to put on ours! Damn did you hear what I said???



    HE KNOWS OUR SYSTEM WORKS !! AND HIS DID NOT!
    (more)
  • MS SageBrush 2009/02/05 01:07:35
    MS
    +3
    Excellent, excellent post Dono, thank you
  • Peyoteboy 2009/02/04 18:46:36 (edited)
  • Dan™: Real Change, Not Fals... 2009/02/04 18:45:41
    This is What I think ...........
    Dan™: Real Change, Not False Hope
    +10
    When Putin takes a shot at the U.S. for trying to become too socialist, that's one hell of a commentary on our President and Congress.
  • thewrit 2009/02/04 18:37:12
    This is What I think ...........
    thewrit
    +1
    ... is that government can improve the market outcomes. being totally away from economy is not a wise choice. at first sight the government policies seems right: raise its expenditures and lower its interest rates.

    so i believe this is the way, maybe one should ask where to the government's expenditures should be directed for better efficiency.
  • Dan™: R... thewrit 2009/02/04 19:11:12 (edited)
    Dan™: Real Change, Not False Hope
    +5
    Really? You think government is doing a good job with the economy right now, and moving in the right direction?

    Just ... wow ...

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