1. Joe Biden may have been in Washington for a long time, but that doesn't make him corrupt (which is the insinuation of the label "Washington insider"). Biden is the author of the Violence Against Women Act - one that has done immeasurable amounts of good by providing money to shelter's to support battered women and their children. It also allocated funds for victim support units, police training in domestic violence work, and provides counseling to abused women and children. Conversely, Palin sat around Wasilla painting her nails while victims of rape in her community were charged with the cost of the forensic exams (aka rape kits) which cost upwards of $1100. That issue draws a clear distinction for me between a good choice for a VP and a bad choice. Oh, but I almost forgot!
"cleaned-up Alaska's quagmire of political scandals."
- Except for Troopergate when a bipartisan (10 repubs, 4 dems) commission found Palin unanimously guilty of abuse of power and in violation of state ethics laws. Other than that she might have cleaned somethings up. Maybe.

2. I hate having to do this, because I can already see the posts in response, but in this situation it can't be ignored. This entire section is dripping with racism. From "angry black man" (isn't McCain the angry one?) who just happens to be the coolest cucumber in the garden, to "self imposed prejudicial bondage"... anyone who thinks racial oppression is self-imposed is living on another planet. Blacks have the lowest graduation rates, highest unemployment rates, highest rates of UNDERemployment, highest rates of crime victimization, racial profiling, police shootings, the KKK... racism is real and that isn't something I should have to be explaining.
God made us equal - our society made a racial hierarchy to defy God's love of us.
"She apparently does not remember that she attended ivy
league universities with scholarship money that ultimately
(at least some of it) was paid for by our taxes."
-How ironic that he would say that, since her husband has supported more funding for higher education and McCain voted against it.
"Ahlana, I believe your charge of racism is out of control. "
-Why? Because calling a calm black man an angry black man isn't racist? It doesn't invoke racist stereotypes of 1960s black panthers or black rappers or black gangsters? Next thing you'll say is that going to a McCain rally with a stuffed monkey with an Obama sticker on it's head isn't racist... It's so disingenuous to look at this and not see racism. I'm a white girl from the middle of a corn field and I can see this for what it is!
""there seems to be an anger and a desire to punish Americans of this era." "
-Based on what exactly? His desire to provide health care? His desire to stop violence against women? His position on ending the war in Iraq? His belief that there isn't a white America and a black America but a United States of America?
"consistent theme of Hating America is rampant"
-Show me one quote in which Obama demonstrates this America hatred you say is so rampant.

3. "who are capable of working, but choose to not do so."
-For as often as the right wing attests to their existence, I have yet to meet one of these people. Although I have met dozens if not hundreds of people looking for work unable to find it. Dozens of people with advanced degrees working as servers and temp workers because their job was shipped to India. While those "lazy bums" the right is so fond of *might* exist, wouldn't Jesus prefer we catch too many in the net of social support than too few? Isn't it better to make sure no children go hungry than to make sure there isn't even one person abusing the system? Any policy will either support too few or too many people (it's the nature of policy). Better to err on the side of caution... God will forgive the err.
And welfare doesn't "perpetuate" the problems of the poor. It keeps them from starving to death. Maybe you've been lucky enough to never get laid off, to have a two parent household, and to avoid a major illness or disability, but many Americans are not so lucky. A person's ability to survive shouldn't be based on luck. If you want to help the poor, then increase welfare programs to cover more job training, subsidize daycare, and provide universal health care. Work with abused women and children for a while and you'll learn very quickly how offensive your position on this issue is.
"It has gotten out of control "
-Any proof you'd like to offer? Or just your opinion? Cuz if we are just having a battle of opinions, then I say, it hasn't gotten out of control and is woefully underfunded.
And Clinton not only balanced the budget, but left with a surplus. Obama's tax structure would return us to the rates that were in place during the Clinton administration, during which time we were experiencing enormous growth and prosperity. And O.M.G. Cato institute is NOT non-partisan! It's a conservative think-tank! Citing Cato as non-partisan is like saying Olbermann is fair and balanced!
"Winston Churchill"
-The big WC would LOVE Obama. Obama will cut taxes on 95% of working families. More money in the pockets of working Americans means more money getting pushed through the economy, which means more jobs, w00t!


4. The "above my paid grade" remark means that he thinks that is something only GOD can decide. Only God knows with any certainty when life begins or ends. He was being humble in saying that he does not presume to understand the holy details of the soul and creation of life. I personally found this answer to be overwhelmingly reassuring. I'm sick of hearing Bush tell us how he's on a mission from God and that he knows with all certainty exactly what he's doing. Doubt is humble. Pride goeth before the fall.
"Late term abortions are okay with Obama. Partial Birth abortions are okay with Obama. "
-This is a lie. Find any speech he has given in public on this issue, read his book, or look at the policy section of his website and you will see his ACTUAL position.

"Obama has voted against babies who are born alive due to a botched abortion and believes that it's okay to let a live born baby to lie in a laundry basket, cold and possibly in pain...to die."
-Another lie. A huge one. Firstly, how can you presume to know what he thinks? Secondly, he voted against the bill you speak of (as did many REPUBLICANS) because it did not have a clause to protect the life and health of the mother (in other words, it stomped all over Roe v. Wade). Thirdly, there already exist laws in the state of Illinois that require giving all necessary treatment to infants, regardless of their parent's ability to pay for the care. This prevents the horror scenario that you evoke to gain sympathy and add shock value. In other words, the law he voted down was redundant and was a political ploy by a handful of far right wing congressmen in order to gather fodder for political campaigning.
If you want women to stop using abortion as a means of birth control, maybe you should talk to McCain about making it mandatory for insurance companies to cover birth control. He has repeatedly voted against this.

-Your response to me "Ahlana, I'm sure glad you feel good about this cuz that's what it's all about right? Feeling good." - wtf are you talking about? When/where did I say I was "feeling good"? Don't put words in my mount.

5. "appeasement" means "to yield or concede to belligerent demands." "Obama has said he would talk to foreign leaders without precondition." - Talking without preconditions isn't part of the definition of "appeasement."Obama has vowed to get Bin Laden even if it means firing missiles into Pakistan without their prior approval. He has vowed to use diplomatic means where necessary with issues involving Iran and Russia... appeasement implies that he would bend over backwards to do something nice for them. There is no evidence of any sort to support this wild assertion. Directly from the Obama plan website "If Iran continues its troubling behavior, we will step up our economic pressure and political isolation." - doesn't sound like appeasement to me.
And are you really citing Bush as any one of value in foreign policy? Why do you think so many people in the world hate the USA right now? Bush policies have made us dangerously unpopular on the world stage - which incites Al-Qaeda, Iran, and Russia to try pushing us around. We've had enough of Bush's "cowboy" diplomacy to last a hundred lifetimes.

6. Schools can't take kids to abortion clinics. That's just silly. Parental notification is a states rights issue. The state of Illinois has a parental notification law - it's called the "Parental Notice of Abortion Act." Some states refuse to set these laws to protect children from abusive or incestuous parents ("Hey dad, I'm pregnant..." *gun shots*). There must be protection of minors from abusive parents. There are a million cases of child abuse in this country every year - and many of those girls get pregnant. They should not be forced to report to their deadly parents news that very well may get them killed.

7. Drew Carry supports McCain. He's in Hollywood. The Governator in California supports McCain. He was in Hollywood. Almost all of Fox News supports McCain. Point mooted.
"When the devil is for you, we should question whether or not we should be against you. " - The KKK are voting for McCain... should you not vote for him because of them? An Al-Qaeda website was recently discovered that documented communication between members about how a war hawk president like McCain would be better for their recruitment, would work to further cripple the US economy... so Al-Qaeda endorsed McCain.
Neither candidate can control who likes them - you can't fault Obama for Farrakan (who he has denounced *repeatedly*) or McCain for the KKK.
And why are you so afraid of leaders of Western European democracies?

"Clearly, having 20 more years of life experience gives me an advantage. "
-If that were true then we'd always just elect the oldest person alive to be president. Age is not an indicator of intellect, ability, or critical thinking skills. Beethoven wrote his first symphony at age 5, Newton developed calculus by age 21, and Einstein wrote some of his most influential works when he was only 25. Your age does not give you an automatic advantage - to suggest so is ageist.

"You have not convinced me that you are right and the author is wrong. "
-Only because you are unable to be swayed by pesky things like "facts" and "logic." Stick to your voo doo if that makes you happy.

"5. If you did research, you did not include references although I'm sure the huffington post would be one. "
-I have never once cited the huffington post as a reference point in a debate. Could you say the same about Fox News? And the fact that you didn't actually read what I wrote becomes clear now. I frequently identify the sources I'm referring to, I just didn't include links. A simple google search would verify any of the assertions I put forth.

"6. You really didn't answer questions as much as you turned everything around which was not the point of this exercise. The point was to disprove my position and not to defend your position."
-Ok, I'll be brief because you are having a hard time following a thorough explanation.
1) Joe Biden isn't "corrupt." Sarah Palin is corrupt.
http://www.adn.com/palin/stor...

2) Obama isn't angry. McCain is very angry.
http://www.washingtonpost.com...


3) Clinton left a surplus. Bush doubled the deficit. Clinton lowered poverty. Bush increased it.
http://www.census.gov/prod/20...

4) Obama is doesn't want to kill babies. McCain would allow the states to decide on abortion rights.
http://www.factcheck.org/elec...

5) Talking to someone is not appeasement. McCain will go to war with Iran.
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/0...

6) "Parental Notice of Abortion Act" exists in Illinois. Pregnant teens shouldn't be forced to tell abusive parents that they are pregnant because it puts them at risk.
http://law.justia.com/illinoi...

7) People in Hollywood support both candidates. Racists (KKK) support McCain, so does Al-Qaeda. You can't control who supports you.
http://www.washingtonpost.com...

"I have a feeling that after you wrote the above comment, you stomped your feet and said "So There!" "
-I have a feeling you don't like losing to someone with 20 years fewer "experience" than you have. But you probably don't recognize that you are losing...

In response to your 7 points...again. Please note that my thoughts are in { } brackets.

1) Joe Biden isn't "corrupt." Sarah Palin is corrupt. {You keep pounding this when I never said Joe Biden is corrupt.}

2) Obama isn't angry. McCain is very angry. {The original point in the letter was about Obama being the most liberal senator. My response: “True. Obama has the single most liberal voting record in the senate. His wife is politically and personally liberal, as she has made known.” I also addressed the comments the author made about “angry black man” and “angry black woman”. See my blog answer.

3) Clinton left a surplus. Bush doubled the deficit. Clinton lowered poverty. Bush increased it. {If you look at the chart on page 14 of your source, you will clearly see that the poverty level under Bush dropped below Clinton’s 2 terms. Poverty level in 2007 was lower than 1957, the first year poverty estimates were available. Unemployment rates were pretty much the same between the two (Averaged over 8 years: Clinton 5.22 Bush 5.225) Yes, Clinton left a surplus and Bush spent it all plus. That’s hard to argue with. BTW, that was an excellent source, thanks.}

4) Obama is doesn't want to kill babies. McCain would allow the states to decide on abortion rights. {Yes, McCain would leave it up to each state rather than make it a government mandate from Washington. Big difference. My full response is in a comment below. “Obama voted 3 times against the Born Alive Infant Protection Act and it had nothing to do with wording. Most all democrats including Hillary voted to support it at the Senate level. Barack Obama has stated to Planned Parenthood: "The first thing I will do when I get into office is to sign the Freedom of Choice Act..." (S.1173) The Freedom of Choice act would "invalidate all limits on Abortion." "About half of the states have parental notification or consent laws in effect, which the Supreme Court has said are permitted under Roe v. Wade as long as they meet certain requirements, including availability of judges to authorize abortions without parental notification or consent." FOCA would eliminate the parental notification and consent laws. If the FOCA passes, and no doubts it will with a democrat controlled Congress and a very liberal democrat in the white house, all of that will be allowed. To vote for the FOCA, is a vote against any aborted baby, even if they live.”}

5) Talking to someone is not appeasement. McCain will go to war with Iran.
{The author was using this definition:” APPEASMENT: to buy off (an aggressor) by concessions usually at the sacrifice of principles.” 0bama has stated that he would meet with these people (terrorist leaders) without precondition.}

6) "Parental Notice of Abortion Act" exists in Illinois. Pregnant teens shouldn't be forced to tell abusive parents that they are pregnant because it puts them at risk. {Refer to above number 4 answer. If FOCA is passed, it would eliminate parental notification. There are far more children who get pregnant due to immature decision making than are victims of rape or incest. The law states that there are special exceptions for pregnant teens that would be in danger if their pregnancy was exposed to the abuser. The law recognizes the need for that right now and there is no need to change it.}

7) People in Hollywood support both candidates. Racists (KKK) support McCain, so does Al-Qaeda. You can't control who supports you.
{I might be able to swing over on this one somewhat. According to Wikipedia, which lists 210 actor/actress endorsements, states: “(Both candidates) have stated that a person or entity's endorsement of their candidacy does not necessarily imply an endorsement by the candidate of all of the views of the endorser or that the endorser endorses all views of the candidate.” I do believe, however, that 0bama has quite the list of radical/extremist people, more so than McCain.

"I have a feeling that after you wrote the above comment, you stomped your feet and said "So There!" {Sorry, that’s just the way your response sounded to me.}

-I have a feeling you don't like losing to someone with 20 years fewer "experience" than you have. But you probably don't recognize that you are losing...
{I lose all the time to someone 20 years younger, I have 24 and 26 year old daughters. I learn a lot from them. However, it goes both ways because they have respect for my experience and listen to my opinions. It’s just that they recognize we don’t always have to agree.
As far as the election goes, I will not lose. I voted for the best candidate and no matter what the outcome, I know I’m still an American and I know I voted my conscience.}

Defending the Facts on Obama's Faith (by Jim Wallis)

(from: http://blog.beliefnet.com/) This is only part of what Jim Wallis said in his article. Go to beliefnet to read the entire piece.

So I am going to defend my friend, Barack Obama, from an increasing number of ridiculous and scurrilous attacks on the Internet and in the media. The latest incident occurred when a loud-mouth radio talk show host in Cincinnati let loose with a barrage of disparaging remarks against Senator Obama and kept using his middle name­Barack HUSSEIN Obama­over and over, seemingly to tie into the Internet accusations that Obama is really a Muslim who, as a child, attended a Muslim "madrassa" school in Indonesia that taught Islamic fundamentalism, etc. As a Chicago Tribune blog piece commented, "Anyone who uses Obama's middle name repeatedly, like Cincinnati radio host Bill Cunningham the other day, knows what he or she is doing and what feelings they are trying to evoke. There's simply nothing innocent about it."

I watched last night as other cable news shows told this story and subtly tried to add more fuel to the fire. Lou Dobbs downplayed the Cincinnati outburst as unimportant and suggested it was no different that telling the world that John McCain's middle name is "Sydney." Sure Lou; and it was interesting that Dobbs followed with more innuendos and rolled eyes over the moment in the Tuesday Democratic debate when Obama was asked about Louis Farrakhan, about suspicions that Barack's home Trinity Church on the south side of Chicago was "black nationalist," and about why Obama's pastor, Jeremiah Wright, wouldn't come on Lou's show to discuss his alleged sympathies for Farrakhan, etc. It is certainly no mystery why Pastor Wright didn't cancel his retirement celebrations and drop everything to come on Lou's show. Would anyone?

During the Democratic debate, Obama again "denounced and rejected" the ugly anti-Semitic comments that Nation of Islam leader Louis Farrakhan has often made, as he had done many times before. Farrakhan hadn't actually endorsed Obama, but recently said, "This young man is the hope of the entire world that America will change and be made better." Asked on Tuesday night about whether he would accept Farrakhan's support, Obama said: "I live in Chicago. He lives in Chicago. I've been very clear, in terms of me believing that what he has said is reprehensible and inappropriate. And I have consistently distanced myself from him."

So let's set the record straight. I have known Barack Obama for more than 10 years, and we have been talking about his Christian faith for a decade. Like me and many other Christians, he agrees with the need to reach out to Muslims around the world, especially if we are ever to defeat Islamic fundamentalism. But he is not a Muslim, never has been, never attended a Muslim madrassa, and does not attend a black "separatist" church. Rather, he has told me the story of his coming from an agnostic household, becoming a community organizer on Chicago's South Side who worked with the churches, and how he began attending one of them. Trinity Church is one of the most prominent and respected churches in Chicago and the nation, and its pastor, Jeremiah Wright, is one of the leading revival preachers in the black church. Ebony magazine once named him one of America's 15 best Black preachers. The church says it is "unashamedly black and unapologetically Christian," like any good black church would, but is decidedly not "separatist," as its white members and friends would attest.


Like his politics or not, support his candidacy or not - but don't disparage Barack Obama's faith, his church, his minister, or his credibility as an eloquent Christian layman who feels a vocation in politics. Those falsehoods are simply vicious lies and should be denounced by people of faith from across the political spectrum.

More Facts:

Some people just don’t care who they hurt to advance their political agenda.

Accusing a loving father of two beautiful little girls of wanting to kill babies isn’t just wrong on the facts, it’s the most disgusting and manipulative kind of hate politics around. But anti-abortion ideologues with a long history of partisan attacks are still launching unconscionable ads smearing Barack Obama.

The attackers torture and twist logic and history by willfully misinterpreting votes by Barack Obama in the Illinois State Senate to come up with their wild accusation.

Here’s the truth about Barack Obama and the bill:
At the time Barack voted against a bill containing language designed to protect infants who were “born alive,” such protection was already on the books as Illinois state law.[1]
The accusations against Barack are so reckless that not even the Republican state senator who sponsored the bill will support them. In fact, he freely admits that “None of those who voted against SB-1082 favored infanticide.”[2]
The bill was opposed by many legislators and groups like the Illinois Medical Society because of the unintended impact it would have had on other laws and legal precedents in Illinois.[3]
Barack is on the record[3] saying that he would have supported a similar bill that came up in Congress -- but that didn’t pose a threat to a woman’s right to choose the way the Illinois bill did.[4]


Rush Limbaugh and Fox News once again used fear and prejudice to try and sink another candidate they don’t like.

On May 30th, Rush Limbaugh gave specific details about a video tape supposedly showing Michelle Obama using a tasteless racial slur, something an accomplished professional and loving mother like Michelle would never say. Proven sleazemeister Roger Stone went on Fox News two days later to make a similar claim.

What did Michelle actually say on that video? Nothing ­ there is no video. The entire thing was completely fabricated by people like Limbaugh and Stone who want to take Michelle and Barack down. In fact, neither Michelle nor Barack has ever said anything remotely like the stuff Limbaugh, Stone, and the rest made up for their fantasy tape.

This is the worst, most hateful kind of smear there is. Make sure your friends and family know who is behind it.


Michelle Obama loves the United States and the opportunities it has given her, but some have been taking comments Michelle made about her pride in America out of context, twisting them into false, negative attack ads.

It’s one thing for Republicans to attack Barack, but even manipulative forces looking to keep cynicism in politics have no business attacking Michelle.

Unfortunately, we can expect these attacks to keep coming.

Barack has said these attacks are “infuriating, but it’s not surprising.” We have to be prepared to fight back the next time someone twists Michelle’s comments.

There is more here if any open minded person cares to look.
http://www.fightthesmears.com/

"Here’s the truth about Barack Obama and the bill:
At the time Barack voted against a bill containing language designed to protect infants who were “born alive,” such protection was already on the books as Illinois state law.[1]
The accusations against Barack are so reckless that not even the Republican state senator who sponsored the bill will support them. In fact, he freely admits that “None of those who voted against SB-1082 favored infanticide.”[2]
The bill was opposed by many legislators and groups like the Illinois Medical Society because of the unintended impact it would have had on other laws and legal precedents in Illinois.[3]
Barack is on the record[3] saying that he would have supported a similar bill that came up in Congress -- but that didn’t pose a threat to a woman’s right to choose the way the Illinois bill did."

Obama voted 3 times against the Born Alive Infant Protection Act and it had nothing to do with wording. Most all democrats including Hillary voted to support it at the Senate level.

Barack Obama has stated to Planned Parenthood: "The first thing I will do when I get into office is to sign the Freedom of Choice Act..." (S.1173) Do you understand what FOCA is? It would "invalidate all limits on Abortion." "About half of the states have parental notification or consent laws in effect, which the Supreme Court has said are permitted under Roe v. Wade as long as they meet certain requirements, including availability of judges to authorize abortions without parental notification or consent." FOCA would eliminate the parental notification and consent laws.
I said:
"Late term abortions are okay with Obama. Partial Birth abortions are okay with Obama. Abortions because someone "just isn't ready to have a baby" is okay with Obama. Obama has voted against babies who are born alive due to a botched abortion and believes that it's okay to let a live born baby to lie in a laundry basket, cold and possibly in pain...to die."
If the FOCA passes, and no doubtedly will with a democrat controlled Congress and a very liberal democrat in the white house, all of that will be allowed. To vote for the FOCA, is a vote against any aborted baby, even if they live.

I repeat: 93% of ProChoice abortions have been decided because of social reasons...4.5% due to mother's health or rape/incest. This is definite proof that women have been using abortion as a birth control method since 1973. I think it's time for some responsibility.

This is all for a "woman's right to choose what to do with her body." How about a little control and responsibility? I wonder if you and ahlana are the types that cry about the seals and the polar bears but think nothing of abortion because it's a woman's right.
It's a woman's right to carry to term to keep or give the baby up for adoption.