KSM torture did not stop LA attack

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KSM torture did not stop LA attack

Posted April 23, 2009 17:56:59
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+22 raves

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Ever since the revelations that the torture of Abu Zubaydah provided only false leads, conservatives have jumped on a Bush-era memo claiming that torture of KSM stopped an attack in LA. This is false, and easily proven so.

According to the Bush White House, the mastermind of that attack was arrested in February 2002 . They confirmed this again in a fact sheet . All well and good.

KSM was arrested on March 1, 2003 . How is it possible that torture done over a year after plot was broken up and the mastermind was arrested stopped that exact same plot?

(Links stolen from Yglesias: http://yglesias.thinkprogress.org/ )

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+8 raves gfreeman~American Atheist~ April 23, 2009 20:11:29

I'm saying that the CIA has perfected time travel.
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TinCanS... to Congrat... April 24, 2009 05:05:01

The United States is living up to the Geneva Convention Resolution. We should not have to place our heads in the sand like an oestrich out of fear that our enemies may not like us. We do not need to apologize to our enemies about our arogance, smile and shake the hand of people like Chavez, Morales, Ortega and Castro and at the same time snub the oldest democracy in South American, Colombia.
+4 raves
Lizard April 23, 2009 21:08:39

moderated...
TinCanS... to Lizard April 24, 2009 05:14:56

The CIA has released the documentation and you can look at it and see how their efforts have accomplished saving the lives of thousands of americans. Would you have the same opinion if your son or daughter was killed in one of the terrorist attacks? You may call that a scare tactic on my part, I also feel your attitude is scaring the hell out of me. We need the CIA Interrogators and your tirads against their efforts are not helping us stay safe from terrorists.
+2 raves
Zuggi to TinCanS... April 24, 2009 05:31:31

This post was regarding that documentation, and the claims that it saved lives. The main example given is the planned LA attack. As a time machine would have been needed to stop that attack given KSM's information, the claims are bogus.
TinCanS... to Zuggi April 24, 2009 18:14:25

The document is "Rulings of Interrogation Techniques." There are memos that could be released by Obama that would make this a fair and honest debate. However, in the interest of protechting the innocent and national security, I hope they will not be released. Without any further information fro the memos, I would guess the "time travel" issue is with Abu Zubaydah who was captured in Pakistan in 2002 and not KSM.
+2 raves
Zuggi to TinCanS... April 24, 2009 18:18:49 (edited)

The CIA memo stated that KSM's torture broke up the plot, not AZ's. Furthermore, it would still have been impossible to do. AZ was not captured until March 2002, and waterboarded in August 2002.

The LA plot was broken up in Feb, 2002.
patt to TinCanS... April 24, 2009 22:01:03

So the CIA is posting things on the web for populist consumption but Obama committed some heinous act by releasing info that has been on the news, in newspapers and all over the web for months. Interesting. Ver-r-r-r-y interesting.
Lizard to TinCanS... April 25, 2009 05:14:35

moderated...
+4 raves
PC April 23, 2009 20:39:46 (edited)

Sneaky Bastards do not wear uniforms, worry about the Geneva Convention, the UCMJ, our Constitution, the Bill of rights, State or Federal Laws, collateral damage or anything else that the United States as a world leader should be considering.

There will in the future be attacks on and within the US from both foreign and domestic sneaky bastards, and today we are struggling with how to treat prisoners involved in these acts.

Do we prosecute and punish these criminals as we did with Timothy McVeigh, or do we use whatever improvised, “24” inspired wet dream of violence that springs to mind as a guideline?

Punishment without a trial and conviction is just another criminal act.
+8 raves
gfreeman~American Atheist~ April 23, 2009 20:11:29

I'm saying that the CIA has perfected time travel.
+2 raves
PC to gfreema... April 23, 2009 21:16:07 (edited)

They did, I saw it
+4 raves
blahblahblah April 23, 2009 20:02:54

wow.. thanks for the info... i greatly dislike it when my gov'd lies to me.. and those who believe those lies. nice find!
+4 raves
JColliu April 23, 2009 20:01:21

Haha...I just heard that also on T.V. Just some more lies by Cheney....and I might add, his daughter, who repeated the same lie this afternoon. It's all lies!!
+1 raves
me April 23, 2009 19:47:33

Here we go again. Bush/Cheney kept us safe. Thanks guys. JUst think. If they hadn't we might have missed the Obama era.
+8 raves
Zuggi to me April 23, 2009 19:49:06

If there were actual examples of how their policies kept us safe, don't you think that they wouldn't have to resort to lying about it?
+1 raves
me to Zuggi April 23, 2009 19:50:50

Sorry - nobody's proved to me they were lying. But it's a free country and you can believe whatever you want to. As for me I'll stick to my original statement.
+7 raves
Zuggi to me April 23, 2009 19:51:39

You believe their claims that torturing a guy in 2003 stopped an attack in 2002?
+2 raves
me to Zuggi April 23, 2009 19:54:09

It doesn't matter what I believe. It doesn't matter what you believe. Neither of us is in charge of anything. And I don't know if what you are saying or if what they said is true. Back to my original statement.
+5 raves
Zuggi to me April 23, 2009 19:56:49

Dude, it's all relative!
fraglnagle to Zuggi April 24, 2009 02:44:52

puff puff pass pass