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Is the concept of “Original Sin” a circular argument?

bob 2012/07/16 15:23:30
Original Sin is an exercise in circular reasoning
Original Sin is not an exercise in circular reasoning
Since Evolution has been proven and the story of Adam and Eve is a fairy tale, the concept of “Original Sin” is a fairy tale
I was born with a fallen nature, a nature that is separated from God as a result of Adam’s sin.
The concept of Sin is just a bunch of paradoxes and is used as a means of control
The original sin is transmitted by concupiscence and enfeebles freedom of the will without destroying it.
The original sin is transmitted by concupiscence and enfeebles freedom of the will without destroying it.
The doctrine of original sin was first developed in second-century Bishop of Lyon Irenaeus‘s struggle against Gnosticism
The doctrine of original sin was first developed in second-century Bishop of Lyon Irenaeus‘s struggle against Gnosticism
Since unbaptized infants go to hell as a consequence of original sin, abortion is wrong
I think the concept of “Original Sin” is ...
have you had your apple today?
Undecided
All of the above
None of the above
You!
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  • Red 2012/08/09 05:59:58
  • the fuze 2012/07/17 17:43:35
    None of the above
    the fuze
    Why do I even bother with Bob's questions?
  • Brosia 2012/07/17 02:26:47
    The concept of Sin is just a bunch of paradoxes and is used as a means of con...
    Brosia
    I am pretty sure that most of what is considered sin in the Christian religion some pope made up because he couldn't get laid under the current system.
  • George Zook 2012/07/16 17:18:42
    Undecided
    George Zook
    Not if it is true
  • bob George ... 2012/07/16 21:06:58
    bob
    It's as circular as can be
  • Dave Sawyer ♥ Child of God ♥ 2012/07/16 15:58:53 (edited)
    Original Sin is not an exercise in circular reasoning
    Dave Sawyer ♥ Child of God ♥
    It's just a false doctrine.

    Children are born innocent, and until they reach the age of accountability, they are covered by the atonement of Jesus Christ.
  • bob Dave Sa... 2012/07/16 16:40:59 (edited)
    bob
    yawn. Jesus Christ does not want your atonement. He just wants to revolve and reincarnate like the rest of us.
  • Dave Sa... bob 2012/07/16 17:08:22
    Dave Sawyer ♥ Child of God ♥
    It is not your atonement, it is His, as He is the only one who has ever lived a life without sinning. He offers it to all who willingly receive it. He has already resurrected and ours is soon to come. It is the only one you will get, so make it a good one.
  • bob Dave Sa... 2012/07/16 21:07:41
    bob
    sin was defined by man not GOD. We all evolve
  • Dave Sa... bob 2012/07/16 23:50:31
    Dave Sawyer ♥ Child of God ♥
    +1
    Sin is defined by God, otherwise there is no such thing.
  • Christopher Kirchen 2012/07/16 15:52:55
    Undecided
    Christopher Kirchen
    I think if you believe in Jesus and do your best to live your belief, and confess to God when you slip up, you're all right.
  • BOOGIE-WOOGIE-MUSIC-MAN-ROC... 2012/07/16 15:38:07
    have you had your apple today?
    BOOGIE-WOOGIE-MUSIC-MAN-ROCK-N-R
    +1
    This is a good question, I will share it with my friends, thanks.
  • FAWKES' NOOSE ~ ΔTX 2012/07/16 15:34:55
    None of the above
    FAWKES' NOOSE ~ ΔTX
    +1
    The story of Adam and Eve, the Garden of Eden, The Forbidden Fruit and Original Sin was ripped off from the Polytheistic Sumerians who wrote an incredibly similar story 2000 years before the Hebrews even existed, let alone learned how to write.
  • classic FAWKES'... 2012/07/16 16:00:03
    classic
    +1
    And! science has proven that genetically it was impossible to populate the earth starting with only two.... LMAO
  • FAWKES'... classic 2012/07/16 16:19:30
    FAWKES' NOOSE ~ ΔTX
    Still waiting for someone to tell me who Cain's wife was.
  • Turings... FAWKES'... 2012/07/16 16:56:53
    TuringsChild
    Could have sworn I told you some time ago. Adam and Eve were made 'from the dust of the earth' just like all other life forms on the earth. They were different from their humanoid contemporaries in that they were given 'immortal souls'. So it's a simple matter for Cain to marry into the virtually identical gene pool all around him.
  • FAWKES'... Turings... 2012/07/16 17:00:25
    FAWKES' NOOSE ~ ΔTX
    How miserably wrong you are about your own fairy tales. Eve was created from Adam's Rib, ergo she would have been the only female. If you want to know how the rib fits into the story, look up the Sumerian Story called IN THE BEGINNING. That's where the Hebrews stole it from.
  • Turings... FAWKES'... 2012/07/16 17:04:41
    TuringsChild
    If you don't understand a fairy tale, you really shouldn't talk about it. The word 'rib' in Hebrew is actually rendered 'curve'. As in DNA. She is of the same genetic source as he is, that's all. But in your hate for God and His 'fairy tale', you refuse to consider any possibility other than what YOU think YOU see.
  • FAWKES'... Turings... 2012/07/16 17:15:11
    FAWKES' NOOSE ~ ΔTX
    Thanks but I've had 16 years of formal religious education. That's how I know what a load of crap it is.

    Wonder about the whole fruit thing in the Eden Story or why Eve was created from a rib? Ask the Sumerians. This is a summary of a story from The Sumerian seven-tablet epic, "Enuma elish" which means "In The Beginning."

    The story tells about the god Enki, the god of water and wisdom and one of the central and most popular deities in the Sumerian pantheon, and of the paradisical land of Dilmun (today’s Bahrain). Dilmun is said to be to the east of Sumer. In the Biblical story the Garden of Eden is situated “in the east” (Gen 2,8). According to the myth Dilmun is a bright and clean place, without disease nor death, - a land of the living, a land of the immortals.

    However, Dilmun lacks one thing: water. But the water god Enki knows what to do since water is his specialty. He creates a river that turns Dilmun into a divine garden with an abundance of fruit trees, flowers and green meadows.

    Then the great Sumerian mother-goddess Ninhursag enters the picture and creates eight different plants in this divine garden. The creation of these eight plants involves an intricate process with births of three generations of goddesses, and the story emphasizes that these births are all happening...









    Thanks but I've had 16 years of formal religious education. That's how I know what a load of crap it is.

    Wonder about the whole fruit thing in the Eden Story or why Eve was created from a rib? Ask the Sumerians. This is a summary of a story from The Sumerian seven-tablet epic, "Enuma elish" which means "In The Beginning."

    The story tells about the god Enki, the god of water and wisdom and one of the central and most popular deities in the Sumerian pantheon, and of the paradisical land of Dilmun (today’s Bahrain). Dilmun is said to be to the east of Sumer. In the Biblical story the Garden of Eden is situated “in the east” (Gen 2,8). According to the myth Dilmun is a bright and clean place, without disease nor death, - a land of the living, a land of the immortals.

    However, Dilmun lacks one thing: water. But the water god Enki knows what to do since water is his specialty. He creates a river that turns Dilmun into a divine garden with an abundance of fruit trees, flowers and green meadows.

    Then the great Sumerian mother-goddess Ninhursag enters the picture and creates eight different plants in this divine garden. The creation of these eight plants involves an intricate process with births of three generations of goddesses, and the story emphasizes that these births are all happening without the slightest pain or discomfort.

    Enki wants to taste the fruits of these eight plants and makes his servant Ismud (a god with two faces) to collect the fruits and he eats them one by one. This makes Ninhursag furious and she casts a lethal spell over Enki, and then disappears from the scene. Enki then becomes ill in eight different organs or body parts, one for each fruit. Enki’s condition is rapidly deteriorating, and the other gods are flabbergasted by this and do not know what to do to help the popular Enki. Finally a fox gets Ninhursag to come back, exactly how is unknown because this part of the story is missing.

    When Ninhursag returns she places Enki between her legs and asks him in what body parts he is ill. Then she creates eight healing goddesses, one for each body part, and soon Enki is well again. One of the sick body parts is the ribs, and in Sumerian the word for rib is “ti”. The goddess created to heal Enki’s rib is called “Nin-ti”, which means the “rib woman”. However, the Sumerian word “ti” also means “life” or “to make life”, so “Nin-ti” also can mean “the woman who makes life”. The Sumerians were very fond of such puns, but this pun was of course lost on the bible authors, since the name Eve in Hebrew (Chavvah) may resemble the Hebrew word for “life” (Chay), but have no resemblance with the Hebrew word for “rib” (Tsela)(or `ala` in Aramaic).

    The story’s emphasis that the births of the creation-goddesses is without any pain or discomfort, is an element we find in Gods punishment of Eve for causing the fall of man: “I will greatly increase your pains in childbearing; with pain you will give birth to children” (Gen 3,16).

    The very name “Eden” is also originally a Sumerian name and simply means “plain/flat terrain”. The name originates from the controversy between the Mesopotamian city-states Lagash and Umma about whom should rule the fertile river-valley of Gu-Edina (The banks of Eden) located between the two cities.

    The Old Testament rips off the Sumerians, therefore it cannot be true.
    (more)
  • Turings... FAWKES'... 2012/07/16 17:35:06
    TuringsChild
    The Sumerians had indirect contact with the same source for their story. You're confusing a game of telephone with a deliberate forgery.
  • FAWKES'... Turings... 2012/07/16 17:58:24 (edited)
    FAWKES' NOOSE ~ ΔTX
    No. And it is not a forgery... The word is PLAGIARISM. This is not uncommon in any religion. The 'new' religion takes elements of the old and usually paints the god of the old religion as the evil character, in this case, The Serpent.

    religion religion elements paints god religion evil character case serpent

    You are trying to explain how West Side Story came before Romeo & Juliet and I find that hilarious.
  • Turings... FAWKES'... 2012/07/16 18:13:18
    TuringsChild
    Thanks. Sometimes the correct word eludes me. Very frustrating.

    However:
    West Side Story - First performance: September 26, 1957
    Romeo and Juliet - Released 1 November 1996 (USA)

    Both are based on a previous work. Same with the Sumerian/Hebrew story.
  • classic FAWKES'... 2012/07/16 18:47:27
    classic
    All the references to Jesus in the bilbe are Forgeries....Scholars and religious people have readily admitted that......
  • classic FAWKES'... 2012/07/16 18:45:42
    classic
    Again you show them where the bible is wrong.. Also there are two versions of Adam and eve in the bible,, one claimes he made them together and the other story has Eve mad from adams rib... Which genetically would put her DNA the same as Adams.. Therefore as closely related as Himself.....Which would not allow procreation.. I dont care what excuses the thumpers want to throw out there. Facts are Facts. and the Law of nature are imutable....
  • Turings... classic 2012/07/16 16:52:18
    TuringsChild
    Ever hear of Mitochondrial Eve? Or Y Chromosomal Adam? The human race has been through any number of bottlenecks and survived each time.
  • classic Turings... 2012/07/16 18:48:21
    classic
    However that is no proof of creation or of a god....
  • Turings... classic 2012/07/16 18:54:45
    TuringsChild
    Scientific proof only applies to the physical world. God is metaphysical.
  • classic Turings... 2012/07/16 19:02:38
    classic
    Which means it is nothing but an Idea or dream, or a illusion, or Delusion..
  • Turings... classic 2012/07/16 19:38:28
    TuringsChild
    In Your Opinion.
  • Dave Sa... FAWKES'... 2012/07/16 16:01:41
    Dave Sawyer ♥ Child of God ♥
    Who did the Sumerians rip it off from?
  • FAWKES'... Dave Sa... 2012/07/16 16:19:05
    FAWKES' NOOSE ~ ΔTX
    The Sumerians INVENTED WRITING.

    You just epically failed World Civilization class. Maybe we can get you a 14 year old tutor.
  • Dave Sa... FAWKES'... 2012/07/16 17:10:22
    Dave Sawyer ♥ Child of God ♥
    +1
    Is that what they claimed?

    World Civilization class is flawed in that it does not teach you to think for yourself. It gives you a bunch of "facts" that will change as we learn more.

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