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Has the U.S.A. literally become the battleground of a "cold" civil war?...In the U.S.A., regardless of where you stand, do you see your political, ideological, or even religious opposition as an actual enemy whereas in years gone by you might not have?

Howler 2012/04/04 17:30:02
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Within the U.S.A., regardless of whether you lean left or lean right, have you come to the point where you liken your opposing, ideo-political side to an actual enemy rather than fellow Americans with a mere differing political POV?
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  • Wolfman 2012/04/04 17:49:17
    YES - I have come to liken my ideo-political, and/or religious opposition as ...
    Wolfman
    +18
    Yes, big authoritarian government in Washington vs. smaller central government/local control. The War was hot from 1861-1865. It has been cold since then. It is likely to get hot again very soon.

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  • Tuna whitewu... 2012/04/05 14:50:04 (edited)
    Tuna
    +2
    Didn't you see the piece about how the lefty protesters are paid; they showed some little old black grannies agreeing to protest for a free lunch. Notice how $harpton and Jack$on are kinda quiet now that they hit the $1 million mark?? (from celebrities and atheletes Jackson said on tape).
  • Lisa 2012/04/05 13:36:20 (edited)
    YES - I have come to liken my ideo-political, and/or religious opposition as ...
    Lisa
    +6
    Obama doesn't care about America or it's Constitution, so therefore everyone who stands with Obama is an opposite force to the freedoms we have which are being diminished by this administration.
  • Hippygirl Lisa 2012/04/05 16:32:20
    Hippygirl
    Do you think the other side is really for everyone's freedom our just your brand of freedom?
  • Space I... Hippygirl 2012/04/05 21:09:45
    Space Invader
    +1
    Freedom; We the people of the United States.....didn't say anything about barry...
  • Lisa Hippygirl 2012/04/06 01:18:36
    Lisa
    +1
    Everyone's freedom.. You don't know the other side as you call us.. Only thru the left wing media. It is so sad.
  • Hippygirl Lisa 2012/04/06 03:39:14 (edited)
    Hippygirl
    Yo make Assumptions I don't watch much tv news I LIVE in a very Conservative state with many conservative PEOPLE and only speak from my own life experience. And you are right what I see is SAD
  • Howler Hippygirl 2012/04/06 13:09:31
    Howler
    Conservative people and conservative viewpoints make you sad?
  • Hippygirl Howler 2012/04/06 13:51:47
    Hippygirl
    No the disrespect they show others is what I find sad. I don't judge people by there beliefs only there actions.
  • Howler Hippygirl 2012/04/06 16:56:22
    Howler
    Who is it showing disrespect?
  • Hippygirl Howler 2012/04/06 19:25:50
    Hippygirl
    I have already told you.
  • Howler Hippygirl 2012/04/06 19:36:28
    Howler
    You have?....

    I asked - "Conservative people and conservative viewpoints make you sad?"

    You answered - "No the disrespect they show others is what I find sad. I don't judge people by there beliefs only there actions."

    So, you agree with their beliefs, but their actions make you sad, which implies that their beliefs and their actions are in conflict with each other?
  • Hippygirl Howler 2012/04/06 23:29:48
    Hippygirl
    You said: Conservative people and conservative viewpoints make you sad? I answered: no the disrespect THEY (meaning conservatives)show others makes me sad. And then after the period I said I don't judge people by there beliefs but there actions. Because the poster before you implied I get my views from the media not my life experiences.
  • Howler Hippygirl 2012/04/07 03:57:18
    Howler
    OK - so you get your views from life experiences, and those experiences involve conservatives whose disrespectful actions make you sad.

    Therefore, I am again asking -

    So, you agree with their beliefs, but their actions make you sad, which implies that their beliefs and their actions are in conflict with each other?

    Or, are their beliefs and disrespectful actions one and the same?

    And, can you give me an example or two?
  • Hippygirl Howler 2012/04/07 12:51:36
    Hippygirl
    Well I dont agree with all of there beliefs there are a few I share. There actions like bullying me niece for not saying under god while saying the pledge. Our the time I was at the store and a lady dropped a 20 dollar bill and when I tapped her on the shoulder and gave it back she said thank you how very Christian of you. When I said your welcome but I'm atheist and it was just the right thing to do. She screamed heathen snatched the 20 like I was trying to steal it instead of give it back. So its not a persons belief in god I find sad but there actions towards others because of them.
  • Howler Hippygirl 2012/04/07 18:01:25
    Howler
    Ah...So, now we are getting somewhere.

    Your beef is that you profess to be a non-bullying, morally-upright, self-righteous atheistic person while the people to whose behavior you refer to as saddening to you, claim to be Christians.

    How do you KNOW that person who dropped the money was beyond a shadow of a doubt, a Christian?...Did she ever acknowledge that to you, just as you acknowledged to her that you were an atheist?
  • Hippygirl Howler 2012/04/07 19:06:10
    Hippygirl
    Well she did not say I am a Christian. She did say how very CHRISTIAN of you. And if she was another religion she wouldn't have said that and calling me heathen at the top of her lungs and snatching the money out if my hand means she was not an atheist. So yes she identified herself as Christian. And yes I am a non bullying moral person yet I wouldn't say self-righteous being that means putting your own beliefs over someone else's because that is the type of person that makes me sad.
  • Howler Hippygirl 2012/04/07 19:38:27
    Howler
    Wouldn't have said that?...I am not so sure...I have heard Jewish people use that kind of analogy before.

    And, "self-righteous" essentially means believing one's SELF to be "righteous" - "righteous" meaning -- good, virtuous, upright, upstanding, decent; ethical, principled, moral, high-minded, law-abiding, honest, honorable, blameless, irreproachable, noble; saintly, angelic, pure.

    And from your example, it looks as though you were putting YOUR beliefs over what you assume to be HER beliefs just as much as you thought she was doing that to you.
  • Hippygirl Howler 2012/04/07 22:17:08 (edited)
    Hippygirl
    Main Entry: self–righ·teous Pronunciation: \-rī-chs\ Function: adjective Date: circa 1680 : convinced of one's own righteousness especially in contrast with the actions and beliefs of others : narrow-mindedly moralistic —self–righ·teous·ly adverb —self–righ·teous·ness noun: that's the Merriam-webster definition. Please by all means explain how I was putting my beliefs over hers? By telling her I'm an atheist. I didn't put my beliefs OVER hers.
  • Howler Hippygirl 2012/04/08 00:14:21 (edited)
    Howler
    Your definition compliments and does not negate, nor contradict my synonymous examples of the word "righteous" with the added prefix of self.

    It all has to do with self-pride in one's belief that one has the "right" stance.

    And you DO believe that do you not?

    So much so that it was VERY important for YOU to make it known that YOU were a professing atheist, just as you thought that SHE thought it was important for HER to mention that such an act was reminiscent of a Christian.

    Maybe you did not put your beliefs OVER hers.

    But, if YOU did not, then neither did SHE.

    According to you telling it -

    1) you did not like it when you thought she might have mistaken you for a Christian..

    2) she did not like it when you told her that you were an atheist...

    3) she thought negatively of you after you correcting her

    4) you thought negatively of her after her negative reaction

    As a result, who do you think to be the better person from this encounter -- yourself and your beliefs -- right?

    And, most likely she thinks herself and her beliefs to be better - right?

    Therefore, either both of you put yourselves and your beliefs OVER the other, or NEITHER of you did IMO.
  • Hippygirl Howler 2012/04/08 01:26:29
    Hippygirl
    No where did I say I felt negative towards her for calling me a Christian. I simply stated a fact. I ment no malice. I didn't tell her to upset her. Why she reacted the way she did I can't say. Nor did I say I feel negative about her now. I said her action's saddened me. I was brought up to respect others so when I see people who treat others with disrespect it makes me sad. Not hate and that's what I was trying to show her to open hers eyes to seeing atheist are good people as well. Why does that bother you?
  • Howler Hippygirl 2012/04/08 01:33:01 (edited)
    Howler
    RE: "where did I say I felt negative towards her for calling me a Christian."

    Uh, if I remember correctly you were using that to illustrate an example of why "conservative" actions "sadden" you.

    Being saddened is not a negative reaction?


    RE: "I was trying to show her to open hers eyes to seeing atheist are good people as well."

    "As well"...So, you think Christians ARE good people?

    RE: "Why does that bother you?"

    Why do YOU think something is "bothering me"?
  • Hippygirl Howler 2012/04/08 02:21:01 (edited)
    Hippygirl
    Yes I was using that story to show you an example of an experience when someones action's saddened me. But it was not her saying how Christian of you that made me sad. It was her reaction to my saying I'm atheist and it was just the RIGHT thing to do(meaning no matter what you believe or don't believe its right to be kind to others) she was the one who screamed heathen and treated me lesser once she knew I wasn't Christian. Of course I believe Christians are good people. I love many Christians my father is Christian my mother was Christian before she died and so is most of my family and many of my friends. I agin state I dont judge people by there beliefs but there actions.
  • Howler Hippygirl 2012/04/08 02:26:32
    Howler
    "It was her reaction to my saying I'm atheist .."

    Thus, I go back to my earlier comment-

    "4) you thought negatively of her after her negative reaction

    As a result, who do you think to be the better person from this encounter -- yourself and your beliefs -- right?

    And, most likely she thinks herself and her beliefs to be better - right?

    Therefore, either both of you put yourselves and your beliefs OVER the other, or NEITHER of you did IMO."
  • Hippygirl Howler 2012/04/08 11:29:02
    Hippygirl
    Well you are entitled to your opinion. But agin you are going to the beliefs and NOT the actions. The only belief of mine that I would say is better then hers is respecting others not judging them based on false information. Not me and my atheism are better then her and her Christianity. Do you not find respecting others is the right thing to do? Do you think her reaction to me is an acceptable way to understand people and to try move past our prejudice of others?
  • Howler Hippygirl 2012/04/08 19:01:43 (edited)
    Howler
    Believe me, I realize I am entitled to my opinion as are you...lol...That is a given, I do believe.

    Me stating - "you thought negatively of her after her negative reaction" --

    Is NOT an example of me "going to the ACTIONS"?

    I have made that statement at least three times now, and I cannot find where that statement mentions her BELIEF.

    ___________________

    You state - "Not me and my atheism are better then her and her Christianity. "

    I mean, if you believe there could be the omission of something in the world that would make it "blissful" - (i.e., ecstatic, happy, euphoric, joyful, elated, rapturous, delighted, thrilled, overjoyed, joyous, on cloud nine, in seventh heaven, over the moon, on top of the world) -

    And that omitted "something" is religion, and Christianity certainly falls into the category of "religion", at least for many people (and I think for YOU as well), would you not agree that whatever it is that you think would make the world "blissful" would be "better"?

    How could "blissful" not be "better"?

    And you make that pretty clear in the following comment in answer to another poll question -- (links provided)

    POLL question - "Atheists: If you could make up your own religion, would you?"
    http://www.sodahead.com/livin...

    YOUR comment (typos included) - "No religion is thw cause of...














    Believe me, I realize I am entitled to my opinion as are you...lol...That is a given, I do believe.

    Me stating - "you thought negatively of her after her negative reaction" --

    Is NOT an example of me "going to the ACTIONS"?

    I have made that statement at least three times now, and I cannot find where that statement mentions her BELIEF.

    ___________________

    You state - "Not me and my atheism are better then her and her Christianity. "

    I mean, if you believe there could be the omission of something in the world that would make it "blissful" - (i.e., ecstatic, happy, euphoric, joyful, elated, rapturous, delighted, thrilled, overjoyed, joyous, on cloud nine, in seventh heaven, over the moon, on top of the world) -

    And that omitted "something" is religion, and Christianity certainly falls into the category of "religion", at least for many people (and I think for YOU as well), would you not agree that whatever it is that you think would make the world "blissful" would be "better"?

    How could "blissful" not be "better"?

    And you make that pretty clear in the following comment in answer to another poll question -- (links provided)

    POLL question - "Atheists: If you could make up your own religion, would you?"
    http://www.sodahead.com/livin...

    YOUR comment (typos included) - "No religion is thw cause of most problems if I where in a world without it it whould b blissful l."
    http://www.sodahead.com/livin...

    No need to explain, even if you want to.

    Whatever you believe is what you believe.

    To each his own, even if you are in denial that it is true that you believe atheism to be "better" than Christianity.

    That is unless you believe your atheistic world "bliss" to be a bad thing.

    But, I do not believe that YOU believe that to be the case.

    Your self-righteousness is very obvious.

    Bless you.
    (more)
  • Hippygirl Howler 2012/04/09 00:56:18
    Hippygirl
    I wont explain I ment what I said. I do find atheism to be better then religion(that's why I'm an atheist). Just like I'm sure you think Christianity is better. However I don't believe all atheist are better then christians. Nor do I believe the fact that just because I'm atheist I am superior to some one that doesn't share my beliefs. Also if its not to much of a bother you never did answer my qeustions in the last post.
  • Howler Hippygirl 2012/04/09 01:20:26 (edited)
    Howler
    Yes, I believe Christianity is better...But, I have never implied in any way that it was not.

    To answer your questions..

    RE: Do you not find respecting others is the right thing to do?...

    Yes, I find respecting others is the right thing to do...But, I do not believe that to be any credit to me...And, I am pretty sure your idea of "respect" and my idea of "respect" are not synonymous.


    RE: Do you think her reaction to me is an acceptable way to understand people and to try move past our prejudice of others?

    No, but neither is your comment - " "No religion is thw cause of most problems if I where in a world without it it whould b blissful l."

    Regardless, I respect your right to an opinion...But, I do not respect THE opinion.

    Our individual, respective worldviews are antithetical to each other, and therefore our discourse is going to clash no matter what is stated.
  • Hippygirl Howler 2012/04/09 02:02:58
    Hippygirl
    Well you have a good day then. I'm sure we will clash agin some time.
  • Howler Hippygirl 2012/04/09 03:08:57 (edited)
    Howler
    Oh, it's been a fine day.

    And, just an FYI..I thought it was just a typo when you did it once, but after a few times I have figured I would let you know that the word you are using "agin", is actually spelled "again".

    And, yes we may clash "again"...But, I doubt it.

    Once I have satisfied my curiosity about someone regarding their online commentary on this site, I tend to look in a different direction.
  • Hippygirl Howler 2012/04/09 10:52:28
    Hippygirl
    +1
    It is a typo my laptop is broken and this stupid tuch screen is very sensitive on my cellphone . I try to proof read but. I miss some.
  • john ri... Howler 2012/04/15 01:35:09
    john richardson
    +1
    Howler, ur right everyone has their opinion but it's interesting to hear everyones idea of how mater came into existence then life
  • Howler Hippygirl 2012/04/06 16:55:03
    Howler
    +1
    How many "brands" of freedom are there to choose from?
  • Hippygirl Howler 2012/04/06 19:29:22
    Hippygirl
    One. I'm not the one trying to call anyone who doesn't think like me un American.
  • Howler Hippygirl 2012/04/06 19:41:39 (edited)
    Howler
    But, you ARE the one implying there is more than one brand of freedom.
    Now, you state otherwise.

    One brand of freedom?

    Yet, you make the statement - "Do you think the other side is really for everyone's freedom our just your brand of freedom?"

    That statement of yours infers you do not agree that there is one brand of freedom.
  • Hippygirl Howler 2012/04/06 23:38:19 (edited)
    Hippygirl
    Well if I confused you I do apologize. What I ment by the statement was that its easy to SAY you believe in Freedom that is until someone has a different idea of what that means. Then people who don't like each others views start pushing there beliefs on others not caring about thier freedom to believe how they choose. That happens on both sides not just one.
  • Howler Hippygirl 2012/04/07 04:03:24
    Howler
    You say -
    "What I ment by the statement was that its easy to SAY you believe in Freedom that is until someone has a different idea of what that means."

    "A different idea of what freedom means"?...If there is only one brand of freedom, as you have stated, then if someone else has a different idea from you as to what freedom means, and you don't like it, what is the difference between you and them as far as one being "pushy" with one's view of freedom?

    Maybe specific examples of what you mean would help.
  • Candy 2012/04/05 13:27:47
    YES - I have come to liken my ideo-political, and/or religious opposition as ...
    Candy
    +6
    Until November 2012, I willfight alongside the Tea Party, Republicans, and Conservatives alike who believe in the American Constitution. After we win, I'll go back to "civility", as Obama put it (but certainly did not mean it).

    By the way, have you heard of the new SOPA?: http://www.sodahead.com/unite...
  • john ri... Candy 2012/04/07 23:39:15
    john richardson
    Welcome to the tea party my fellow American they think we're done but they also said we were astro turf befor the midterm elections we see what it got them tho the job is only 1/3 finished
  • Algore Isanass 2012/04/05 13:16:01
    NO - I see my ideo-political, and/or religious opposition as fellow Americans...
    Algore  Isanass
    +3
    I'm deeply disturbed at folks on BOTH sides that see the other side as "the enemy." Rational discussion is impossible when all you read and hear is insults and nasty remarks. These won't solve the first problem nor will they lead to any greater understanding.

    Neither side is 100 percent correct, neither side is 100 percent wrong. Also, some issues have no "right" or "wrong" and call for some compromise out of necessity.

    It kills me when I point out some hypocrisy, and each side says, "well, the other does it, so it's OK for us to do likewise to them. Two wrongs don't make a right, and we're in big trouble if we don't learn to get along.
  • vis_viva Algore ... 2012/04/11 00:32:07 (edited)
    vis_viva
    I've only been skimming but I haven't seen very many liberals vote "Yes" here. Sure I argue with conservatives. And I often poke fun at birthers (it's just so easy and so fun). But at the end of the day I still see the people I argue with as Americans. I could work side by side with them on a job. I could help them change a tire or shovel a driveway. I would let my daughter marry one of their sons. I see many liberal AND conservatives posting here who agree with that. I haven't seen many posts here, however, in which liberals consider their political opponents as "enemies" or as not actual Americans. That seems to be predominantly (not exclusively but predominantly) from some faction of conservatives and it saddens me. I don't think we can write that off as just being because the President is (slightly) left of center thus the rage is more focused from one side than the other. There was a lot of hate coming from the left for Bush (I know, I was definitely one of them). Never at any point did I consider Bush supporters as non-Americans or as my enemy.

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