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Do you think that the long term effects of Liberal Social Engineering has been a disaster, and will not be solved by more Gun Control?

Scalded Eagle 2012/12/14 23:59:55
...especially in Blue States. If anything, we need more registered gun owners to stop these troubled Mass Shooters and minimize their carnage.
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  • The_Quant 2013/01/13 06:46:11
  • CommieH... The_Quant 2013/01/16 06:39:01
    CommieHunter - AFCL- PWCM
    Ironic that JFK's holding an M-16, the one weapon that's highest on the liberal soclalists hate list.
  • AG 2013/01/07 20:28:35
    AG
    +2
    Complete disaster for the people.
  • santa6642 2013/01/06 13:40:14
    santa6642
    +2
    Firearm control is using a two hand hold,Thats the only Firearm control I understand.
  • jere.chievres 2013/01/04 21:33:26
    jere.chievres
    +1
    I agree, I have yet to even show a weapon except at the range, but the times are changing.
  • gregory... jere.ch... 2013/01/08 14:56:57
    gregory.brown.5030
    +2
    I did once, protecting a convicted child rapist from his victims family.
  • jere.ch... gregory... 2013/01/08 17:14:16
    jere.chievres
    +1
    Well tat is a good usage.
  • gregory... jere.ch... 2013/01/08 19:42:18
    gregory.brown.5030
    +1
    Kinda felt dirty afterwards, though.
  • jere.ch... gregory... 2013/01/08 20:25:47
    jere.chievres
    +1
    Why you did some good.
  • gregory... jere.ch... 2013/01/08 20:43:45
    gregory.brown.5030
    +2
    Well, the thought that i was defending a low life animal from people who's little girl had been raped and murdered kind of got to me.
  • Cramwler 2013/01/02 12:09:22 (edited)
    Cramwler
    +2
    It will lead to the disaster in the long run. If you are White you are seen as oppressor you are guilty and scapegoat for everything. Pitting nonwhite minorities Blacks,Hispanics and others against White majority.(Racial Hierarchy)


    If you are rich you are oppressor you are guilty and will be scapegoated. Pitting poor,working class and middle class against rich.(Economical Hierarchy)

    If you are straight you are guilty there is nothing good or special in being straight you are seen as oppressor of sexual minorities like gays,lesbians,transgendered and bisexuals.
    (Hierarchy of sexual orientation)

    If you are Christian you are guilty and seen as oppressor of radical Muslims and Jews.
    (Religious Hierarchy)

    If you are national majority in your own country you are guilty and seen as oppressor of national minorities(National Hierarchy)

    This hierarchies are creating double standards that punish majority and praise the minority

    Everyone who do disagree with multicultural doctrine will be brutally punished

    Hardcore individualism is rising because happines of individual is most important from liberal perspective. Which in long run is leading to a weaker families ,higher divorce rate, social alienations, rise of loners,breaking of national unity, population reduction,possibility of l...











    It will lead to the disaster in the long run. If you are White you are seen as oppressor you are guilty and scapegoat for everything. Pitting nonwhite minorities Blacks,Hispanics and others against White majority.(Racial Hierarchy)


    If you are rich you are oppressor you are guilty and will be scapegoated. Pitting poor,working class and middle class against rich.(Economical Hierarchy)

    If you are straight you are guilty there is nothing good or special in being straight you are seen as oppressor of sexual minorities like gays,lesbians,transgendered and bisexuals.
    (Hierarchy of sexual orientation)

    If you are Christian you are guilty and seen as oppressor of radical Muslims and Jews.
    (Religious Hierarchy)

    If you are national majority in your own country you are guilty and seen as oppressor of national minorities(National Hierarchy)

    This hierarchies are creating double standards that punish majority and praise the minority

    Everyone who do disagree with multicultural doctrine will be brutally punished

    Hardcore individualism is rising because happines of individual is most important from liberal perspective. Which in long run is leading to a weaker families ,higher divorce rate, social alienations, rise of loners,breaking of national unity, population reduction,possibility of less educated society and failure in collective development.

    Political correctness is replacing freedom of speech and is rewriting a science completely.


    Stealing and rewriting a history from more developed and technologically advance(civilization,race and society) Then giving that history to less developed and less advanced civilizations and races in order to make everyone look equal.

    All those who will be more productive will be punished for doing better than others because we are all suppose to be equal.

    Nobody should have guns because it's easier to take over disarmed society and establish complete dictatorship.

    This is how Liberal social engineering looks to me. It follows the cults of Bolsheviks and Frankfurt School which later on in 1960's became modernized version of Bolshevik's. It always has to be some hierarchy that should be blamed for everything to create world of totalitarian equality while in meantime breaking solidarity among European cultures.
    Liberal ideas of hierarchies and equality practice can function best in diverse societies that's why they can't imagine world without Multiculturalism
    (more)
  • gregory... Cramwler 2013/01/06 14:05:26
    gregory.brown.5030
    +1
    Will??
  • GOP Poison 2013/01/02 02:56:05
    GOP Poison
    Can you please explain liberal social engineering?
  • jere.ch... GOP Poison 2013/01/08 20:28:47
    jere.chievres
    +1
    Here you go. Its long!

    Social engineering (political science)
    From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Jump to: navigation, search
    It has been suggested that Social engineer be merged into this article or section. (Discuss) Proposed since July 2010.
    This article needs additional citations for verification. Please help improve this article by adding citations to reliable sources. Unsourced material may be challenged and removed. (June 2011)

    Social engineering is a discipline in social science that refers to efforts to influence popular attitudes and social behaviors on a large scale, whether by governments or private groups. In the political arena, the counterpart of social engineering is political engineering.

    For various reasons, the term has been imbued with negative connotations. However, virtually all law and governance has the effect of seeking to change behavior and could be considered "social engineering" to some extent. Prohibitions on murder, rape, suicide and littering are all policies aimed at discouraging undesirable behaviors. In British and Canadian jurisprudence, changing public attitudes about a behaviour is accepted as one of the key functions of laws prohibiting it. Governments also influence behavior more subtly through incentives and disincentives built into econom...









































    Here you go. Its long!

    Social engineering (political science)
    From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Jump to: navigation, search
    It has been suggested that Social engineer be merged into this article or section. (Discuss) Proposed since July 2010.
    This article needs additional citations for verification. Please help improve this article by adding citations to reliable sources. Unsourced material may be challenged and removed. (June 2011)

    Social engineering is a discipline in social science that refers to efforts to influence popular attitudes and social behaviors on a large scale, whether by governments or private groups. In the political arena, the counterpart of social engineering is political engineering.

    For various reasons, the term has been imbued with negative connotations. However, virtually all law and governance has the effect of seeking to change behavior and could be considered "social engineering" to some extent. Prohibitions on murder, rape, suicide and littering are all policies aimed at discouraging undesirable behaviors. In British and Canadian jurisprudence, changing public attitudes about a behaviour is accepted as one of the key functions of laws prohibiting it. Governments also influence behavior more subtly through incentives and disincentives built into economic policy and tax policy, for instance, and have done so for centuries.
    Contents

    History

    Before one can engage in social engineering, one must have reliable information about the society that is to be engineered and effective tools to carry out the engineering. Both of these became available only relatively recently: roughly within the past one hundred years. The development of social science made it possible to gather and analyze information about social attitudes and trends, which is necessary in order to judge the initial state of society before an engineering attempt and the success or failure of that attempt after it has been implemented. At the same time, the development of modern communications technology and the media provided the tools through which social engineering could be carried out.

    While social engineering can be carried out by any organization. whether large or small, public or private, the most comprehensive (and often the most effective) campaigns of social engineering are those initiated by powerful central governments.

    Extremely intensive social engineering campaigns occurred in countries with authoritarian governments. In the 1920s, the government of the Soviet Union embarked on a campaign to fundamentally alter the behavior and ideals of Soviet citizens, to replace the old social frameworks of Tsarist Russia with a new Soviet culture, to create the New Soviet man. The Soviets used newspapers, books, film, mass relocations, and even architectural design tactics to serve as "social condenser" and change personal values and private relationships. Similar examples are the Chinese "Great Leap Forward" and "Cultural Revolution" program and the Khmer Rouge's plan of deurbanization of Cambodia. In Singapore, the government's housing policies attempt to promote a mix of all races within each subsidized housing district in order to foster social cohesion and national loyalty while providing the citizens with affordable housing.[citation needed]

    Non-authoritarian regimes tend to rely on more sustained social engineering campaigns that create more gradual, but ultimately far-reaching, change. Examples include the "War on Drugs" in the United States, the increasing reach of intellectual property rights and copyright, and the promotion of elections as a political tool. The campaign for promoting elections, which is by far the most successful of the three examples, has been in place for over two centuries. Social theorists of the Frankfurt School in Weimar Germany like Theodor Adorno had also observed the new phenomenon of mass culture and commented on its new manipulative power, when the rise of the Nazis drove them out of the country around 1930 (many of them became connected with the Institute for Social Research in the United States). The Nazis themselves were no strangers to the idea of influencing political attitudes and re-defining personal relationships. The Nazi propaganda machine under Joseph Goebbels was a synchronized, sophisticated and effective tool for creating public opinion.

    In a similar vein the Greek military junta of 1967-1974 attempted to steer Greek public opinion not only by propaganda but also by inventing new words and slogans such as palaiokommatismos (old-partyism), Ellas Ellinon Christianon (Greece of Christian Greeks), and Ethnosotirios Epanastasis (nation-saving revolution, meaning coup d'├ętat).

    Social engineering can be used as a means to achieve a wide variety of different results, as illustrated by the different governments and other organizations that have employed it. The discussion of the possibilities for such manipulation became especially active following World War II, with the advent of television, and continuing discussion of techniques of social engineering, particularly in advertising, is still quite pertinent in the western model of consumer capitalism.
    Karl Popper

    In his classic political science book, The Open Society and Its Enemies, volume I, The Spell of Plato, Karl Popper examined the application of the critical and rational methods of science to the problems of the open society. In this respect, he made a crucial distinction between the principles of democratic social engineering (what he called "piecemeal social engineering") and Utopian social engineering.

    Popper wrote:

    the piecemeal engineer will adopt the method of searching for, and fighting against, the greatest and most urgent evil of society, rather than searching for, and fighting for, its greatest ultimate good.[1]

    According to Popper, the difference between "piecemeal social engineering" and "Utopian social engineering" is:

    the difference between a reasonable method of improving the lot of man, and a method which, if really tried, may easily lead to an intolerable increase in human suffering. It is the difference between a method which can be applied at any moment, and a method whose advocacy may easily become a means of continually postponing action until a later date, when conditions are more favorable. And it is also the difference between the only method of improving matters which has so far been really successful, at any time, and in any place, and a method which, wherever it has been tried, has led only to the use of violence in place of reason, and if not to its own abandonment, at any rate to that of its original blueprint.[1]

    See also

    Edward Bernays
    Jacque Fresco
    Engineers of the human soul
    Framing (social sciences)
    Paternalism
    Political engineering
    Propaganda / Public relations
    Psychological warfare
    Social constructionism
    Social control
    Social engineer
    Social technology
    Total institution
    (more)
  • Rockne1865 2012/12/28 14:45:26
    Rockne1865
    +2
    I'm a Democrat & I own not just 1 gun but more then 20 & you can make. All the laws you want but you can't have my guns!
  • Ken 2012/12/27 23:19:43
  • rk 2012/12/24 03:01:45
    rk
    +4
    Mental health care is what is needed. WE already have gun restrictions and that will not stop crazy.
  • A Found... rk 2013/01/08 05:11:17
    A Founding Father
    Indeed, there is a relationship you acknowledge between those who crave more guns, especially the ones that fire a lot of bullets so as to not require skill in marksmanship,
    and "crazy" or various mental disorders. Once we recognize that, the discussion of how
    to best control these mental cases and keep them from having access to WMDs that can
    kill a lot of people or spread a lot of bullets should become easy. It isn't, of course, as the weapons manufacturers have such a big stake in the $Billion industry of selling semi auto
    weapons to any loony who wants one.
  • rk A Found... 2013/01/13 04:27:24
    rk
    +1
    Wanting more guns is no different than someone wantng more shoes, cars, fishing poles etc. NONE are crazy.
  • A Found... rk 2013/01/13 04:44:13 (edited)
    A Founding Father
    Beg your pardon. Shoes, cars, fishing poles can all be used for the purposes for which they were manufctured and intended. They are practical and utilitrian, and unless consumed to excess are not suspected of arising from latent mental problems. However, the same is not true of an item specifically designed for the purpose of killing another human, it's only practical utilitarian use. Without a latent desire to kill another human with a burst of bullets fired in rapid sucession the ownership of a semi auto self loading killing device with many bullets is not of any practical utilitarian use. In the mind of all who spend money on these weapons is a latent wish to some day use them for the purpose for which they are intended. Every day of the year approximately 35 persons are killed and nearly 100 wounded by someone who slips across that line of sanity and uses the device as it was intended, just here in the United States.
  • McRib Sandwich 2012/12/24 02:11:18
    McRib Sandwich
    +3
    Rave +1

    Crime is the lowest in areas where gun ownership is the highest. It's actually very simple logic. Criminals don't want to get shot while committing a crimes so they go to liberals neighborhoods because halfwit liberals don't like guns.
  • GOP Poison McRib S... 2013/01/02 02:59:35
    GOP Poison
    +1
    I would probably have to argue that most crime happens in the poorer areas where almost everyone is packing. I live near Indianapolis and there is a lot more crime in the inner city than out here in this little town I live in and I am sure there are more guns in the inner city ghetto than here.
  • gregory... GOP Poison 2013/01/08 14:58:28
    gregory.brown.5030
    What are the gun laws there?
  • GOP Poison gregory... 2013/01/08 15:05:40
    GOP Poison
    +1
    I do not know. Probably something I should check out since I have guns.
  • gregory... GOP Poison 2013/01/08 15:14:14
    gregory.brown.5030
    +1
    Might help.
  • A Founding Father 2012/12/23 20:28:55
    A Founding Father
    +1
    Do enlarge upon your claims about "liberal social engineering" and it's relationship to gun crimes, assuming such "engineering" existed. Certainly your inquiry sounds like something
    you have studied in great detail of a complicated subject. Your enlightenment will be valued.

    Be sure to relate this to the numbers of semi automatic weapons available to the insane, criminal, and undereducated red necks with gun racks in the windows of their pickup trucks.
  • hatter A Found... 2012/12/24 03:00:12 (edited)
    hatter
    +3
    Your reply is ignorant. Just because one goes to college does not make him smart. I had this told to me by a colonel from the army. His job was to get both sides to live together. Under educated rednecks have there own non brainwashed brains that have their own knowledge that serves them in their environment. Not every body wants to be a city slicker.
  • A Found... hatter 2012/12/24 03:07:24 (edited)
    A Founding Father
    +2
    I suppose you are right about what it takes to survive in the environment where education and cultural values are frowned upon and catfish spelunking is the weekend sport, and I take no issue with you. However, it would be a lot better if such persons didn't try to influence the national political agenda or spread WMDs into the hands of mental midgets and unstable minds. We could better live together if half the population wasn't threatening to shoot the other half.

    Maybe you would encourage "Scalded Eagle" to answer my inquiry and tell us more about his study of "social engineering". Maybe he once took a class in college about the subject?
  • gregory... A Found... 2012/12/25 09:53:49
    gregory.brown.5030
    +3
    Isn't spelunking the exploration of caves? And, Isn't it better that grounded solid patriotic citizens try to influence the political climate instead of illegal aliens, disgruntled foreigners, and social liberals?
  • A Found... gregory... 2012/12/25 19:21:36 (edited)
    A Founding Father
    +1
    "Grounded solid patriotic citizens" are too often undereducated sorts from small southern villages with rifles in the rear window of their rusting pickups - the "grass roots" we sometimes call them, being those who live in the soil and provide nurishment to the "Top 2%" who are the "grass". These people have a different culture and lifestyle, more "rooted" into the 19th Century than the 21st. I'm not convinced they add much of value to today's discourse and needs and often create needless conflicts.

    "Illegal aliens", "disgruntled foreigners, and "social liberals" are realities in our world today, as are "red necks", "evangelicals", and "RWNJs". Everyone has a voice, some more attuned to 21st Century circumstances than others.
  • gregory... A Found... 2012/12/26 15:54:14
    gregory.brown.5030
    +2
    Exactly It is better that the providers influence the political climate than the 47% or more of useless non- contributors. What good is an education if you can't feed yourself? Judging from your comments, you must be well educated. In that case I'm sure that you will agree that the socialistic policies being expounded by the worthless takers in today's society, have never worked in the past, do not work now in the present, and will never work in the future. There will always be someone who feels that by virtue of their position, Wither from an accident of birth, educational opportunities or a simple feeling of entitlement will try to influence the political climate and discount the worth of others because of their emotions without a reasonable social discourse.
    Or, to put it in the terms of a redneck under-educated southerner with a rifle in the window of his pick-up truck: " There will always be some smart ass who can't pour piss out of a boot with the directions on the heel, who thinks they can tell others what to do. even if they rely on those people for their own survival.
    Since you are so well educated and cultured, what exactly is your contribution to our society? What is your value in today's America?
  • A Found... gregory... 2012/12/26 20:59:24
    A Founding Father
    +1
    "Exactly It is better that the providers influence the political climate than the 47% or more of useless non- contributors."

    That is exactly what happened in the last election, the "blue states" that feed the "red states" controlled the election and won a victory. However, the votes of the veterans, minorities, retired workers, the 47%, were important.
    So much for revealing an "Aristocratic" disdain for the "underlings".

    "In that case I'm sure that you will agree that the socialistic policies being expounded by the worthless takers in today's society, have never worked in the past, do not work now in the present, and will never work in the future."

    Following the Great Depression caused by America's banking industry the policies of the "liberal" Democratic Party led by FDR rebuilt America's middle class from a state of destruction into the greatest society of productive workers the world has ever witnessed, made them home owners, provided educations to their children, and enabled them to save some for their retirements and pay their bills, even buy a new car every few years. Then, along came a plan called "Reaganomics" and destroyed all of this success, rebuilding a class of Aristocrats and collapsing the economy into another depression. The successful policies are often called...










    "Exactly It is better that the providers influence the political climate than the 47% or more of useless non- contributors."

    That is exactly what happened in the last election, the "blue states" that feed the "red states" controlled the election and won a victory. However, the votes of the veterans, minorities, retired workers, the 47%, were important.
    So much for revealing an "Aristocratic" disdain for the "underlings".

    "In that case I'm sure that you will agree that the socialistic policies being expounded by the worthless takers in today's society, have never worked in the past, do not work now in the present, and will never work in the future."

    Following the Great Depression caused by America's banking industry the policies of the "liberal" Democratic Party led by FDR rebuilt America's middle class from a state of destruction into the greatest society of productive workers the world has ever witnessed, made them home owners, provided educations to their children, and enabled them to save some for their retirements and pay their bills, even buy a new car every few years. Then, along came a plan called "Reaganomics" and destroyed all of this success, rebuilding a class of Aristocrats and collapsing the economy into another depression. The successful policies are often called "socialistic" by the undereducated opponents, because they favored the 98% and not the 2%.
    What is important is that the former policies were successful, and we hope to again emulate them and recover our middle class from the ravages of the "Top 2% Club" members and the Reagan Banks.

    "There will always be someone who feels that by virtue of their position, Wither from an accident of birth, educational opportunities or a simple feeling of entitlement will try to influence the political climate and discount the worth of others because of their emotions without a reasonable social discourse."

    Yes, that is true. We of more progressive and liberal leanings will defend your rights to continue to "influence" the political arena even while doing our best to defeat your regressive and failed ideas. No need to thank us, we are just keeping the First Amendment alive as it seems to be important and you happen to benefit.

    I won't bother to comment on the ignorance of the red neck philosophies. I know they place little to no value on educations or culture and often resort to
    describing bodily functions and potty talk.

    My contribution is to stand in the middle of the road and try to divert intelligent and thinking minds away from the harmful regressions of the RWNJs and their agendas of destructive ideologies and policies. I also pay
    a lot of taxes to support the essentials of a complex government, and fund the waste and corporate welfare that so drains the public coffers. Still, I try to lessen the waste and encourage the House of Reps would do their duty and cut the waste away.
    (more)
  • gregory... A Found... 2013/01/07 23:33:20
    gregory.brown.5030
    +2
    You should look at the numbers again.
  • jere.ch... gregory... 2013/01/08 20:32:13
    jere.chievres
    +1
    He is an idiot pay him no attention
  • gregory... A Found... 2013/01/08 15:03:07 (edited)
    gregory.brown.5030
    +2
    I can answer. Welfare, free cell phones, free health care,. An entire culture of entitlement. Let's take money from the middle class to pay for takers who are too lazy to work. Let's take medicare from old people who have worked all of their lives so we can give college educations to illegals and crack whores. OOps, almost forgot gun control.
  • A Found... gregory... 2013/01/08 18:39:03
    A Founding Father
    You describe the agenda of the RWNJs that was defeated in the last election: to trash Medicare and Medicaid, Social Security, and all "welfare" assistance to the needy, to deprecate the "47%" of retired veterans, disabled, aged, and handicapped. I think perhaps you might want to lay aside these goals and leave them to the likes of Mitten, Rick Santorum, and the dozen or so other loneys who were told "No" by thinking citizens.
  • gregory... A Found... 2013/01/08 18:53:54
    gregory.brown.5030
    +2
    You have right and left confused. maybe your a righty and don't realize it.
  • A Found... gregory... 2013/01/08 19:14:25
    A Founding Father
    Good God, you can't be that stupid and still able to type on a keyboard. Forget it, I'm not interested in making conversation about twisted spin.
  • gregory... A Found... 2013/01/08 19:40:37
    gregory.brown.5030
    +2
    Hating and name calling. That's what the left does when confronted with facts.
  • gregory... hatter 2012/12/25 09:50:27
    gregory.brown.5030
    +4
    Grandma always said, "How smart you are depends on where you're standing at the time."
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