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Do you believe that the GM government bailout was a good thing?

Gracie - Proud Conservative 2012/08/18 19:28:53
Yes, he saved the American automotive industry...
No, it was a travesty for all involved...
Undecided
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First, let's get up to speed...watch this video so you can see how the money was borrowed and how it is being paid back.

http://www.dailyfinance.com/2012/08/15/taxpayers-gm-investmen...

Now, watch this video and see if you're as proud of GM and saving it as you should be. If you don't watch it, don't comment.


So, why does there continue to be so much proof that it's Obama that is directly and fragrantly outsourcing our tax dollars, and you still don't believe it?
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Top Opinion

  • The Lib Hater. 2012/08/18 23:01:56 (edited)
    No, it was a travesty for all involved...
    The Lib Hater.
    +82
    They are losing market share, and building a crappier product, and in the case of the Volt it is way overpriced. In other words, nothing has changed at GM. They haven't lowered their labor cost, their materials cost. This company is going down. It's been said before, some companies have a marketing problem, some a product problem, some have a labor problem, and some have management problems. GM has all those problems. Here we have 0bama running around handing out our money to state, and local governments knowing he can't do it forever, because sooner or later GM is going to drive right into reality, and guess who will get hurt the most? The sucker taxpayer. The subject, not the citizen. Now you Libs out there still want to know how 0bama is taking away our rights? Yep we are forcefully invested in GM. See libs if I had rights in this country, I would invest in what I WANT to INVEST in. Not what 0bama wants me to invest in. Let 0bama invest his own money in GM. Just leave us the hell alone.
    General Motors Is Headed For Bankruptcy -- Again... From Forbes.
    http://www.forbes.com/sites/l...

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Opinions

  • A Found... wtw 2012/08/19 20:14:22 (edited)
    A Founding Father
    Hopeless denial. The entire debate and conflict over GM is an example of the Republican Party and it's elected wishing for the collapse of the industry. They opposed and criticized Obama's decision forever, including this silly conversation yet today. As for those you don't know about, of course you don't know because you are not an "insider" in Washington or New York, and you refuse to accept what others not propagandizing on Faux news or the Glenn Beck show tell you.
  • A Found... wtw 2012/08/19 20:21:44
    A Founding Father
    Sun MicroSystems, Lockheed Martin, Boeing, Hughes Aerospace, ConAgra Foods, Tyson Foods, Westinghouse, Bank of America, Wells Fargo, Goldman Sachs, Olin Industries, to name just a few.
  • Schläue~© A Found... 2012/08/19 05:29:38
  • TheBadOne 2012/08/19 03:31:18
    No, it was a travesty for all involved...
    TheBadOne
    +4
    Now, I can't say that Obama's "flagrantly" spending money overseas as so much as GM is because of their status as a MNC, but as a person who opposed TARP, I opposed this as well. Not because it's some communist/socialist plot but as so much that GM was just a wasteful organization. I worked for them and Ford and the reason Ford didn't need bailout money was because everyone worked hard whereas GM was woefully inefficient by comparison.

    I'm not surprised because its the tic-for-tac nature of politics. I mean, of big banks hot bailouts, why not the auto unions? It doesn't make it right but that's the nature of the beast, and neither Democrats or Republicans want to admit that their political parties are as responsible for the mess as the other and hold them rightfully accountable. That, in addition to the wars, was the largest reason I abandoned the two-party system.
  • Gracie ... TheBadOne 2012/08/19 03:35:31
    Gracie - Proud Conservative
    +3
    You abandoning the two party system doesn't improve anything. I believe in working within the system to try and improve it. That hasn't happened in the last 100 years so you can't say it's not possible. I do know that a vote for Ron Paul or Gary Johnson will mean nothing. I work for the USPS so I understand what unions do to productivity.
  • Nick A Gracie ... 2012/08/19 04:32:16
    Nick A
    +1
    yeah, lets just continue to use the system that has gotten us this far in debt. it will never improve. the only way it does is if multiple other parties are included. why should we be subjected to having only two choices? why shouldnt there be more parties included? a vote for rp or gj is a vote that says we're tired of continued government waste, honestly. its a vote for real change.
  • Gracie ... Nick A 2012/08/19 15:24:51 (edited)
    Gracie - Proud Conservative
    We have only just begun. As you know you don't build a consensus in a couple of election cycles. If you believe in a third party, surely you know this. My point is that your candidate(s) don't have a chance any longer in this election. To vote for them is to render your vote meaningless. You have to concede when you lose and get ready for the next one.

    When you have too many factions, you make them impotent. Hitler was able to take over Germany because it was so divided that no one had any real power. That's the downside of being too divided. I'm not against a third party but you have to know when it's over. I voted for Perot twice and got Clinton, that was not my intent by that was certainly my outcome. I won't do it again.

    You guys seem to think that if you did get a third party candidate in the White House you'd have some kind of control? Nothing could be further from the truth.
    Even Ron Paul does things by playing the game, he is a Republican you know!
  • Nick A Gracie ... 2012/08/19 17:01:43
  • Gracie ... Nick A 2012/08/19 17:04:56
    Gracie - Proud Conservative
    Well, Romney or Obama is going to win. That's a fact unless something crazy happens. Take your pick. If you don't think there is any difference between Obama and Romney, you have your eyes closed. I'm not saying he's a true Conservative, but I do know he's not a Marxist. It's a clear choice to me and I'm alright with it. Afterall, last time I voted for McCain and nothing is worse than that!
  • Nick A Gracie ... 2012/08/19 17:16:59
    Nick A
    vote as you wish, i will most likely never vote for a candidate of the big two.
  • mwg0735 2012/08/19 03:30:39
  • Wulfdane mwg0735 2012/08/19 03:38:05 (edited)
    Wulfdane
    +4
    Isn't nice to know Obama's Liberal policies are paying to send American jobs overseas to?

    Another example of how far Liberals will go for votes.
  • Deputy Chief 2012/08/19 03:26:13
    No, it was a travesty for all involved...
    Deputy Chief
    +6
    No business should be too big to fail and require the tax payer bail them out. They made serious business mistakes and need to suffer the consequences just as the small business owner has to endure. You notice FORD did not need any bailout. Why? Because they were NOT irresponsible and made bad business decisions like GM did.
  • Savior 2012/08/19 03:21:28
    No, it was a travesty for all involved...
    Savior
    +7
    The only thing that comes out of anything government bailouts is either

    A. Hardworking people pay for the failures of a failing business

    or

    B. Inflation (due to more money being printed)
  • Gracie ... Savior 2012/08/19 03:23:51 (edited)
    Gracie - Proud Conservative
    +5
    Or C...both!
  • SJG 2012/08/19 03:10:45
    Yes, he saved the American automotive industry...
    SJG
    +2
    YUP, just ask all the people with jobs at GM and the companies that do business with them!
  • Gracie ... SJG 2012/08/19 03:20:19
    Gracie - Proud Conservative
    +3
    Well, I hope they didn't buy a bigger house or a more expensive car.
  • SJG Gracie ... 2012/08/19 15:13:15
    SJG
    Said like a true conservative instead of being happy for them. You got yours so the hell with them.
  • Gracie ... SJG 2012/08/19 15:30:18
    Gracie - Proud Conservative
    +1
    Wow, you missed the point entirely? I'm saying that they better be thinking of a Plan B because just because the government artificially propped them up by removing all of their debt and giving them a massive tax break (how's that for crony capitalism) they still have to succeed and that is highly doubtful.

    Where is the outrage of taking our tax dollars and giving the jobs to foreigners? That's what everyone screams about in the private sector, but suddenly GM is doing it and it's not a problem? I don't have mine, my job could go away just as easily as GM's did. So don't make baseless accusations that you know nothing about.
  • SJG Gracie ... 2012/08/19 19:03:28
    SJG
    What about Chrysler, was that also a bad move? Can't have it both ways. The Chrysler people are thrilled they still have jobs.

    So, your idea of Capitalism is the Ponchos Pilot plan. Let large businesses go bankrupt, screw the employees and wash your hands of the whole matter. How in the world would that have been better!!!!!!!!! No one has an answer for that and I am certain that you don't ether. When the world economy is crumbling around you, and a depression looms, you take extra ordinary risks. That is what happened, and that, in part, kept us out of depression. Again, if your idea is to let them go bankrupt, then you never studied economics.

    By the way, if your job can go away so easily, wouldn't you want someone to help, if at all possible, or should we just wash our hands of your problem?
  • Wulfdane SJG 2012/08/19 03:41:52 (edited)
    Wulfdane
    +3
    What jobs did Obama save, now that 70% of all GM cars are manufactured in China and paid for by American taxpayers?

    Obama didn't save any jobs, he lost jobs and all at our expense.

    I'm not sure if I should be amused by or if I should pity your blind ignorance.
  • SJG Wulfdane 2012/08/19 15:15:59
    SJG
    This is not an intelligent response, just another attempt to discredit the jobs he saved. You should be happy for the people that have those jobs, instead just more blah blah about unsubstantiated dribble and total ignorance!
  • Scott C 2012/08/19 02:58:21
    No, it was a travesty for all involved...
    Scott C
    +5
    A company the size of GM knows the risks involved in doing business in the free world - they have still not learned their lesson and they are still paying executives huge paychecks and still going bankrupt to boot - bailout only prolonged the inevitable.
  • Steve Boston 2012/08/19 02:58:06
    No, it was a travesty for all involved...
    Steve Boston
    +6
    GM is destined to become the Post Office of Automobile manufactures. Next question.
  • ~writersblock~ 2012/08/19 02:57:23
    No, it was a travesty for all involved...
    ~writersblock~
    +7
    I was a big GM fan before this occurred, now I wouldn't step one foot on their lots. They're government owned now, and basically owned by China since China owns the majority of the USA right now.
  • Denny 2012/08/19 02:56:52
    No, it was a travesty for all involved...
    Denny
    +8
    Government Motors was a joke it tossed out thousands of jobs at the dealerships they didn't give a damn about and since they're not selling cars it's back to the 70's. The stock isn't worth a crap and neither is the product. They have not paid back the stimulus and now need another. Thanks Obummer.
  • vis_viva 2012/08/19 02:55:36
    Yes, he saved the American automotive industry...
    vis_viva
    +1
    Easy answer. It paid off.Yes it's something you want to be careful of doing, but it worked out. Just like Chrysler in the 80's.
  • Gracie ... vis_viva 2012/08/19 03:08:08
    Gracie - Proud Conservative
    +2
    It was very unlike the bailout of Chrysler, the legal bondholders were screwed and money was transferred to the unions. He owed them.
  • RicardoCabeza 2012/08/19 02:30:22 (edited)
    Undecided
    RicardoCabeza
    +3
    It would have been better to have allowed GM to go into Chapter 11, restructure themselves and then give them funding afterward as opposed to the way it was handled by the Obama Administration... But that is what happens when people without business experience decide how to run business... Now they will go through chapter 11 regardless of the taxpayer funds...
  • RandyScott 2012/08/19 02:27:24
    No, it was a travesty for all involved...
    RandyScott
    +5
    Like any other business, if they can't stay in business without tax payers help they should go out of business, and if even half of what was displayed in the video is true, they should be put out of business.

    It's long past time for the people of this country to wake up to the fact that the Federal Government is not looking out for us, all they want is to maintain their power.
  • Adakin Valorem 2012/08/19 02:14:56
    No, it was a travesty for all involved...
    Adakin Valorem
    +5
    I wonder if we can get Indonesia to extradite Obama back to his childhood home...
  • urwutuis 2012/08/19 02:13:15
    Undecided
    urwutuis
    Forget the bailout, that's history.
    These are the people conservatives want to give more tax breaks to.
    You know, the job creators.
  • Gracie ... urwutuis 2012/08/19 02:22:22
    Gracie - Proud Conservative
    +5
    Obama already gave them billions of dollars in tax breaks. There is a difference between free market capitalism and crony capitalism. Obama practices the crony variety.
  • urwutuis Gracie ... 2012/08/19 07:07:24
    urwutuis
    Really? Since when? Is it different from the billions that went to KBR and Carlyle? The trillions "lost" by the pentagon? The billions in corporate welfare? Who do you think gets those tax breaks and what makes you think it'll turn in to jobs this time?
    It never has before and hasn't for the last 11 years.
  • Zippcodey urwutuis 2012/08/19 04:01:57
    Zippcodey
    +2
    Never forget the bailout, you will see when all is said and done there was nothing really gained, but a lot lost and Americans once again suckered.
  • urwutuis Zippcodey 2012/08/19 07:18:42
    urwutuis
    Of course. We always get stuck with the bill and we've been being suckered for a very long time.
    It's OK if you're a bank or a contractor but not an auto company?. Why single out the auto industry?
  • Zippcodey urwutuis 2012/08/19 13:42:16
    Zippcodey
    That is what the question is about.
  • HOMBRE 2012/08/19 02:04:57
    No, it was a travesty for all involved...
    HOMBRE
    +6
    What a waste of the people tax money.
  • Jack Sprat 2012/08/19 02:00:04 (edited)
    No, it was a travesty for all involved...
    Jack Sprat
    +7
    Since GM still owes officially $25 billion, and the stockholders lost everything, and only the unions really got anything out of the deal, all in all a complete BO Zo "success", where as typical only big government and the unions win, but at least they had to quit making the failed 'Bama car, called the Volt, 'cuz besides the government and "friends of BO Zo" couldn't afford to buy any more of the pieces of crap, and the Electric "car of the Future" (I think the Jetsons had one)took our money and like any of our socialist in Cheese also failed to turn a buck for the US taxpayers funding the failure.

    Gee, atleast the "Government workers army" in Finland have snazzy uniforms.....

    http://autoweek.com/storyimag...


    GovMot "comrade workers" must not have gotten the memo......apparently China is not just making uniforms for the Olympics, so we "sold" by giving all of the technology to our enemies, Cadilac and Hummer (vehical of our miltary) to our biggest enemy, just like GE gave them the technology of Boeing building airplanes in China, not North Carolina.

    gm volt assembly line
  • texasred 2012/08/19 01:59:22
    No, it was a travesty for all involved...
    texasred
    +9
    Propping up corporations only pushes the problem to a later timeframe. Typical libs "kicking the can down the road."

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