DNC to bus 20,000 Muslims to DNC Convention. Is this the ultimate deceit against women's rights?

There should be another option: the event is clearly not a coincidence, but the only hypocrites here are the conservatives who do the following:
1) complain that freedom of religion is suppressed, yet
2) see nothing wrong with simplistic prejudice against all of Islam.

It is true that there are christians and muslims who are dramatically anti-women's rights. But the MAJORITY of muslims in the United States do not have extremist views. Their only hostile view is that they do not believe Jesus is their savior (i.e., they are not christian).

The Americans who are all for tolerance of religion EXCEPT for Islam make me sick. They have no interest in trying to understand Islam from an actual muslim's point of view -- some give word snippets from the Qu'ran that show awful stuff (sort of like the snippets atheists use from the Bible to show how awful christianity is); some show outrageous examples of judicial misconduct in America that is aligned with crazy versions of so-called Sharia Law (although many are mis-attributed to muslims and actually apply to a host of other religions, including -- on occasion -- judicial misconduct aligned with radical christianity).

Most of the anti-Islam people use examples from other countries as evidence of how bad muslims are. Oddly, they don't do the same for christianity -- like the exorcisms/murders of children in West Africa in the name of Jesus, or the slaughter of muslim towns by christian milita. Apparently, American muslims are judged by their counterparts in the rest of the world, while American christians are not. Why the double standard?

Some muslims in the United States restrict women's rights to a lot of things, just like some christians restrict women's rights here. A lot of muslim women wear a form of headgear -- most wear something similar to what the Amish or Mennonite women wear on their heads (note: both of those groups are christian).

The big problem with this question is that it reinforces the idiocy that we should treat muslims as bad.

The real problem with Islam is this: it is a growing religion in the United States, and christians fear it will take over. This is nonsense, at least in the short term -- the number of muslims in America is ever-so-much smaller than the number of christians (even excluding the christian-in-name-only people).

Of course, if Christianity shrinks a lot over time and Islam grows, then as a DEMOCRACY, the United States will start to have more cultural ties to Islam than to Christianity. This is the worry -- not the false fact that muslims are bad to women or are secret terrorists or the like.

But it is impossible to make this fear compatible with the belief in democracy, with everyone having equal rights. So instead of confronting the real fear, many christians attack false images like the idea that muslim Americans are automatically anti-women.

Some are. Some aren't. But this is the same as with christians... think not? Ask a few women on the street if they think it is okay for ANY insurance company to not cover birth control. If you ask a random sample, you will find that the "christian" idea of denying contraception is considered VERY anti-woman... perhaps even more than the idea that a women must cover the top of her head.

What is obvious to you is actually false -- which says something about your perception.

Some of my very closest friends are christian -- devoted believers and active followers of Jesus. I have studied and taught at Catholic Universities and Seminaries, and I have a tremendous amount of respect for the beauty that Christianity can achieve, the hope and comfort it can give, and the force it can sometimes be for changing the world for the better.

So... what pieces of information gave you such poor insight into me? The fact that I also recognize the bitterness and hate that Christianity can inspire, the reality that it is also a bastion of intolerance and inspires violence? Or the fact that in the United States, more hate crimes and more *terrorist* acts are done by admitted christian fanatics than by muslims?

I think Christianity is fine. More than fine -- I think it is a wonderful, amazing thing that can give so much to the world. At its best, it is a powerful force for good. I am not a christian, but I truly admire its better aspects.

But its followers are not better than the rest of God's creations. They are no better than the rest of the people on this planet. They are no worse, either.

Right now, many christians feel incredible hatred towards muslims. The resentment and fear are growing, not diminishing, and that affects people. Most do not let it interfere with their lives, I think -- but a few cannot filter it out. The more unstable ones are excited into violence.

There are christian terrorist groups in the United States. But the violence I was predicting would be from the unstable people, not organized groups.

I was simply adding the following likely events together:
1) Democratic National Convention in Charlotte
2) Large Muslim group there at the same time
3) Republican (or anti-Democratic) organizers staging protests (at both)
4) A totally unscrupulous organizer connecting the two and trying to create antagonism
5) Angry protesters, pumped up by the cause

When you add those together and know that a few people are unstable, it makes a powerful mix. Given the sheer amount of free media that a violent attack would make -- and how immoral (or amoral) the power-brokers of both parties are -- I worry that someone will be pushed over their sanity edge into violence.

And the people who are most vulnerable to anti-Islamic hatred are, I think, christians. Not most christians by ANY means -- that's not what I was suggesting AT ALL.

I just mean that the one person who goes kooky and starts shooting in this case is, I think, more likely to be a christian who went nutso with hate than one of the muslims being bussed in.

I understand prejudice fairly well, so yes, I do think that is partly true. I do think that many Americans ignorantly think all muslims are alike, even though American muslims were murdered alongside American christians and jews during 9/11, even though American muslims have repeatedly condemned the attacks and worked effectively with law enforcement to stop other terrorist threats since then.

I think that even though what you describe occurred in foreign countries under different religious and political conditions than occur here, many Americans are unable to distinguish one muslim from another.

But I think the animosity has other roots as well. Many American muslims wear funny clothes, eat funny foods, and have different customs than mainstream Americans. They are seen as *different* -- and their population is growing. This growth is seen by many as a threat in itself.

Add that to the fact that the 9/11 attackers called themselves muslims (they were no more muslim than the KKK is christian), and we now have a situation where peaceful, decent Americans who even *look* like they might be muslim are harassej and attacked.

So... yes, we agree on some of the facts -- though I get the distinct impression from your post that you think the hatred towards American muslims is somehow justified by the crazed acts of foreign terrorists. Am I wrong?

And if I *am* wrong, wouldn't it be fair to then judge American christians by the terrorist acts of groups like the IRA (Irish Republican Army) which pioneered the concept of car bombs killing innocent victims, or the christian militia in Africa that go around destroying muslim villages, or the christian cults in the United States that believe in polygamy with underage girls?

So... why do you revile the one group yet defend the other? Both groups commit atrocities, though the majority population in each group is essentially peaceful and non-violent.

The bunch is already spoiled bc the Imam they asked to lead it was Siraj Wahhaj - this man in 1995 OPENLY STATED it was HIS DUTY and our duty as MUSLIMS TO REPLACE THE US CONSTITUTION WITH THE QURAN (and he is in SUPPORT of allowing into US COURTS shariah law and application of religiously "just" shariah law in the courts - "just" shariah application is very subjective indeed if you study how it has been applied, as it seems to not be capable of "just and fair" application to ALL PEOPLE regardless of gender or religious affiliation. - plz excuse my CAPS - i am not shouting just emphasis as no italics here)

Jibril Hough, is a radical NUT JOB, who claims Muslims are indigenous people just like the Native Americans, and lived in the Americas long before the arrival of Columbus in 1492.

THESE WERE THE LEADERS OF THIS EVENT – so the "barrel" is already QUITE SPOILED as Jibril Hough and Imam Siraj Wahhaj are no moderates. A SIMPLE GOOGLE SEARCH WILL SHOW YOU. Just by ACKNOWLEDGING these ppl - has COST THE DNC SOME SERIOUS CREDIBLITY!!

These individuals embrace Islamist supremacy and have demonstrated support for radical FASCIST type ideologies.

Average Americans just do not understand that Islam at its core IS a "political" religion. At its very foundations, it was used to enforce the political will and personal desires of its leaders and it STILL DOES SO TODAY especially in weaker "religiously mixed" countries such as AFRICA!! It is the hardest of all the "religions" to separate out from politics as you only have to look at all Islamic countries to see - it is BASED on much political strife in its beginings and foundations - it MUST be kept out of politics bc in its purest form, it has NO TOLERANCE FOR OTHER RELIGIONS, and it has biased political implications against others, along with extensive gender and racial prejudices such as with the JEWISH PPL!!

M. Zuhdi Jasser M.D., Founder and President of the AMERICAN ISLAMIC FORUM FOR DEMOCRACY has already stated his concerns...

quote:
"It is troubling that the Democratic National Convention has decided to associate its name and national political platform to this “Jummah at the DNC”, with its organizers and their known beliefs,"

This is what the DNC and the Democratic party has embraced??! They say they took it off the official parties website when it started to get HOT over it - but the damage is DONE!!

And for the record I am an INDEPENDANT! I vote the issues not the party, and with these actions they have alienated me... I have ALWAYS VOTED the ISSUES and the CANDIDATE - NOT THE PARTY - but sadly to say this is the FIRST TIME I have had to VOTE AGAINST A PARTY solely based on ITS OWN ACTIONS and what it is ENDORSING and trying to bring into its rank and file! Bringing PEOPLE IN is FINE - bringing a religious group in that has a leader that has OPENLY SPOKEN FOR SEPARATING THE US FROM ITS CONSTITUTION AND REPLACING IT WITH A QURANIC SYSTEM OF GOVERNMENT AS IN SAUDI ARABIA IS WHACK!!! why would they even REMOTELY ASSOCIATE THEMSELVES WITH THAT IDIOT?? They bring IDIOTS in and do not even associate with muslims like Dr. Jasser who's foundations STATED MISSION IS --- "to advocate for the preservation of the founding principles of the United States Constitution, liberty and freedom, through the separation of mosque and state,"

The sight of an "arab democrat" (as his sign stated) at the convention booing and voting down the inclusion of God and Jerusalem in the platform. WHAT HYPOCRITES THEY ARE!! Now I say HYPOCRITES bc I KNOW as muslims they have NO PROBLEM with God, it is with JEWS THEY HAVE a problem. I see no difference with this man doing this and a prejudiced white bigot in a 1950's convention jumping up and down and voting against the black man and the issues of THAT day relative to race!! When I saw that HATRED AND BIGOTRY coming from that "Arab Democrat", I SAW NO DIFFERENCE BETWEEN HIM AND A NAZI FASCIST RACIST IN HITLERS 1940 GERMANY!

PREJUDICE AGAINST PPL IS THE SAME NO MATTER THE SKIN COLOR IT HIDES BEHIND IS WHITE OR BROWN!

And if the DNC wanted to play to one religion then they should have been prepared to cater to other ones also! BUT - i didn't see a RABBI giving a TWO HOUR PRAYER MEETING in the SAME WAY the DNC invited THEM to hold a two-hour prayer service as one of the officially sanctioned pre-convention events beginning Friday! But they DID refuse welcome baskets from a local church group! SERIOUSLY?? If they are going to start including SPECIFIC RELIGIOUS GROUPS INTO THEIR PLATFORM AND NOT INCLUDING THE OTHERS WHEN THEY ASK FOR THE SAME CONSIDERATION, THEN THEY ARE BEING PREJUDICED!!

I believe in separation of church and state - and that includes temple and state - AND - MOSQUE AND STATE!! and the democratic party has LOST ITS MIND!

The bunch is already spoiled bc the Imam they asked to lead it was Siraj Wahhaj - this man in 1995 OPENLY STATED it was HIS DUTY and our duty as MUSLIMS TO REPLACE THE US CONSTITUTION WITH THE QURAN (and he is in SUPPORT of allowing into US COURTS shariah law and application of religiously "just" shariah law in the courts - "just" shariah application is very subjective indeed if you study how it has been applied, as it seems to not be capable of "just and fair" application to ALL PEOPLE regardless of gender or religious affiliation. - plz excuse CAPs im not shouting just emphasis)

Jibril Hough, is a radical NUT JOB, who claims Muslims are indigenous people just like the Native Americans, and lived in the Americas long before the arrival of Columbus in 1492.

THESE WERE THE LEADERS OF THIS EVENT – so the "barrel" is already QUITE SPOILED as Jibril Hough and Imam Siraj Wahhaj are no moderates. A SIMPLE GOOGLE SEARCH WILL SHOW YOU. Just by ACKNOWLEDGING these ppl - has COST THE DNC SOME SERIOUS CREDIBLITY!!

EVEN AMONG MUSLIMS SUCH AS MYSELF!!

These individuals embrace Islamist supremacy and have demonstrated support for radical FASCIST type ideologies.

Average Americans just do not understand that Islam at its core IS a "political" religion. At its very foundations, it was used to enforce the political will and personal desires of its leaders and it STILL DOES SO TODAY especially in weaker "religiously mixed" countries such as AFRICA!! It is the hardest of all the "religions" to separate out from politics as you only have to look at all Islamic countries to see - it is BASED on much political strife in its beginings and foundations - it MUST be kept out of politics bc in its purest form, it has NO TOLERANCE FOR OTHER RELIGIONS, and it has biased political implications against others, along with extensive gender and racial prejudices such as with the JEWISH PPL!!

M. Zuhdi Jasser M.D., Founder and President of the AMERICAN ISLAMIC FORUM FOR DEMOCRACY has already stated his concerns...

quote:
"It is troubling that the Democratic National Convention has decided to associate its name and national political platform to this “Jummah at the DNC”, with its organizers and their known beliefs,"

This is what the DNC and the Democratic party has embraced??! They say they took it off the official parties website when it started to get HOT over it - but the damage is DONE!!

And for the record I am an INDEPENDANT! I vote the issues not the party, and with these actions they have alienated me... I have ALWAYS VOTED the ISSUES and the CANDIDATE - NOT THE PARTY - but sadly to say this is the FIRST TIME I have had to VOTE AGAINST A PARTY solely based on ITS OWN ACTIONS and what it is ENDORSING and trying to bring into its rank and file! Bringing PEOPLE IN is FINE - bringing a religious group in that has a leader that has OPENLY SPOKEN FOR SEPARATING THE US FROM ITS CONSTITUTION AND REPLACING IT WITH A QURANIC SYSTEM OF GOVERNMENT AS IN SAUDI ARABIA IS WHACK!!! why would they even REMOTELY ASSOCIATE THEMSELVES WITH THAT IDIOT?? They bring IDIOTS in and do not even associate with muslims like Dr. Jasser who's foundations STATED MISSION IS --- "to advocate for the preservation of the founding principles of the United States Constitution, liberty and freedom, through the separation of mosque and state,"

The sight of an "arab democrat" (as his sign stated) at the convention booing and voting down the inclusion of God and Jerusalem in the platform. WHAT HYPOCRITES THEY ARE!! Now I say HYPOCRITES bc I KNOW as muslims they have NO PROBLEM with God, it is with JEWS THEY HAVE a problem. I see no difference with this man doing this and a prejudiced white bigot in a 1950's convention jumping up and down and voting against the black man and the issues of THAT day relative to race!! When I saw that HATRED AND BIGOTRY coming from that "Arab Democrat", I SAW NO DIFFERENCE BETWEEN HIM AND A NAZI FASCIST RACIST IN HITLERS 1940 GERMANY!

PREJUDICE AGAINST PPL IS THE SAME NO MATTER THE SKIN COLOR IT HIDES BEHIND IS WHITE OR BROWN!

And if the DNC wanted to play to one religion then they should have been prepared to cater to other ones also! BUT - i didn't see a RABBI giving a TWO HOUR PRAYER MEETING in the SAME WAY the DNC invited THEM to hold a two-hour prayer service as one of the officially sanctioned pre-convention events beginning Friday! But they DID refuse welcome baskets from a local church group! SERIOUSLY?? If they are going to start including SPECIFIC RELIGIOUS GROUPS INTO THEIR PLATFORM AND NOT INCLUDING THE OTHERS WHEN THEY ASK FOR THE SAME CONSIDERATION, THEN THEY ARE BEING PREJUDICED!!

I believe in separation of church and state - and that includes temple and state - AND - MOSQUE AND STATE!! and the democratic party has LOST ITS MIND!

Americans need to get behind Dr Zuhdi Jasser M.D., Founder and President of the AMERICAN ISLAMIC FORUM FOR DEMOCRACY whose mission statement is "to advocate for the preservation of the founding principles of the United States Constitution, liberty and freedom, through the separation of mosque and state,"

BUT - if they start talking about Sharia Law is OK and should be admitted into the US Courts - then even they are WHACK and must be written off.

but so far I have not seen this from him or his ppl.

i need to ask them their position before i advocate for them but from what i have seen of them, i believe they are sincere unlike CAIR and others who are only interested in furthering their own political agendas...

People - especially westerners - are so naive when it comes to the CENTURIES old games that "political" islam plays...
if you do NOT shut it down then it will only get worse, and btw - allowing muslim student associations to hold HITLER WEEKS is NOT helping bring into our society correct thinking individuals. I am SHOCKED that universities allow such things! Is it ok then for a KLAN STUDENT ASSOCIATION to hold BIRMINGHAM BOMBING WEEKS??

Many countries in Western Europe are just now seeing the havok and disharmony that political religious islam brings to its shores. Immigration policys should allow middle eastern ppl into its countries but perhaps pay attention to the religion they are allowing in WITH them. Christian Arabs in South America assimulate VERY WELL! some have even become PRESIDENTS! Multi-Culturalism is not the fault. In those European countries where they are seeing problems - indians, chinese, Africans, thai, and all other IMMIGRANT PEOPLE from differnt countries with different faiths get along fine - its only ONE RELIGION that does not get along well in its adopted host countries the world over. Not that all are problems to their adotive countries, but as u say, ONE apple.... and in THIS case ONE MASSIVE POLITICALLY SUBVERSIVE APPLE is upsetting the "cart" for all...

ppl should study India and see how well and tolerant this political "rotten apple" has worked out in THAT democracy...yes they DO have violence between the religious sects on ocassion, but its islam that has torn the country apart - literally - in the case of partrition...