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Did God create man before Adam and Eve?

MkB 2009/02/06 10:21:52
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I don't take the Bible literally, but there are passages that I find interesting. Case in point: Did mankind exist before Adam and Eve.

Genesis 1:27 - So God created man in his own image, In the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
Genesis 1:28 - And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: And have dominion...

Genesis 2:7 - And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.
Genesis 2:18 - And the Lord God said, It is not good that man should be alone; I will make him a help mate for him.

Genesis 2:21 - And the Lord God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead thereof;
Genesis 2: 22 - And the rib, which the Lord God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man.

What is your interpretation?
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  • Ryan Dickey 2013/06/04 22:44:28
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    Ryan Dickey
    Yes there were others before A & E. Eden is a place with God. God made them in his likeness (Having dominion over beast, fish, fowl.) God created the FIRST humans in HIS likeness with HIS authority. The authority over LIFE. The way you behave and speak and understand of the TRUTH. Understanding how God sees you and the power he has given you.

    Don't study translations!! Study the WORD! The WORD was written in Hebrew! If you look up the Hebrew words and what they mean they don't literally mean beast, fish, fowl. They mean your POWER to dominate the secondary meanings of the words. Look it up, take a trip down the rabbit hole! God hides things for the truly hungry and don't take anyones word for it. I use Bible study software like e-Sword and look up the REAL meanings to Gods WORDS.

    A & E sinned. They didn't get kicked out of a place like Disney. They took the knowledge of good and evil (both bad) and lost how God sees them. They lost heaven on earth.

    You can live life with God with all his authority he has given to you and understand the TRUTH!! Once you do, you are back in Eden right now! You don't wait to die to have heaven, heaven is now!

    It all depends on how you think, how you speak, how you view God (God is GOOD ALL THE TIME!!) and how you understand how God views you!!

    ...





    &



    Yes there were others before A & E. Eden is a place with God. God made them in his likeness (Having dominion over beast, fish, fowl.) God created the FIRST humans in HIS likeness with HIS authority. The authority over LIFE. The way you behave and speak and understand of the TRUTH. Understanding how God sees you and the power he has given you.

    Don't study translations!! Study the WORD! The WORD was written in Hebrew! If you look up the Hebrew words and what they mean they don't literally mean beast, fish, fowl. They mean your POWER to dominate the secondary meanings of the words. Look it up, take a trip down the rabbit hole! God hides things for the truly hungry and don't take anyones word for it. I use Bible study software like e-Sword and look up the REAL meanings to Gods WORDS.

    A & E sinned. They didn't get kicked out of a place like Disney. They took the knowledge of good and evil (both bad) and lost how God sees them. They lost heaven on earth.

    You can live life with God with all his authority he has given to you and understand the TRUTH!! Once you do, you are back in Eden right now! You don't wait to die to have heaven, heaven is now!

    It all depends on how you think, how you speak, how you view God (God is GOOD ALL THE TIME!!) and how you understand how God views you!!

    Again, don't take my word for it. It's in the Bible! What he says applies to now, not then, not after you die. He wants you to multiply by how you behave with others. Helping people find the Holy Spirit! You can't force it on others. You can only behave, believe, give GRACE and have authority God gives you. People will see this in you and will ask you how you live a happy life?? What's the secret?!!?

    I live, heaven on earth, right now, with Gods love. I am a god cause God says so. He has given me the same powers Jesus has, right now.

    I am NOT who he is, I represent WHAT he is, in his likeness!!! Powers and all!!

    That's why A & E was created. The heavens were made. Angels were made. The Earth was made. People were made. Angels have fallen. God created the first man to have his power to take back his earth from Satan!

    You having Gods power, Satan calls you Lord! Don't let him lie to you about who you are. Find out from God, from his Word! We are taking back this Earth for Gods glory!! But its taken a long time.

    Thats the Truth!
    (more)
  • Juliana Ryan Di... 2013/06/05 19:15:19
    Juliana
    Lol whuut?
  • B d 2013/04/30 02:39:08
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    B d
    I WANT TO MAKE IT PERFECTLY CLEAR TO THOSE WHO ARE INCLINED TO BELIEVE THAT THE 1ST "HUMANS" WERE MALE, FEMALE AND THEN A COMBINATION OF THE TWO. FOLKS, THE ONLY BEINGS AT THAT TIME THAT WERE CREATED WITH BOTH MALE AND FEMALE PARTS ARE IDENTIFIED AS "ANGELS". NOT HUMANS. THAT IS ALL. GOD BLESS YOU
  • Lloyd M... B d 2013/05/24 05:02:47
    Lloyd Mateko
    +1
    Angels are not beings they do not have gender, they were created as messengers of God, even the lucifer was one of them before. The bible clearly states that God created Man in His image, Adam and Eve. Before the bible stated that the earth was void, the spirit of God was hovering on waters. He was told to be fruitful and multiply. Adam had many children but Cain and Abel were mentioned amongst the many. Here we see that Eve is the mother of all creations, you research the meaning, everyone came from Eve and Adam, The bible clearly states that the first man sinned (Adam) it doesn't state that he was one of the people. That is why Jesus came as the second Adam.... Cain and Abel wher now old enough to marry if they could have jobs and the bible never stated how old where they, Cain was a farmer and Abel was rearing livestocks. The reason why Cain was afraid that people will kill him was that they all knew what had happenend they were angry that is whuy God gave him a mark that no one will kill him. Those people where his brothers and sisters. If God instructed Adam to be fruitful and multiply6 it means some of his children had gone to several parts of the world. When you read the bible read with understanding of the holy sopirit if you read it like a novel you will not get revelation.
  • Patrikios P 2013/03/24 21:05:11 (edited)
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    Patrikios P
    +1
    I think the key here is by reading the verses CAREFULLY. In Chapter 1, We see man and woman created in the sixth day. Chapter 1:27 So God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them. 28 Then God blessed them, and God said to them, “Be fruitful and multiply; fill the earth and subdue it; have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the air, and over every living thing that moves on the earth.” 29 And God said, “See, I have given you every herb that yields seed which is on the face of all the earth, and every tree whose fruit yields seed; to you it shall be for food. 30 Also, to every beast of the earth, to every bird of the air, and to everything that creeps on the earth, in which there is life, I have given every green herb for food”; and it was so. 31 Then God saw everything that He had made, and indeed it was very good. So the evening and the morning were the sixth day.

    Then Chapter 2:3 Then God blessed the seventh day and sanctified it, because in it He rested from all His work which God had created and made. 4 This is the history[c] of the heavens and the earth when they were created, in the day that the Lord God made the earth and the heavens, 5 before any plant of the field was in the earth and before a...

    I think the key here is by reading the verses CAREFULLY. In Chapter 1, We see man and woman created in the sixth day. Chapter 1:27 So God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them. 28 Then God blessed them, and God said to them, “Be fruitful and multiply; fill the earth and subdue it; have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the air, and over every living thing that moves on the earth.” 29 And God said, “See, I have given you every herb that yields seed which is on the face of all the earth, and every tree whose fruit yields seed; to you it shall be for food. 30 Also, to every beast of the earth, to every bird of the air, and to everything that creeps on the earth, in which there is life, I have given every green herb for food”; and it was so. 31 Then God saw everything that He had made, and indeed it was very good. So the evening and the morning were the sixth day.

    Then Chapter 2:3 Then God blessed the seventh day and sanctified it, because in it He rested from all His work which God had created and made. 4 This is the history[c] of the heavens and the earth when they were created, in the day that the Lord God made the earth and the heavens, 5 before any plant of the field was in the earth and before any herb of the field had grown. For the Lord God had not caused it to rain on the earth, and there was no man to till the ground; 6 but a mist went up from the earth and watered the whole face of the ground. 7 And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living being.

    By understanding this, we should keep on reading the verses carefully and not stop on a particular verse. In my understanding, NO. The humans are created once. Don't miss verse 4 of Chapter 2! The story of the creation of humans were expanded on verse 4, 5, 6 AND 7. Read them carefully. This isn't limiting the understanding of the verse, this is by REALLY understanding the verses in a careful manner. Believe me, I wish there was such speculation that humans were created twice in the creation account. I would ask God when I see Him face to face why He created man twice, but in this case, its not.
    (more)
  • Walt 2013/01/25 11:04:33
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    Walt
    +1
    Many Christians try to limit scripture, reality, and God by believing that if something pertaining to the Biblical recounting of events is not in scripture, then it didn't happen.

    I do not presume. I would not.

    God is God. I am merely a speck on the face of the world by comparison - and so is every other human being.
  • clevela... Walt 2013/02/09 05:36:45
    cleveland.tolliver.9
    THATS YOUR OPINION THAT WE LIMIT, some just want to understand it better you jerk. im inclinded to beleive god is happy people are trying to understand and read the bible period verses letting it collect dust and not search for him at all.
  • cleveland.tolliver.9 2013/01/25 04:16:35
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    cleveland.tolliver.9
    IM GLAD others are noticing the two creations. did anyone notice where dinosaurs and pangea fits into the readings in the very first page? I'd like for others to remember that the bible should be taken literally because it provides resolutions for people questions, unlike science. science just leaves more questions. but science can fit in to discussion if u aim ur questions in the right direction. people claim that a different god made different people is BLASPHEMING> y would u beleive just some of the bible and not all? anyhow for more interesting things look up the list of begottens and write the nmae down in order and thier is a story or prophecy in the names that may surprise u, being that over hundreds of years MENs hands wrote the bible and it still unviels the unseen things people for centuries upon centuries never knew. THATS AN ACT OF GOD! peace be with u all. AMEN
  • peterj 2012/10/14 12:35:23
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    peterj
    +1
    Yes, There were other mankind and civilizations existed, when God created Adam and Eve. The bible itself proves.
    1) After Cain Kills Abel, he cries: "Behold, thou hast driven me out this day from the face of the earth; and from thy face shall I be hid; and I shall be a fugitive and a vagabond in the earth; and it shall come to pass, that every one that findeth me shall slay me." (Gen-4:14) Where "every one" came from?
    2) Then Cain run away, to Land of Nod, finds his wife, lived happily ever after."And Cain went out from the presence of the LORD, and dwelt in the land of Nod, on the east of Eden. And Cain knew his wife; and she conceived, and bare Enoch: and he built a city, and called the name of the city, after the name of his son, Enoch.(Gen 4-16, 17)
    Where he got wife from, and how he built a city?
  • MkB peterj 2012/10/14 19:02:16
    MkB
    Very good point. Thanks.
  • miracle 2012/07/04 00:36:09 (edited)
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    miracle
    +1
    Please believe that God made male and female before Adam and Eve. It says clearly that God created all his work and by the seventh day he was done and he rested. Adam and Eve was made from another God. A Lord God.One not Superior to the creator of the earth, He was part of this creation. The first set of people was on the earth centuries before Adam and Eve and these people was very strong, happy and had powers They were spoiled by there heavenly father. The almighty God, gave this Lord God permission to make a man for some reason, So now we have two sets of humans, one created directly from the almighty God. because The almighty God don't have to draft or make a people but this Lord God had to draft/make Adam from dirt, and eve from Adam. But the almighty God says' and It Is done. He creates, not make He do not have to. What he says It will be. I know that Moses wrote the book of Genesis but there Is facts In the bible that are missing due to deep preduces and jealousy and hatred. They do not want anyone to know that there Is one set of people superior, (made directly from God Almighty) to the other (the sons of Adam) We will all find out later because the Almighty God says, " He will set things straight. The First people had no sin, and was on earth way before Adam was made There skin color was different than the sons of Adam. Please don't think that the bible was not toyed with. The almighty God allowed this to happen too, for some reason as well.
  • Please leave comment.
    STEELANGEL 凸 Metal Up 凸
    Here we see in Genesis chapter 1 that God created men and woman and then ordered them to be fertile and multiply.


    Originally Posted by Gen 1:26-28 (NAB)
    26
    Then God said: "Let us make man in our image, after our likeness. Let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, the birds of the air, and the cattle, and over all the wild animals and all the creatures that crawl on the ground."
    27
    God created man in his image; in the divine image he created him; male and female he created them.
    28
    God blessed them, saying: "Be fertile and multiply; fill the earth and subdue it. Have dominion over the fish of the sea, the birds of the air, and all the living things that move on the earth."

    Now here in Genesis chapter 2 we see God making Adam and Even in the Garden of Eden.


    Originally Posted by Gen 2:7 (NAB)
    the LORD God formed man out of the clay of the ground and blew into his nostrils the breath of life, and so man became a living being.

    Genesis 1 and Genesis 2 are the same story, told from different view points. In other words, the man and woman in Genesis 1 is Adam and Eve.

    Basically, the two chapters show two sides of the same God.

    Genesis 1 shows God the All-Powerful Creator of the Universe - "And God said, 'Let there be light', and there was light".

    And then in Genesis 2,...

    Here we see in Genesis chapter 1 that God created men and woman and then ordered them to be fertile and multiply.


    Originally Posted by Gen 1:26-28 (NAB)
    26
    Then God said: "Let us make man in our image, after our likeness. Let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, the birds of the air, and the cattle, and over all the wild animals and all the creatures that crawl on the ground."
    27
    God created man in his image; in the divine image he created him; male and female he created them.
    28
    God blessed them, saying: "Be fertile and multiply; fill the earth and subdue it. Have dominion over the fish of the sea, the birds of the air, and all the living things that move on the earth."


    Now here in Genesis chapter 2 we see God making Adam and Even in the Garden of Eden.


    Originally Posted by Gen 2:7 (NAB)
    the LORD God formed man out of the clay of the ground and blew into his nostrils the breath of life, and so man became a living being.


    Genesis 1 and Genesis 2 are the same story, told from different view points. In other words, the man and woman in Genesis 1 is Adam and Eve.

    Basically, the two chapters show two sides of the same God.

    Genesis 1 shows God the All-Powerful Creator of the Universe - "And God said, 'Let there be light', and there was light".

    And then in Genesis 2, we see God the Loving Father. You can see this in the image of God carefully molding man out of the clay, walking with man through the Garden, and allowing man to name all the animals in the world.

    And, making man in "our" image and in "our" likeness certainly stumps those who deny the trinity! We can always wonder if we are truly in God's image, but we know that we are in Christ's image, from all accounts given.
    (more)
  • COMankind 2011/01/09 01:29:52 (edited)
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    COMankind
    I was in organized religion for years, but gave up fast food and decided to grow my own vegetables.



    That being said, this topic was always tough. Myth or not...Fossil record vs. faith, etc. There were a few items that helped me:

    1) After the 7th day, the definition of "earth" or "world" switched gears. Moses (who allegedly wrote the book) was no longer talking about the formation of the world. He was talking about the history of his world. The genealogy of Gen 5 supports this..

    2) Adam was created outside the Garden. He was then placed in the Garden of Eden, which was created in the middle of a desolate land. This Garden was "in the east" - east of what? The left side of the earth? (Moses had a limited grasp of what the 'earth' was)

    3) The Book of Enoch (quoted in Jude) depicts the entire globe and sees 7 mountains with jewels on them. 3 to the east. 3 to the south. And one mountain above all others - where God's throne appears to be. This appears to align with the concept that Eden was the start of Judah, Israel, the region of the Mediterranean, etc., but there were other regions planted around the globe.

    Conceptually, it makes sense. Like a gardener planting seeds. If I wanted my garden to be populated with all kinds of vegetables, i'd plant a patch of tomatoes here, cucumbers ...

    I was in organized religion for years, but gave up fast food and decided to grow my own vegetables.



    That being said, this topic was always tough. Myth or not...Fossil record vs. faith, etc. There were a few items that helped me:

    1) After the 7th day, the definition of "earth" or "world" switched gears. Moses (who allegedly wrote the book) was no longer talking about the formation of the world. He was talking about the history of his world. The genealogy of Gen 5 supports this..

    2) Adam was created outside the Garden. He was then placed in the Garden of Eden, which was created in the middle of a desolate land. This Garden was "in the east" - east of what? The left side of the earth? (Moses had a limited grasp of what the 'earth' was)

    3) The Book of Enoch (quoted in Jude) depicts the entire globe and sees 7 mountains with jewels on them. 3 to the east. 3 to the south. And one mountain above all others - where God's throne appears to be. This appears to align with the concept that Eden was the start of Judah, Israel, the region of the Mediterranean, etc., but there were other regions planted around the globe.

    Conceptually, it makes sense. Like a gardener planting seeds. If I wanted my garden to be populated with all kinds of vegetables, i'd plant a patch of tomatoes here, cucumbers here, and carrots over there.

    But according to the Bible, there was only one test for all of mankind. The Garden was a sort of courtroom made at some point. Adam was being used as a test for the rest of mankind, just like Job...and that's where the Bible picks up. Like the transcription of a trial.
    (more)
  • Cody 2009/10/17 01:29:50
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    Cody
    This shouldn't be debateable! Gensis 1 talks about God creating everything in the six days 24 hour time periods. God created man in Genesis 1:26 which was on the 6th day of creation! Whih states that God made man in His image.

    In Genesis 2:7 talks about what God formed man out of! All Genesis 2 talks about is the creation in deeper detail. If there was 2 seperate creations of man then why would need to recreate man without sin? And who died for the sins of the man before Adam and Eve? I know that there come about many questions on scripture but u need to study each verse closely and read each verse carefully!
  • consuel... Cody 2011/03/31 14:41:58
    consuella.canada
    +1
    This makes so much sense, my Dad and I can not agree on these verses.
  • xris Cody 2011/06/13 16:38:30
    xris
    +3
    with all due respect, maybe you should "pay more attention" to each verse before telling others to. case in point look at Gen. 1:24-28 and then look at Gen. 2: 7,19. If chapter 2 of Genesis is nothing more than detail, wouldn't it go with animals being created BEFORE man as in chapter 1? Also pay attention to the word, "create" and the word "form". Create is used in ch. 1 and form is used in ch. 2. I am Christian and do not want to be a stumbling block, I am just pointing this out to you.
  • Janet Baxter 2009/10/02 01:35:16
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    Janet Baxter
    +2
    In Genesis chapter one God created man and female after his own image, they ate fruits and herbs. people can't understand that.. Why? The land of Nod was populated when Cain was kicked out of Eden. Who and where did the people of Nod come from? Ministers ignore this,I never heard anyone question where Nod came from.. Cain married a woman ther so where did there come from?
  • Larry M... Janet B... 2011/10/19 01:36:31
    Larry Maddox
    +3
    GEN 1:27-28
    Says So God created man in his own image, in the image of Created he him; male and female created he (them)
    28
    And God blessed (them), and God said unto (them), Be friutful, and multiply, and replenish the earth,
    I guess what in saying is he created (them) key word being (them) and gave (them) after blessing them the ability to reproduce there was no rib at this point. And Adam and Eve was not told to go fourth and multiply after creating Eve
  • Carpe Diem *In God I Trust* 2009/05/22 00:42:00
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    Carpe Diem *In God I Trust*
    +1
    This explains in detail with numerous evidence the creation story.



    Annette Akerman Number of Words
    265 Autumn Eve St. Approx. 14,000
    Henderson, NV 89074 First Series Rights
    702-487-6144 Copyright 1992
    Originally written 9812 Park Lane Pl.
    Dallas, TX 75220

    THE EIGHT DAY

    By

    Annette Akerman

    INTRODUCTION

    Abundance! God created in opulent, glorious, profuse, spell-binding abundance. Wherever eye could see, whatever area created, God created with flourish; from desert sands to mountain peaks, from lavish glades to dense forests to barren plains. God created with elaborate color, texture, size and imagination. He made the sun to rule the day, and lesser lights to rule the night: trees and grasses and herbs; a sufficiency of orchards and meadowland; tall forests and mossy glades with seeds within to replenish. The waters teemed with multitudes of living creatures; the great sea-monsters and every living creature that moved; the birds – every winged bird after its kind; flocks of geese and beasts of the earth, and everything that crept upon the ground. Abundance! Overflowing, profuse, lavish abundance. Nothing was spared; not color, nor texture, nor size. With magnificent fullness and array God created his earth, his universe.
    And God crea...





















    This explains in detail with numerous evidence the creation story.



    Annette Akerman Number of Words
    265 Autumn Eve St. Approx. 14,000
    Henderson, NV 89074 First Series Rights
    702-487-6144 Copyright 1992
    Originally written 9812 Park Lane Pl.
    Dallas, TX 75220

    THE EIGHT DAY

    By

    Annette Akerman

    INTRODUCTION

    Abundance! God created in opulent, glorious, profuse, spell-binding abundance. Wherever eye could see, whatever area created, God created with flourish; from desert sands to mountain peaks, from lavish glades to dense forests to barren plains. God created with elaborate color, texture, size and imagination. He made the sun to rule the day, and lesser lights to rule the night: trees and grasses and herbs; a sufficiency of orchards and meadowland; tall forests and mossy glades with seeds within to replenish. The waters teemed with multitudes of living creatures; the great sea-monsters and every living creature that moved; the birds – every winged bird after its kind; flocks of geese and beasts of the earth, and everything that crept upon the ground. Abundance! Overflowing, profuse, lavish abundance. Nothing was spared; not color, nor texture, nor size. With magnificent fullness and array God created his earth, his universe.
    And God created man in his own image. He created male and female, and he blessed them; and told them to be fruitful and multiply and replenish the earth, and subdue it, and have dominion over it: the fishes of the sea, the birds of the heavens, and over every moving thing that moves upon the earth. He gave man every herb yielding seed which was upon the face of the whole earth; every tree in which is the fruit of a tree yielding seed that was upon the face of the earth to be used for food: for every beast of the earth, and to every bird of the heavens, and to every thing that crept upon the earth that had life. He gave every green herb for food. Seeing what he had made and seeing that it was very good, God finished his creation of the sixth day.
    Did god also create mankind; an abundance of humans to inhabit the earth? Or did he create one male and one female only, namely, Adam and Eve? Did he act lavishly and with imagination, design and assortment, or did he act illiberal and make only one man and one woman?
    Our churches would have us believe, and they teach us that we are all descendants of one source: Adam and his wife, Eve. However, much confusion and many questions arise if this story holds true. Theology has created many unresolved questions with argumentative factions that stimulate unrest and confusion. Still many people hold on to this religious concept as the only explanation for our ultimate creation.
    Those who would reject this idea have turned to an even more confusing theory, that of Darwin. Darwin would have us believe that we are descendants of the apes. His reasoning for this is due to his observations on the Islands of the Galapagos where he noticed that as the finches that flourished there “multiplied and ‘took over’ the island, variations among individual finches offered the birds different MICROENVIRONMENTAL NICHES in the islands. (1) He noted that some finches had beaks designed for boring as a woodpecker does; some had beaks designed for eating seeds; and others had parrot-like beaks designed for feeding on buds and fruits. This process was called NATURAL SELECTION, and it is used to substantiate that ape was the forerunner of mankind. In fact, this theory is so widely accepted now that the Field Museum in Chicago, Illinois, has a section devoted to the evolution of man from ape.
    There is the “Big Bang” theory wherein there was a big explosion in the middle of nothing, and from that came a floating, molten rock which cooled and became Earth. Then, through spontaneous regeneration, that is, with all conditions being correct, life in the form of a one-celled amoeba appeared and more complicated life forms emerged that gradually escalated to include mankind.
    “Revolving around the sun in 365 days each of 24 hours, our earth, which was then only a vaguely shaped gaseous sphere, progressively cooled, and it was only when at the end of chemical changes with which this book is not concerned, it reached a temperature well below 300 degrees Centigrade, that the first living forms could survive. In our own day some bacteria, called thermophiles, live in hot springs, but even the most hardy of them can scarcely bear a temperature of 85 degrees Centigrade.
    “There is therefore no option but to agree that matter preceded life and that life could only have appeared on the planet at a certain favorable moment in the chemical development of the earth’s surface. Accepting this, only two possible hypotheses remain to explain the origin of life on earth: either life came from elsewhere, from some other planet in the Universe (this is the theory of panspermy), or life was born on the earth itself by spontaneous generation as a result of certain complex chemical reactions.” (2)
    The Bible says creation began with God, and after many years of study and research pouring over the first few chapters of Genesis, it appears this is the best and most probable, as well as most plausible answer to the question of where did man really come from ? All of biblical scripture correlates with the findings of anthropologists and archaeologists. We are not all the offspring of Adam and Eve. Rather … well, let’s take a look at the knowledge supplied to us through science, anthropology, and archaeology and construct the creation puzzle in the first few chapters of Genesis as written by God.

    Chapter 1
    GENESIS 1 AND 2

    At first glance, it would appear that the verses of creation in Genesis 1 and 2 are vague. They do not come out and tell us specifically whether God created one man and one woman, or an abundance of men and women. Is it really vague, or are we not looking at it in its proper context? It uses the term “man” in the generic sense, which can be taken as singular or plural, as can “male and female” be used in the singular or the plural context. What Genesis does say about man is that man was made in the image of God. By examining what God says about himself in his opening statements of the scripture, and by observing his previous creations, we have a clue as to what God was doing at the time of creation.
    From the statement in Gen. 1:26, “Let ‘us’ make man ….”, we find that God is a plurality. He was not talking about himself, but he speaks to his Son and the Spirit. We also know that he lavishly and richly supplied the earth with foliage and water and beasts of every imaginable kind to inhabit. These he made in copious number. He makes man in his image, both male and female, and he says to them “Be fruitful and multiply and REPLENISH the earth.”
    Man was instructed to REFILL the earth; to supply it anew. If God had created just one man and just one woman, his command to them would have been to FILL UP the earth, not REFILL the earth. God further tells them, “have dominion over everything that moves upon the earth.” What sway, control, or authority might a single man and a single woman have over the abundance of animals created in the first verses of Genesis? Their lives would be in constant danger of predator animals. However, there is strength in numbers. Several mal and female of the species of man could reasonably carry out these commands.
    It must be noted here that there is no mention in the first chapter of Genesis of special instructions being given to the newly created males and females, such as not eating from a specific tree. No boundaries are set. In fact, God says they are to replenish the earth and to have dominion over it: All the animals, ALL the trees, ALL the earth! Gen. 1:29 “Behold, I hve given you EVERY herb yielding seed, which is upon the face of ALL the earth … to you it shall be for food.”
    God had made the entire, spherical earth. God looked over his creation, all that he had made, and called it good and he rested. God finished his creation in six days and in Chapter 2, when everything has been placed in motion, he suddenly says some very unusual things. First, he says in Gen. 2:4 “These are the generations of the heavens and of the earth when they were created.” Generations indicates more than one generation. Generation, singular, is defined in the dictionary as the term of years accepted as the average period between the birth of parents and the birth of their offspring. Conveniently, God gives us a glimpse into what he might have meant in using the term in the plural. This clue comes from
    II Pet. 3:8 where he says, “But forget not this one thing, beloved, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as a day.”
    God says in Gen. 2:5 “And there was not a man to till the ground.” Science has proven that the earth existed many thousands of years before Adam and Eve were in existence. God has simply stated what anthropologists have discovered: That there was a time when man did not cultivate the earth. In an Introduction to Anthropology, it states, “Most anthropologists and historians believe that the earliest domestication of food sources, and hence the first steps toward population growth and complex social organization, occurred in the Near East in the region of the Tigress-Euphrates rivers.” (3) Cultivation of the earth is mentioned here because that was the job assigned to Adam. Further on in an Introducation to Anthropology it says, “The characteristics of the pre-agricultural Natufian settlements of the Near East have been analyzed in detail ….”(4) In Gen. 2:5, God states it more succinctly, “and there was not a man to till the ground.”
    Two things are instantly clear from this statement. First, God has to have created no one in Genesis 1, or he has made a mistake in Genesis 2 with his statement that no man was found to till the ground. Actually, neither of the two is incorrect. It appears that what God has done is this: He has completed the making of man (the hunter); both male and female. He has given them clear instructions and has rested from his work. And in Chapter 2 He creates a special man for a specific purpose.
    The next detail to notice is where He places the Adam of Genesis 2 when He creates him. The Bible says that God placed him in Eden, and the rivers bordering that land are Pishon, which encompassed the whole land of Havilah; the Gihon, which encompassed the whole land of Cush; the Giddekel, or Tigress, which went in from Assyria, and the Euphrates.
    In Genesis 1, God tells his created male and female species to subdue the earth. He also tells them he is giving them every herb yielding seed which is upon the face of ALL the earth. In Genesis 2, Jehovah God plants “a garden eastward in Eden, and there he put the man whom he had formed.” God sets this man, named Adam, in the middle of a garden, and gives him boundaries, as well as orders to dress and keep the garden. Further, he instructs this Adam NOT to eat of a certain tree. This is in total conflict with the instructions he has previously given to the male and female creation of Genesis 1.
    It appears the God has created in Genesis 1 a panoply of men and women; some brown in color, some yellow, some red and some white; some with blond hair, some with black, some with red; some with round, almond-shaped eyes, some sloe-eyed; some hairless, others not. And God beholds the generations of his handiwork and decides to place on earth a special man for a specific purpose: a land-owner, a tiller of the ground – someone who will do what heretofore has not been done. So he creates a new race of people, different from those he has already created. God creates Adam, the Jew, a tiller of the ground to bring civilization to the world and a deeper knowledge of God so that man might acknowledge God in all that he does. God brings before this man, Adam, all that he has created so Adam can name them. He introduces Adam to all that he has made: the skies and seas, the trees and fields and flowers and animals, and – oh yes, of course, God introduces Adam to the population of the world that Adam will be deali
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  • Michell... Carpe D... 2011/03/01 02:49:32
    MichelleBaker
    +4
    I am so glad I read this as I was trying to make a point to an Athiest on face book that God had created others before creating Adam and eve, I am a christian and yes i take the bible literally but in that statment God wants us to seek him constantly and ask for Knowledge wisdom truth and understanding, and as our lord said people will perish from the lack of Knowledge, and not all who cry holy holy shall enter the kingdom of heaven, you see God wants us to take the bible and ask him for understanding and when he does give it to, you then seek the answers you need to confirm it, God always confirms this through others like me finding this. and another thing before I completely read Annette's post on God creating others before Adam and eve I wrote this and saved it and it vertually confirmed what she was saying.
    God created others in the time of Adam and eve as it states in Genesis1:26-31 and you have to seek God for the understanding you need, a lot of people read the bible and take it to be just that, that God created only Adam and eve and they populate the world then that would mean incest , why would God allow incest to populate the world then change the rules to now condemn it and say it’s wrong to have relations with your brother and sister doesn’t make sense other than ...
    I am so glad I read this as I was trying to make a point to an Athiest on face book that God had created others before creating Adam and eve, I am a christian and yes i take the bible literally but in that statment God wants us to seek him constantly and ask for Knowledge wisdom truth and understanding, and as our lord said people will perish from the lack of Knowledge, and not all who cry holy holy shall enter the kingdom of heaven, you see God wants us to take the bible and ask him for understanding and when he does give it to, you then seek the answers you need to confirm it, God always confirms this through others like me finding this. and another thing before I completely read Annette's post on God creating others before Adam and eve I wrote this and saved it and it vertually confirmed what she was saying.
    God created others in the time of Adam and eve as it states in Genesis1:26-31 and you have to seek God for the understanding you need, a lot of people read the bible and take it to be just that, that God created only Adam and eve and they populate the world then that would mean incest , why would God allow incest to populate the world then change the rules to now condemn it and say it’s wrong to have relations with your brother and sister doesn’t make sense other than that God created others but created Adam and eve with knowledge of God and they were the one’s to go out and give Gods law and teach them how to cultivate the earth and be Godly and live without sin, but that did not happen as when he then created Eve from the rib of Adam, and she was tempted to eat the fruit from the forbidden tree of knowledge and Adam ate of this fruit to, that is when sin entered the world and they new of good and evil and because they did this God banished them from the Garden, but they were still blessed with the knowledge of God, So they went into the world teaching others and others who were already here, teaching there children and there children teaching generations of Adam and eve, that is why we have religion and faith today and some don’t because they don’t seek the guidance of God, People state the bible as, BASIC INSTRUCTIONS BEFORE LEAVING EARTH, It is only God that can reveal the full instructions to the people he chooses through faith , so yes I take the bible literally but I seek the answers that God so wants us to look for and understand, not to just read the bible and take it literally without finding out answers, as God said people will perish through the lack of knowledge.
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  • Michael... Michell... 2013/06/12 20:47:15
    Michael Lee
    +3
    I don't find this to be logical. 1st you begin by saying Adam and Eve were created to go out into the world and teach others about God and how to live a life without sin....then you turn to say that it was by Eve eating of the tree and giving Adam as well, that sin came into the world?! If sin came into the world via Adam and Eve it would mean that "those created before them" were sinless. 2ndly it wasn't through Adam and Eve spreading the gospel that mankind learned of God. God Himself communicated with mankind besides Adam and Eve. When we look at the account of Cain and Abel; when Cain slew Abel, God Himself spoke directly to Cain.....and Cain KNEW who He was!! He wasn't afraid; which means he was familiar with God and used to communicating with Him.

    Many people ask the question "Where did Cain find a wife if there was no one else?" But the bible didn't account for the number of years that passed by before this incident with Cain and his brother! Many years could have passed by and many generations developed and started spreading over the land. By this time there would have been others in different areas whereby Cain could have found a wife.

    The point on incest; God allowing it and then finding it to be wrong presently. We need to take things in the time it was done. David w...

    I don't find this to be logical. 1st you begin by saying Adam and Eve were created to go out into the world and teach others about God and how to live a life without sin....then you turn to say that it was by Eve eating of the tree and giving Adam as well, that sin came into the world?! If sin came into the world via Adam and Eve it would mean that "those created before them" were sinless. 2ndly it wasn't through Adam and Eve spreading the gospel that mankind learned of God. God Himself communicated with mankind besides Adam and Eve. When we look at the account of Cain and Abel; when Cain slew Abel, God Himself spoke directly to Cain.....and Cain KNEW who He was!! He wasn't afraid; which means he was familiar with God and used to communicating with Him.

    Many people ask the question "Where did Cain find a wife if there was no one else?" But the bible didn't account for the number of years that passed by before this incident with Cain and his brother! Many years could have passed by and many generations developed and started spreading over the land. By this time there would have been others in different areas whereby Cain could have found a wife.

    The point on incest; God allowing it and then finding it to be wrong presently. We need to take things in the time it was done. David was said to be "a man after God's own heart". David had MANYYY wives; yet at that time it wasn't considered wrong. Presently it is considered polygamy!! Similarly at this present time incest is wrong! In fact even in later biblical days it was found to be wrong.

    We need to remember God is a sovereign God and can do as He pleases. To us humans with limited insight we won't be able to comprehend most of what He did; and i'm glad, because that would mean that God is no smarter than a human being!
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  • Michael... Carpe D... 2013/06/12 20:25:32
    Michael Lee
    +3
    You raise very valid points; there's 1 thing I don't agree with though. II Pet. 3:8 where he says, “But forget not this one thing, beloved, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as a day.” Ok, but in the account it specifically states "And there was evening, and there was morning - the first day". This shows that it was literal days by which God carried out these acts and not thousands of years. Let's not belittle the greatness of our God.
  • Galileus 2009/05/21 16:16:31 (edited)
    Please leave comment.
    Galileus
    +1
    Also nobody knows with whom Adam and Eve's kids got "married" and formed cities. It is simply, not mentioned.

    The modern Incest explanation given by some is way too twisted to be considered. Other possible suppositions to explain people popping out of nowhere in Genesis happen to contradict other passages. In the Bible, there's no explaining of these people at least. And that makes a contradiction in itself.

    But the story is good.
  • Philo-Publius 2009/03/29 02:52:24
    Please leave comment.
    Philo-Publius
    +1
    Yes, man existed before Adam, if we take Adam to mean the man who was formed and placed in a garden, but I urge you to study with me here, MkB with an open mind... you might be surprised at what a little bible study can accomplish!

    Genesis 1:27 - So God created man in his own image, In the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.

    "Male and female" is "ZAKAR V'NEKABAH" in the original text, and it means they were created BOTH male and female, in other words, ANDROGYNOUS. This explains a LOT, especially why it was then necessary to "SEPARATE" this creature in the next chapter (though this act was performed not by "God" but rather occurred naturally through very lengthy natural evolution [involution] processes. There is a WONDERFUL dialogue of Plato [the Sympsoium] the relevant part of which is aligned with exactly this interpretation:

    "The original human nature was not like the present, but different. The sexes were not two, as they are now, but originally three in number; there was man, woman, and a union of the two, having a name corresponding to this double nature, which once had a real existence, but is now lost, and the word "Androgynous" is only preserved as a term of reproach. In the second place, THE PRIMEVAL MAN WAS ROUND, HIS BACK AND SIDES FORMING A CIRCLE...









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    Yes, man existed before Adam, if we take Adam to mean the man who was formed and placed in a garden, but I urge you to study with me here, MkB with an open mind... you might be surprised at what a little bible study can accomplish!

    Genesis 1:27 - So God created man in his own image, In the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.

    "Male and female" is "ZAKAR V'NEKABAH" in the original text, and it means they were created BOTH male and female, in other words, ANDROGYNOUS. This explains a LOT, especially why it was then necessary to "SEPARATE" this creature in the next chapter (though this act was performed not by "God" but rather occurred naturally through very lengthy natural evolution [involution] processes. There is a WONDERFUL dialogue of Plato [the Sympsoium] the relevant part of which is aligned with exactly this interpretation:

    "The original human nature was not like the present, but different. The sexes were not two, as they are now, but originally three in number; there was man, woman, and a union of the two, having a name corresponding to this double nature, which once had a real existence, but is now lost, and the word "Androgynous" is only preserved as a term of reproach. In the second place, THE PRIMEVAL MAN WAS ROUND, HIS BACK AND SIDES FORMING A CIRCLE; one head with two faces looking in opposite ways, set on a round neck and precisely alike; also four ears, two privy members, and the remainder to correspond. He could walk upright as men do now, backwards or forwards as he pleased, and he could also roll over and over at a great pace.........

    The man was originally THE CHILD OF THE SUN, and the man-woman of the MOON, which is made up of sun and earth, and they were all round and moved round and round like their parents. Terrible was their might and strength, and the thoughts of their hearts were great, and they dared to scale the heavens, and they made an attack on the Gods.

    The Gods took council and Zeus discovered a way to humble their pride and improve their manners. They would continue to exist, but he cut them in two like a sorb-apple which is halved for pickling.

    After the division, the two parts of man (the Androgyne), each desiring his other half, came together and throwing their arms around one another, entwined in mutual embraces, longing to grow into one; they were on the point of dying from hunger and self-neglect because they did not like to do anything apart; and when one of the halves died and the other survived, the survivor sought another mate, man or woman, as we call them--being the sections of entire men or women--and clung to that.

    They were being destroyed when Zeus, in pity of them, invented a new plan. HE TURNED THE PARTS OF GENERATION ROUND TO THE FRONT, for this had not always been their position, and they sowed the seed no longer as hitherto like grasshoppers, in the ground, but in one another; and after the transposition the male generated in the female in order that by mutual embraces of man and woman they might breed and the race might continue; or if man came to man they might be satisfied, and rest, and go their ways to the business of life: so ancient is the desire of one another which is implanted within us, reuniting our original nature, making one of two, and healing the state of man.

    Each of us, when separated, having one side only, like a flat fish, is but the identure of a man, and is always looking for his other half....and when one of them meets with his other half, the actual half of himself........the pair are lost in an amazement of love and friendship and intimacy, and one will not be out of the other's sight, as I may say, even for a moment; these are the people who pass their whole lives together; yet they could not explain what they desire of one another. For the intense yearning which each of them has for the other does not appear to be the desire of lovers' intercourse, but of something else which the soul of either evidently desires and cannot tell, and of which she has only a dark and doubtful presentiment." (Plato, "Symposium")

    Genesis 1:28 - And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: And have dominion...

    This androgynous mankind then indeed "filled the earth" but again, as these beings were ethereal, so was the earth, neither earth nor man had yet "hardened" (involved itself) into matter. Our Periodic Table has a broad range of elemental densities even within the PHYSICAL (obsevable) world... how much more of a range through, over and above the "non-physical"? In truth, words like "material" and "non-material" only have meaning in relation to the consciousness obseving or not observing said substance. Everything in nature is material (called by Hindus Prakriti) though some is untra-dense and some is ultra-rarified (actually, you can look at it from the other way around: that which has "LESS" or slower-moving atoms or what-have-you is denser, and that with more or faster-moving, more plastic and eteric).

    And this brings me to chapter. Keep in mind that up until now, there has been no mention of "dust" or "earth", only that the first Adam was made (bara) in the image (tzelem) of Elohim. The word "bara" here is of the utmost importance, for it denotes a certain type of creation, namely a DIRECT emanation. There are four worlds hypothesized in Cabala, and the act of Bara is what happens in the upper-world bearing its name, or a form thereof: Bariah. Next below Bariah is the world of Yetzirah, and, lo and behold, in chapter two, we find a SPECIFIC Elohim (Yahweh Elohim: "The LORD God") YATZAR-ing (FORMING [or better yet, RE-FORMING] not CREATING) THIS Adam out of the "dust of the ground":

    Genesis 2:7 - And the Lord God formed (YATZAR) man of the dust (AFAR) of the ground (ADAMAH), and breathed into his nostrils the breath (NESHIMAH) of life; and man became a living soul (a CHAY NEFESH).

    It is the SAME Adam, get it? One creature going through successive formations, over indeterminately long natural cycles and according to very natural processes. It is interesting that Adam is taken out of the ADAMAH, the ground, and the picture here is of the dust (AFAR- the particles that make up this etheric or astral ground, the "Adamah") condensing, aggregating and attaching themselves to the spiritual being that came out of chapter one (some say the Elohim were actually RE-making even this FIRST Adam of chapter one, because the TRUE first Adam [sometimes called Kadmon] is mentioned in v. 3 of chapter one where it is spoken, "Let there be LIGHT" and THE Adam (THE single, undivided and collective MONAD was there meant). Remember too, that this Adam, once separated into male and female, puts on yet ANOTHER more dense physical layer in 3:21 when Yahweh Elohim makes (ASAH this time, corresponding with the lowest world of Assiyah, just to follow the pattern through) for them "coats of SKINS".

    Genesis 2:18 - And the Lord God said, It is not good that man should be alone; I will make him a help mate for him.

    All I will say here is that, just as the gods did not want him to become as "one of us", they also did not think it good for him to be "alone", i.e. a single sex. Though the role of almost the antagonist is played by this "God" in the text (for good reasons I believe) the text is telling of great and marvellous but very NATURAL processes, the which no Darwinist nor Creationist has yet suspected.

    Genesis 2:21 - And the Lord God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead thereof;

    The "deep sleep" is the gradual loss of consciousness of the upper worlds (the "spiritual") which accompanies the descending monad during this process of involution, ending finally in a total forgetfulness of anything other than this waking consciousness here on the earth plane.

    "Ribs": The word is TZELA, which means both rib, SIDE, and IMAGE. It is a pun here re-created in the separation story just like we had in chapter one where "God" made Adam in his TZELEM ("tzelem" is merely the plural of "tzela").

    Genesis 2: 22 - And the rib, which the Lord God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man.

    This again would read in this light, "And the image, which Yahweh Elohim had taken from man, made (BANAH) he a woman, and brought her unto the man." "Banah" means to BUILD, or ESTABLISH, and yet I think it has other meanings which I will not get into, that is a whole other discussion.

    Thank you for reading, and please leave me your comments or questions.

    -Philo
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  • MkB Philo-P... 2009/03/30 09:47:10
    MkB
    Facinating read. Where can I learn more.
  • Philo-P... MkB 2009/03/30 13:41:30
    Philo-Publius
    +1
    This is going to sound like a stupid and very self-aggrandizing title for a book, but in the late 1800s a Russian mystic by the name of Helena Blavatsky wrote two large volumes titled "The Secret Doctrine". It is a bizzare compilation at first glance, with seemingly far-fetched claims. However, when studied, it is the most explanatory and comprehensive volume on the origins of man and the universe ever put out in my estimation. It can be read online for free at http://www.theosociety.org/pa...

    Start with Book 2. If you have any difficulty or additional questions feel free to write back to me here or at my profile email. You can also obtain some good primer materials and read other works by this and other authors at http://www.theosociety.org/
  • MkB Philo-P... 2009/03/30 20:30:38
    MkB
    +1
    Thanks.
  • feyitifa Philo-P... 2012/05/18 09:10:09 (edited)
    feyitifa
    +3
    I'd just like to know what exactly your sources are as the only things that you have written here that are confirmed in the bible are the passages youve taken from genesis. When in genesis God makes referrals such as "us" or "our" (Then God said, "Let us make man in our image, after our likeness...." (Genesis 1:26 ESV)he is referring to the holy trinity - the father, the son and the holy spirit, not other "gods" such as Zeus who have absolutely nothing to do with Christianity but are infact teachings of GREEK MYTHOLOGY. In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. (John 1:1 ESV). "The word" is the bible, anything that is not written in the bible should not be regarded as Christian belief especially when what you have written here is clearly contrary to it. It's pretty obvious that the original question has been overshadowed and overcomplicated here to make room for unchristian theories and beliefs. Thank you
  • Philo-P... feyitifa 2012/05/18 12:28:17
    Philo-Publius
    I appreciate the follow-up. I'm not sure what source I might be able to cite that would satisfy you though, if you're not willing to accept any source outside the Bible. Keep in mind, however, I'm not appealing to any extra-biblical source as necessarily authoritative in the sense of it being the 'final word' on the matter – I'm using such stories merely for cross-reference and comparison, because the thrust of what I'm putting forward is that the allegorical nature of these stories, and that to which each allegory refers, including the biblical allegories, can only be understood in light of diligent, unbiased comparison.

    What I did in my original answer was apply Jewish exegesis (pardes) to the Jewish first book of Moses (which seems much more likely to yield up understanding than, for instance, just trusting what a Protestant doctrine might have to say about these verses today). Part of pardes (this Jewish exegesis) is something called 'midrash' (I've heard midrashic-type stories referred to by European exegetes as 'revolutios'), which is essentially the tradition of retelling the same story, and keeping the same meaning, but telling it in a different way (sometimes even using a completely different story). So, with respect, I'd suggest here firstly that you're right, that much of what I've written is outside of modern Christian church teaching, but that modern church teaching may itself not be based on a proper interpretation of the biblical books.
  • feyitifa Philo-P... 2012/05/21 08:02:22 (edited)
    feyitifa
    +1
    When answering a question based on Christianity why are you trying so hard to find the answers in other religions instead of first looking to the bible and to God? I can understand how Judaism can sometimes be used for comparison when referring to parts of the old testament, but how is an 'unbiased' comparison to plato's symposium (a fictional and completely unrelated Greek text which most of your answer was copied from) even relevant. If you were only attempting to make comparisons why wasn't that made clear in your answer, as to me it just seemed like you were moulding completely unrelated ideas together; ideas which could and probably already have lead to confusion and misinterpretation. In regards to your last statement - "much of what I've written is outside of modern church teaching, but that modern church teaching may itself not be based on a proper interpretation of the biblical books", not once have I refered to the church or a church's interpretation of the bible as each individual Christian should themselves be reading the bible and praying for God to give them understanding of the word to ensure that they do receive the 'proper interpretation of the biblical books' as well as going to church for fellowship and guidance - "If you need wisdom, ask our generous God, a...
    When answering a question based on Christianity why are you trying so hard to find the answers in other religions instead of first looking to the bible and to God? I can understand how Judaism can sometimes be used for comparison when referring to parts of the old testament, but how is an 'unbiased' comparison to plato's symposium (a fictional and completely unrelated Greek text which most of your answer was copied from) even relevant. If you were only attempting to make comparisons why wasn't that made clear in your answer, as to me it just seemed like you were moulding completely unrelated ideas together; ideas which could and probably already have lead to confusion and misinterpretation. In regards to your last statement - "much of what I've written is outside of modern church teaching, but that modern church teaching may itself not be based on a proper interpretation of the biblical books", not once have I refered to the church or a church's interpretation of the bible as each individual Christian should themselves be reading the bible and praying for God to give them understanding of the word to ensure that they do receive the 'proper interpretation of the biblical books' as well as going to church for fellowship and guidance - "If you need wisdom, ask our generous God, and he will give it to you. He will not rebuke you for asking." (James 1:5), and not only was your original statement outside of 'modern church teaching' it was almost completely outside of and unrelated to Christianity. I hope you dont mind me asking, but what faith/religion do you practice?
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  • Philo-P... feyitifa 2012/05/21 12:29:02
    Philo-Publius
    As far as the relevancy of Plato's Symposium goes, I offer it for comparison with part of the Genesis account, and nothing more. One person will read it and instantly recognize the connection. Another – most others, perhaps – will not.

    I agree it might seem at first that the stories represent unrelated ideas which do not belong together, but what needs to be examined is the inner meaning; what's behind the allegory of each. If they seem confusing against each other, recall that the Genesis account itself appears confused if not starkly contradictory, which has been the source of much criticism by atheists: In Genesis 1, man is created *after* the animals (1:25-27), but in chapter 2 man is created *before* them (2:18-19). In chapter 1, man and woman were created simultaneously (1:27), while in the second chapter, Adam is created, and then some time afterward the woman is extracted from his body via a 'rib' (2:18-22). This – to me, at least – is evidence not that Genesis is 'wrong', but that it is allegory. 'Allegorical' does not mean that it's untrue; quite the opposite. A wise writer once remarked that, “Fact works its way very often through fiction.”

    It seems we just disagree as to our interpretations, and really even as to how to interpret, and that's fine. Not everyone...
    As far as the relevancy of Plato's Symposium goes, I offer it for comparison with part of the Genesis account, and nothing more. One person will read it and instantly recognize the connection. Another – most others, perhaps – will not.

    I agree it might seem at first that the stories represent unrelated ideas which do not belong together, but what needs to be examined is the inner meaning; what's behind the allegory of each. If they seem confusing against each other, recall that the Genesis account itself appears confused if not starkly contradictory, which has been the source of much criticism by atheists: In Genesis 1, man is created *after* the animals (1:25-27), but in chapter 2 man is created *before* them (2:18-19). In chapter 1, man and woman were created simultaneously (1:27), while in the second chapter, Adam is created, and then some time afterward the woman is extracted from his body via a 'rib' (2:18-22). This – to me, at least – is evidence not that Genesis is 'wrong', but that it is allegory. 'Allegorical' does not mean that it's untrue; quite the opposite. A wise writer once remarked that, “Fact works its way very often through fiction.”

    It seems we just disagree as to our interpretations, and really even as to how to interpret, and that's fine. Not everyone looks at the Bible in the same way. As for my own faith (I don't mind you asking at all), I grew up Protestant... you could say I come from a Protestant background, and I still believe in God. I guess I've become very ecumenical over the years though, not just with respect to Christian denominations, but also the world's religions in general. In the early 90s as a young adult I was influenced by, among so many others, the work of Joseph Campbell. I draw from a lot of wells though, I suppose.
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  • feyitifa Philo-P... 2012/05/21 16:30:21 (edited)
    feyitifa
    +1
    I agree with you that not everyone looks at or interprets the bible in the same way, and although I still don't agree with your original statement I understand your logic and respect the fact that you explained what you meant. I also wish there was more unity and understanding within Christian denominations (and it really baffles me that there isn't) and amongst all the different religions, but I guess that's easier said than done.
    Thank you for this, I've learnt quite a lot of new things.
  • AmberRa... feyitifa 2012/06/09 20:46:18
    AmberRay835
    +2
    FYI... the "trinity" wasn't decided until First Council of Nicaea..... the concept of Jesus, God and the Holy Spirit being one in the same is not biblical. Constantine wanted to merge some of his pagan beliefs with Christianity, and so it was.....Why is Christmas in winter, and Easter in Spring?/
  • thetruth 2009/03/03 05:28:45 (edited)
    Please leave comment.
    thetruth
    +1
    The Bible does use picture images and parables, but is literal.

    There is literally a Heaven and literally a Hell, but to answer your question NO, there wasnt. The NIV version, at least for me is so much easier to understand, you should try that one.

    Genesis 1:26
    26 Then God said, "Let us make man in our image, in our likeness, and let them rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air, over the livestock, over all the earth, and over all the creatures that move along the ground."

    "US" - GOD talking to Jesus.

    Romans 10:9-10 NIV

    9That if you confess with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. 10For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you confess and are saved.

    Shalom Aleichem (Peace to You)
  • MkB thetruth 2009/03/30 09:59:28
    MkB
    +1
    New points for me to consider. Thanks! Shalom
  • AmberRa... thetruth 2012/06/09 20:44:02
    AmberRay835
    +1
    I don't believe that he was talking to Jesus because Christ wasn't created yet. He was talking to the Angels.
  • thetruth AmberRa... 2012/06/10 20:48:54
    thetruth
    Well, you're entitled to believe anything you want, but opinion doesn't make you correct.

    So God was saying to "Angels" .. "Let us make man in our image, in our likeness" making Angels equal with God?

    I don't think so ... not only would your assessment be inconsistent with the rest of the Bible, but it would also contradict sound teaching.

    If God wasn't talking with Jesus then what is the meaning of John 1:1-5 that talks about Christ Jesus?

    John 1:1-5
    "1 In the beginning was the Word (Jesus), and the Word (Jesus) was with God, and the Word (Jesus) was God. 2 He (Jesus) was with God in the beginning.

    3 Through Him (Jesus) all things were made; without Him (Jesus) nothing was made that has been made. 4 In Him (Jesus) was life, and that life was the light of men. 5 The light shines in the darkness, but the darkness has not understood it."

    Yes, in Genesis God had not yet been made flesh, in Genesis 1:26, there was no need of a Christ yet ... Christ is Greek for the Hebrew word Mashiach which both mean, Messiah ... AKA Anointed One, or Savior. But there is NO ONE equal with God, other than Christ Jesus, and the Holy Spirit...not man, not woman, not angels, not animals, NOTHING! ... Have you ever read the Bible?

    Knowledge is key, and opinion is worthless if not based on it.,
  • KirkAFur thetruth 2012/06/16 03:12:41
    KirkAFur
    +3
    You might benefit from reading Dr. Heiser: http://www.thedivinecouncil.com/
  • thetruth KirkAFur 2012/06/19 00:58:26
    thetruth
    The Divine Council link you've given me was interesting to say the least, with some valid points, and some hookie pookie ones also, but I do not agree with everything Dr. Heiser said. One example was his very long way of saying that the "Sons of God" in Psalm 82 does not mean humans. I believe it literally does mean humans, which is ironic that he claims it's out of misunderstanding that one believes that. The Sons of God are all those whom God has chosen, those who have the faith of Abraham, and believe in Jesus Christ, not some created lower species that cannot be explained. Jesus proves that in John 10:34-38 as He refers to Psalms 82 as Dr. Heiser dissects to mean its not humans:

    John 10:34-38

    34 Jesus answered them (humans), “Is it not written in your Law, ‘I have said you are gods’? 35 If he called them ‘gods,’ to whom the Word of God came—and the Scripture cannot be broken — 36 what about the one whom the Father set apart as His very own and sent into the world? Why then do you accuse me of blasphemy because I said, ‘I am God’s Son’? 37 Do not believe me unless I do what my Father does. 38 But if I do it, even though you do not believe me, believe the miracles, that you may know and understand that the Father is in me, and I in the Father.”

    We are chosen to belong to God "...














    The Divine Council link you've given me was interesting to say the least, with some valid points, and some hookie pookie ones also, but I do not agree with everything Dr. Heiser said. One example was his very long way of saying that the "Sons of God" in Psalm 82 does not mean humans. I believe it literally does mean humans, which is ironic that he claims it's out of misunderstanding that one believes that. The Sons of God are all those whom God has chosen, those who have the faith of Abraham, and believe in Jesus Christ, not some created lower species that cannot be explained. Jesus proves that in John 10:34-38 as He refers to Psalms 82 as Dr. Heiser dissects to mean its not humans:

    John 10:34-38

    34 Jesus answered them (humans), “Is it not written in your Law, ‘I have said you are gods’? 35 If he called them ‘gods,’ to whom the Word of God came—and the Scripture cannot be broken — 36 what about the one whom the Father set apart as His very own and sent into the world? Why then do you accuse me of blasphemy because I said, ‘I am God’s Son’? 37 Do not believe me unless I do what my Father does. 38 But if I do it, even though you do not believe me, believe the miracles, that you may know and understand that the Father is in me, and I in the Father.”

    We are chosen to belong to God "Sons":

    1 Peter 2:9

    But you are a chosen people, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people belonging to God, that you may declare the praises of Him who called you out of darkness into His wonderful light.

    We were with God before creation, and predestined to be adopted as sons of God which clearly explains the meaning of "Sons of God" even further. Adopted sons, as opposed to the natural sons, the Hebrew believer:

    Ephesians 1:3-6

    3 Praise be to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us in the heavenly realms with every spiritual blessing in Christ. 4 For he chose us in him before the creation of the world to be holy and blameless in his sight. In love 5 He predestined us to be adopted as His sons through Jesus Christ, in accordance with his pleasure and will— 6 to the praise of his glorious grace, which he has freely given us in the One he loves.


    As you can see, if we were to go point by point it would be exhausting, but there's plenty more contention in Dr. Heiser's writings that could be spoken for, but also some very solid points, be that as it may, way to much to write about. so, I want to say I am very grateful for the time you took to give me that link. It was very thoughtful and thought provoking. Thank you.

    Many Blessings ...
    (more)
  • ALofRI 2009/02/22 16:49:07
    Please leave comment.
    ALofRI
    +1
    Looks that way, doesn't it?

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