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ACLU Launches Phone App to Record Police Stops: Should Police Recordings Be Required?

thezilch 2012/07/05 18:00:00
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All too often, police officers are accused of acting unlawfully. Either officers are wrongly accused of brutality or they have indeed brutally handled a case and gotten away with it. Well, the American Civil Liberties Union (ACLU) wants to have your back.

A new phone app, called "Stop and Frisk Watch," plans to deal with shady cops by recording video and audio of all police encounters when the authority stops you. So, how do you feel about it? Should we equip our law enforcement with recording devices that both hold them more accountable and also help to better protect their rights as officers of the law?


AUTOBLOG.COM reports:Shortly after the New York branch of the American Civil Liberties Union created an app called Stop and Frisk Watch, in response to the law enforcement
civil liberties union created app frisk watch response law enforcement

Read More: http://www.autoblog.com/2012/07/05/aclu-launches-p...

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Top Opinion

  • Roger47 2012/07/05 18:27:32
    Yes
    Roger47
    +9
    Police like nothing better than to have it come down to a credibility contest between them and someone they have arrested. They know this is a battle they can win almost every time in front of jurors. A few years back, a local police force began videotaping field sobriety tests on DWI arrests. They quit doing so after a few months, because in too many cases what they wrote in their reports was not backed up by the tape.
    There is a simple way to keep police honest, and that is to make them record. If a person is really guilty, it will reinforce the case for the prosecutor.

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  • WRLO56 DizziNY 2012/07/10 03:01:52
    WRLO56
    In video #2, the video jumps at the 14 second mark, which suggests to me that it's been edited intentionally to make the police look bad. Prior to the cut, the cops were bringing out first aid stuff and tending to the man's injuries; then suddenly the video jumps and they're jumping on top of him wrestling him to the ground. It doesn't show what happened in the interim to make them change their attitude. Did they suddenly decide en masse to stop treating the guy's injuries and start beating him for no reason? Did he pull a knife on them? I find the latter explanation more likely, but whatever the explanation, drawing conclusions about their behaviour from a video that's obviously been edited is irresponsible.
  • RJeffreySavlov 2012/07/06 14:51:53
    No
    RJeffreySavlov
    +3
    The app should be to monitor the ACLU and their moronic followers.
  • Faith ~American Patriot~ 2012/07/06 14:31:00
    No
    Faith ~American Patriot~
    I think the whole things sounds like a good idea, it would eliminate the he said she said stuff; but I don't think it should be required.
  • Jiorgia 2012/07/06 13:49:53
    Yes
    Jiorgia
    +2
    We are currently testing out in melbourne a pocket video camera w/ mic that police will be required to wear and log in the near future.
  • HypothesizeIt 2012/07/06 12:40:52 (edited)
    No
    HypothesizeIt
    +1
    Required? No.

    But, if you want to record your encounter. Go for it.
    There are good and bad police officers, just like in every profession. The only difference is, policemen have ultimate power over you. If they decide you are going to jail today, you are going to jail today. Regardless of whether you've committed a crime.
  • Grandpa 2012/07/06 12:34:24
    Yes
    Grandpa
    +1
    Yes that shoulder mike should be made to record what is said every time you are stopped >>> The mike can send the conversation to a recorder at the station house along with video tape taken by on lookers >> If they are not abuseing that badge there should be no problems >> This would help curb the greative written reports they use to C.Y.A.
  • WRLO56 2012/07/06 12:19:11
    Yes
    WRLO56
    +2
    Yes, but the real problem with any video is that it only shows part of the whole picture. Most people in their daily lives do not deal with unpredictable people who are quite prepared to kill or injure them, and thus they see almost any level of police use of force as "disproportionate". For example, they expect the police to "fight fair", even though that's a ridiculous requirement. For example, if someone has a gun and is shooting up a shopping mall, do you really want the police to tone down their response so he/she has a reasonable chance of getting away?

    Too often, the public sees a video of an arrest and jumps to the conclusion that the police were acting unreasonably; they don't see the woman who was beaten by the suspect, or the bank employees cowering on their knees, or whatever it was that caused the police to react the way they did. 4 cops against 1 suspect isn't "unfair"; it's prudent behaviour to ensure the suspect doesn't hurt anyone by resisting.
  • Grandpa WRLO56 2012/07/06 12:52:26
    Grandpa
    How about the fellow in New York that was shot at 47 times as he reahed for his wallet for ID ?? Or Rodney King trying to stand up to stop 7 cops from beating on him , I case you didnt know most people would have done the same ,instead of laying there and being beat upon ??? If it weren't tape do you feel he would have gotten treat for the beating ?? How about the sniper ( So called expert shot) that not only killed the father but the 3 year old child >>> The list is endless >> When you chose this as a career was it for the pension , the money for sitting finding fault with others ,for the same things you do yuorselfs every day ,or you could race thru the streets and endanger others for some minor violation >> Did you expect never to have someone question your authority >> Or to sit home being paid as they check out your story >>> If you can't stand up to the heat find another job
  • WRLO56 Grandpa 2012/07/06 13:02:40
    WRLO56
    I don't know which case in NY you are talking about, but if the police were pointing guns at him and telling him to put his hands in the air, and instead he reached into his pocket and pulled something out, then who's to blame?

    A sniper accidentally shooting a hostage is tragic, but it's hardly brutality. A similar case happened on a Native reservation in Canada several years back - the mother came out the door carrying a shotgun and aimed it at the Mountie, who returned fire; he accidentally killed not only the mother, but a toddler who followed her outside. In any event, I don't see how a videotape of the incident would answer any questions.

    The list is not endless - you only cite 3 instances, and you apparently got 2 of them wrong.
  • Grandpa WRLO56 2012/07/06 13:48:27 (edited)
    Grandpa
    +1
    The police >. As there were 4 and no gun was seen killing was not right and cost the city thousands but he officers got off scott free >>>> With 4 guns pointed at him and the time it would take to aim and fire he would have been dead >. What I don't understand is why you wear a badge and expect never to be put in harms why don't you wear a bullet proof vest >. I know ,it's to hot, easier to complain how tough your job is >> No one ever welded that badge on your chest and you can quit any time you want it not like military service ,where you can't walk away but do your job wilhout crying how tough it is >>. If I don't like my work I move on and beleave you people should do the same >> And sir I never get things wrong go look them up >> Plus a sniper is suppose to be trained for one shot one kill And he should NOT have taken that shot >> Or a leg shot would have save that childs life >> Wonder how you would feel if it was your child or one of your close freinds >>. Snipers don't make mistakes
  • WRLO56 Grandpa 2012/07/08 21:24:28
    WRLO56
    So what you're saying is, it's okay to treat employees like dirt because if they don't like it they can always quit?

    You said the list of cases of police brutality was "endless", yet you only provided 3 examples, and at least 2 of them were questionable. I still don't know which case in NY you were talking about; maybe if you gave me a hint I could check it out for myself. But cops are human beings; they make mistakes. Mistakes are not brutality. Don't tell me that a sniper never misses. And don't give me that crap about "oh, he could have shot the guy in the leg"; that just tells me you don't have a clue what you're talking about.
  • Grandpa WRLO56 2012/07/09 02:32:38
    Grandpa
    How about the mop handle up some imogrents backside by the cops in newYork and the 4 cops were also from New York that shot at that man 47 time s ,and with a Glock it means some reloaded >. Or in Mass. when told to stand down still followed the speeder and even though an other officer had a assulat rifle as he stood at the back of his car with hands on the trunk the officer shot him behind the ear takeing his life >> The officer was tried put had to leave boston before the out come >> And mistake are brutality when the out come is the life of an other human being >> And in San Franisco the sniper shot the gun out of the perks hand >. And in the acdamy they alway shoot at the chest as it is the biggest target and if you kill them the city is less likely to be sued and have to support them as they did Mr. King >>> You sir are a part of that 60% that finds it easier to kill then find a better solution >> If you are not an expert marksman all the time you should NOT BE A SNIPER ,just an other grunt on the line >> All you have done is prove a point it eaiser to kill than just shot them in the leg >> Wear your vests and quit crying how hard your job is and learn when you screw UP TO SAY YOUR SORRY >> BUT THAN YOU NEVER MAKE MISTAKES AND IF YOU DO YOU DON'T HAVE THE BRAINS TO SAY i SCREWED UP >> My...>>>>>>>
    How about the mop handle up some imogrents backside by the cops in newYork and the 4 cops were also from New York that shot at that man 47 time s ,and with a Glock it means some reloaded >. Or in Mass. when told to stand down still followed the speeder and even though an other officer had a assulat rifle as he stood at the back of his car with hands on the trunk the officer shot him behind the ear takeing his life >> The officer was tried put had to leave boston before the out come >> And mistake are brutality when the out come is the life of an other human being >> And in San Franisco the sniper shot the gun out of the perks hand >. And in the acdamy they alway shoot at the chest as it is the biggest target and if you kill them the city is less likely to be sued and have to support them as they did Mr. King >>> You sir are a part of that 60% that finds it easier to kill then find a better solution >> If you are not an expert marksman all the time you should NOT BE A SNIPER ,just an other grunt on the line >> All you have done is prove a point it eaiser to kill than just shot them in the leg >> Wear your vests and quit crying how hard your job is and learn when you screw UP TO SAY YOUR SORRY >> BUT THAN YOU NEVER MAKE MISTAKES AND IF YOU DO YOU DON'T HAVE THE BRAINS TO SAY i SCREWED UP >> My friend and I help an old man who's store was broken into ,When the police showed up all they did was accuse the man of not secure the store before going home >> Let me inform YOU SIR that after they left and we started the clean up we found that they got in by driving thier car thru the side wall >> Do you think those so called protector would say we screwed up >. Not those a holes >> QUIT MAKEING EXCUSSES FOR THEM AS THIER ARE VERY FEW WHO DESERVE IT
    (more)
  • WRLO56 Grandpa 2012/07/10 02:52:37
    WRLO56
    Listen Grandpa, you want to calm down and discuss this coherently without resorting to insults and ALL CAPS, I'm up for it. You want to give me specific details about some of these incidents so I can go and research them myself, be my guest - I'll look them up.

    But if all you want to do is foam at the mouth and scream, I have no interest in continuing the discussion.

    Have a nice day.
  • Grandpa WRLO56 2012/07/10 13:10:06
    Grandpa
    You have a nice day too >. and those are facts as I have lived them < No news paper accounts and I don't foam at the mouth >> You must be a cop as you sure need to read the papers more than once a month >> I have not taken a course in Creative writting as you have so can only relate personal experances as I see them >> But I don't need to make things up >. Find some one else to argue with and go to the inter net and look up police trials or shootings or what ever
  • WRLO56 Grandpa 2012/07/15 15:11:54
    WRLO56
    Well, this will be my last word on the subject.

    1. You can't simply re-define words to mean what you want them to mean. A sniper who makes a difficult judgement call which ends badly is not being "brutal"; at worst, it's a tragic mistake, and you cannot simply redefine the word "brutality" to include "honest mistake made under pressure".

    2. I'm not a cop, and never have been. I find, however, that people like you find it incomprehensible that someone who is not, and never has been, a police officer would stick up for them. Ergo, you simply insist that I'm a cop or an ex-cop (and, therefore, that I'm a liar to boot); that way, you find it easier to dismiss my arguments without bothering to address the substance. That's called the 'ad homimen' fallacy.

    3. How the 7734 am I supposed to google these incidents when you repeatedly ignore my civil requests for enough information to do so? You won't even tell me the city in which these incidents allegedly occurred, let alone the PDs involved, the year or month in which they occurred, or the name of even one of the participants. You're too lazy to post any of that information, even though you presumably know it; yet you accuse me of being lazy because I'm not prepared to waste several days of my time trying to figure out which incidents y...







    Well, this will be my last word on the subject.

    1. You can't simply re-define words to mean what you want them to mean. A sniper who makes a difficult judgement call which ends badly is not being "brutal"; at worst, it's a tragic mistake, and you cannot simply redefine the word "brutality" to include "honest mistake made under pressure".

    2. I'm not a cop, and never have been. I find, however, that people like you find it incomprehensible that someone who is not, and never has been, a police officer would stick up for them. Ergo, you simply insist that I'm a cop or an ex-cop (and, therefore, that I'm a liar to boot); that way, you find it easier to dismiss my arguments without bothering to address the substance. That's called the 'ad homimen' fallacy.

    3. How the 7734 am I supposed to google these incidents when you repeatedly ignore my civil requests for enough information to do so? You won't even tell me the city in which these incidents allegedly occurred, let alone the PDs involved, the year or month in which they occurred, or the name of even one of the participants. You're too lazy to post any of that information, even though you presumably know it; yet you accuse me of being lazy because I'm not prepared to waste several days of my time trying to figure out which incidents you are referring to.

    Here's a couple of cases of police brutality that, IMHO, weren't brutality at all:

    Stacy Bonds, a young woman arrested for public drunk and disorderly, who physically resisted attempts to search her, took a swing at a police woman (on video), and moments later savagely kicked that same police woman (on video) so hard that the police woman was unable to put any weight on her right leg for several minutes. Police immediately wrestled Bonds to the floor (taking great pains to avoid inflicting any physical injury) and strip searched her; the judge threw out all charges against Bonds because of what he considered "excessive use of force".

    Geoff Mantler, an RCMP constable in BC, Canada who apparently kicked an armed gunman in the face (caught on tape by a bystander across the street), apparently after the gunman leaped out of his truck and attacked Mantler. Mantler took down an armed gunman without a shot being fired; for that, he is now facing criminal charges for "excessive use of force". (And yes, I consider the fact that the armed gunman, Mr. Tavares, did not have a gun in his hand when he attacked Const. Mantler to be irrelevant.)

    Google those.
    (more)
  • Grandpa WRLO56 2012/07/15 16:16:14
    Grandpa
    You sir are intitled to your opinion ,but it is not mine >> WHANT A HERO PICK A FIREMAN THEY SAVE LIVES AT A RISH OF THIER OWN AND DRESS ACCORDINGLY IF YOUR HERO'S DID THE SAME MAYBE THEY WOULDN'T CRY HOW TOUGHT THIER JOB IS <>>>A JOB WHICH THEY chose TO UNDERTAKE AND CAN QUIT ANY TIME >> HAVE A GREAT DAY AND MAY YOU NEVER HAVE TO TRUST A OFFICE TO TREAT YOU RIGHT >. AS IT MAY BURST YOUR BUBBLE >> NOW IT'S AGINST THE LAW TO TAPE AN ARREST AS IT MAY BE USED AGINST AN OFFICER IF HE USES EXCESS FORCE
  • Grandpa WRLO56 2012/07/09 02:51:24
    Grandpa
    No I said if you are dissatisfied you should find another line of work >> Typical cop putting words in other peoples mouth >> To me cops are those who sit around and find fault with others for the same things THEY DO every day on there way to work but think its OK as they have a badge on >> Just like the one who park in the handy cap spots at lunch time as they are to lazy to walk >> They took all 6 spaces >> Big hero's >. And when I lost 20 > 4 by 8 feet stainless sheets of steel off my truck ,all they did was sit on his DA and turn on his flashers >> The only help I got was from a highway patrol officer who on his day off was picking up his pay check >. Or the clown who saw women in trouble at 30 below as her car broke down and sat and watched her until some one stop to help her >> STOP EXCUSS BAD BEHAVIOR
  • DMC4196 Grandpa 2012/07/06 13:57:38 (edited)
    DMC4196
    +1
    I knew someone would bring up Rodney King. Just out of curiosity, have you seen the whole video or are you one of the millions who place all your belief in a few seconds of video that was highly publicized? Did you know that the video that you use as your evidence is approximately 20 minutes long? Did you know that there were two other black men in the car with Mr. King? The reason most are unaware of this is the fact that these two men surrendered peacefully and followed the officers command at the end of the high speed chase, they were taken into custody (uninjured) by those same officers. What many also don't take into account is that after Mr. King initiated his hostilities and began his fight with the officers, he was hit with two tazers. You made the statement that he was trying to stand up to seven cops and that most people would have done the same. Sorry to have to inform you of this, but most people wouldn't have started the whole incident to begin with, let alone get back up and fight after being hit with two tazers. Did you ever wonder why the criminal case was lost in court? Regardless of what was sensationalized by the media, the whole case was built entirely upon racism. Once the entire video was shown to the jurors and the evidence of the other two black men not...
    I knew someone would bring up Rodney King. Just out of curiosity, have you seen the whole video or are you one of the millions who place all your belief in a few seconds of video that was highly publicized? Did you know that the video that you use as your evidence is approximately 20 minutes long? Did you know that there were two other black men in the car with Mr. King? The reason most are unaware of this is the fact that these two men surrendered peacefully and followed the officers command at the end of the high speed chase, they were taken into custody (uninjured) by those same officers. What many also don't take into account is that after Mr. King initiated his hostilities and began his fight with the officers, he was hit with two tazers. You made the statement that he was trying to stand up to seven cops and that most people would have done the same. Sorry to have to inform you of this, but most people wouldn't have started the whole incident to begin with, let alone get back up and fight after being hit with two tazers. Did you ever wonder why the criminal case was lost in court? Regardless of what was sensationalized by the media, the whole case was built entirely upon racism. Once the entire video was shown to the jurors and the evidence of the other two black men not being harmed was introduced, it's hard to say it was a racist attack. The officers were later convicted in a civil case, civil cases don't require all 12 jurors to render a guilty verdict, only a majority. Thank you for proving the point that there is always a bigger picture. As a former law enforcement officer, I learned long ago that there are two sides to every story, don't rush to judgment based on a media account that has been overly hyped because there is always more to that story.
    (more)
  • Grandpa DMC4196 2012/07/06 22:11:12 (edited)
    Grandpa
    You sound like my retired cop friends ,They always say you weren't there so don't judge they also tell stories that aren't very nice >. As for me I installed the frist photo lab in a police lab and saw more than most of you have seen >. I also said it's common sense to want to get up and not lay there as 7 clowns are beating on you with clubs >> Don't put words in my mouth as that is what must reports do to make yourself look good >>.40% do a great job ,but 60% let the badge go to there head >. If you can't take the crap find a new job < as most respect them that do the same to them >>> Enough said You beleave what you want but you will not change my mind as I have been abused and lied about by these hero's By the way I have watched the whole video and think we should video tape ALL encounters with those who are there to protect us not hassel us
  • the fuze 2012/07/06 11:37:45
    Yes
    the fuze
    +1
    If you're doing what you're supposed to be doing then this shouldn't be a problem.

    Is the recorded video able to be manipulated at all? Because that would be wrong.
  • Michael McFascist 2012/07/06 08:17:59
    Yes
    Michael McFascist
    +1
    recording stops protects everybody...
  • mwf122090 2012/07/06 07:14:59
    Yes
    mwf122090
    +1
    If you did this it would end both the abuse from police and the abuse of people trying to get out of trouble by blaming police.
  • jerry.alan.carroll 2012/07/06 06:43:31
    Yes
    jerry.alan.carroll
    +3
    while I agree with this, it seems only another way to get back at the police just for pulling you over for speeding. Cops are soon going to be afraid to do their jobs out of fear of persecution of some sort.
    the folks likely to have an app like this will likely be the folks that get in trouble a lot anyway.
  • jerry.a... jerry.a... 2012/07/06 06:51:32
    jerry.alan.carroll
    this is no different than managers spying on their associate's computer activity. 90% of all companies, big and small. now do this to ensure productivity but now those associates are claiming privacy invasion and are starting to win. soon the police will start to do the same thing I suspect. as long as no one here has a problem with their bosses spying on them at all times, then they have a right to say this is OK.
    BTW, I am one of the guys that spy on folks (it is part of my job) when they work and boy do they take an issue when they are caught facebooking instead of working and then they try to pull the Union card.
  • beach bum 2012/07/06 05:57:02
    Yes
    beach bum
    +2
    they all ready do this at the local pd
  • BigFig#9 2012/07/06 05:54:38
    Yes
    BigFig#9
    +2
    Easy technology, not only will protect good cops from harassing accusations but it will 'help' borderline cops keep it classy and root out a few bad asses along the way...
  • WRLO56 BigFig#9 2012/07/06 12:26:39
    WRLO56
    Actually, I can think of numerous cases where, IMO, good cops have had their reputations ruined because someone released a video which was widely misinterpreted by the media and the general public.

    Video and photographs don't always tell the whole story; the problem is, most members of the public assume that, having watched the video, they know everything they need to know.
  • BigFig#9 WRLO56 2012/07/07 05:38:24
    BigFig#9
    No different than anybody else in the world - a video (or sound recording) can be taken out of context or edited to tell a different story... That's why editors and intelligent viewers are so important.
  • MlssCue... WRLO56 2012/07/07 22:17:06
    MlssCue =Go Blue=
    +2
    Have you ever caught the story of the Kelly Thomas beating? And that's just one of many! Do a search you'll find much longer ones on this. It is incidents such as this that should allow recordings. Just imagine if it wasn't recorded by a bystander, because they didn't record it on their cruiser cam, what they would have gotten away with.
  • DPRKworker MlssCue... 2012/07/09 09:28:42
    DPRKworker
    +1
    That's just sick...anyone that sees that and insists that cops shouldn't be monitored is insane.
  • MlssCue... DPRKworker 2012/07/09 16:42:43
    MlssCue =Go Blue=
    +1
    Yes, that is exactly right. Sadly, how many Kelly's are out there not making the news because no one caught it on video :(
  • Justin Teufel Hunden 2012/07/06 05:00:42 (edited)
    Yes
    Justin Teufel Hunden
    +3
    Absolutely. I've seen some crooked things, with one officer in particular. I know many of them drink and drive as most others. They're people with flaws just like the rest of us. I imagine sometimes they run across some serious crud for extended periods of time...stress will alter judgement in most.
  • Bulanova (Team Hargitay) 2012/07/06 04:23:47
    Yes
    Bulanova (Team Hargitay)
    +5
    Of course, given the way the TSA handles video tapes, the tapes are ALWAYS available to prove the passenger was lying, but they are funnily enough never available to prove the passenger was telling the truth about being abused by the TSA. The tapes are always "lost" or those particular cameras were "out of order" or "being upgraded" by chance. I have no doubt the same thing would happen in cases of cops.
  • BigFig#9 Bulanov... 2012/07/06 05:57:01
    BigFig#9
    +3
    You're right about that....Ever see a cop throw something in front of his dashboard camera---look out---they're aiming to beat the crap out of somebody.
  • WRLO56 BigFig#9 2012/07/06 12:49:51
    WRLO56
    Since everyone and his dog now has at least two digital cameras with recording capability, any cop who assumes that his dashboard cam is the only one around is a Darwin award waiting to happen. Also, throwing something in front of the lens doesn't stop the sound recording, does it?

    But you bring up a good point - if video recordings become the norm, then any time the camera malfunctions, for any reason, the defense lawyers are going to pounce on it to get their client off, by making it look as if the police are hiding something - even if they're not.
  • James 2012/07/06 03:22:16
    Yes
    James
    +4
    Yes, they should be. I deserved my rights and a camera helps insure that.
  • wtw 2012/07/06 00:53:51
    No
    wtw
    +2
    But smart people will video tape the police.
  • Mike W 2012/07/06 00:29:54
    No
    Mike W
    +1
    Let me get this straight when people led by the liberal ilk of the ACLU choose to take the word of drug dealing, gang banging, drunk high trash who commited crimes then something is wrong. I chose to believe and takwe the word of a police officer who takes an oath to society and the constitution (which they seem to understand more then that idiot Chief Justice Roberts) over the disfunctional aggressive criminal trash that the police deal with. I would rather base the survival of our free society on the work of the wonderful people in law enforcement then on the criminal liberal irresponsible elitest trash that seems bent on weakening and destroying America
  • wilsonmja Mike W 2012/07/06 03:56:23
    wilsonmja
    +7
    So.....what about the times when the police WERE wrong and corrupted?
  • John "B... wilsonmja 2012/07/07 11:57:46
    John "By God" American
    +2
    Evidently, they never are as far as he's concerned...

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