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According to the C. S. Lewis, “20th century's most popular proponent of faith based on reason”, you must make your choice: “Either this man was, and is, the Son of God - or else a madman or something worse.” Please make your choice.

holyheretic 2012/08/07 23:57:02
This man was, and is, the Son of God
This man was a madman or something worse
Woe unto the disbelievers from the meeting of an awful Day.Jesus was not the Son of God. Those who say he was (Christians) are going to hell.   Koran - 19-35-37
"The whole thing is so patently infantile, so foreign to reality, that to anyone with a friendly attitude to humanity it is painful to think that the majority of mortals will never be able to rise above this view of life" - Sigmund Freud
The common ancestor of religion and science is ignorance - Leading British philosopher AC Grayling
The question is not why 85 percent of our most brilliant scientists reject God - it is why 15 percent do not - Neil deGrasse Tyson  - The Perimeter of Ignorance
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Freud & C.S. Lewis


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This is a fact! Where by virtue of its establishment (Christianity), we find that it cannot withstand the social revolutions -Jewish Rabbi - Islam is religion of future - In the Middle East, God won


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But Islam is very clear, there was a prophet (Muhammad), then God revealed to him the message (the Quran) - Jewish Rabbi - Islam is religion of future - In the Middle East, God won



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  • D.C. Willis 2012/08/08 03:30:24 (edited)
    "The whole thing is so patently infantile, so foreign to reality, that to any...
    D.C. Willis
    +6
    If a person uses reason when reading the biblical texts they would realize the book is a farce. C.S. Lewis had a different definition of the word "Reason" if thinks that is what he was using to evaluate the texts. LOL

    Thomas_P7

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  • ziad 2012/08/18 08:18:58
    This man was a madman or something worse
    ziad
    +1
    Because God does not have a brother or born, and so I got in the scriptures, then this man snooped on people
  • holyher... ziad 2012/08/18 08:51:08
  • ziad holyher... 2012/08/18 11:14:05
    ziad
    +1
    you are welcome my friend
  • Jonathan 2012/08/16 03:35:27
    This man was, and is, the Son of God
    Jonathan
    +1
    The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints is the church with the complete message from God. The Book of Mormon was given to Joseph Smith by the angel Moroni, who helped translate it. Where it contradicts the Old Testament, the Book of Mormon is correct, there are errors in the Old Testament due to it being transcribed so many times by so many people, but the Book of Mormon is free of errors. That Mormons are the chosen people of God was shown when God saved us from the crickets by sending seagulls to save us in the middle of the desert. All gentiles (non-Mormons) need to accept God's message given in the Book of Mormon.
    seagull monument
    Seagull monument with Mormon Tabernacle in background
    seagull monument
    Top of the monument with the seagulls
    Seagull Monument Site
    http://www.mormonhistoricsite...
  • holyher... Jonathan 2012/08/16 11:30:03
  • Mithra 2012/08/15 18:17:55
  • holyher... Mithra 2012/08/16 02:04:13
  • elijahin24 2012/08/14 19:37:06
    The question is not why 85 percent of our most brilliant scientists reject Go...
    elijahin24
    +1
    CS Lewis was a big fan of Jesus, and more to the point was a biblical absolutist. I don't see why we can't simply take from Jesus (or any philosopher) the nuggets of wisdom and reject the foolishness. Whether Jesus was ACTUALLY the son of a deity, or even whether or not he existed, doesn't change the fact that it is wise to love our nighbor, or to be generous, or to forgive those who hurt us, and not to judge those who do wrong in our eyes. If a begger on the street suggested that we treat others as we'd have them treat us, that would still be wise.
  • holyher... elijahin24 2012/08/15 05:03:04
  • holyher... holyher... 2012/08/15 05:42:40
  • Cat 2012/08/13 01:23:01
    This man was, and is, the Son of God
    Cat
    +1
    When you stand before the throne of judgement, you will be reminded then of the choice you made today.
  • holyher... Cat 2012/08/13 09:00:04
  • Cat holyher... 2012/08/13 17:11:13
    Cat
    +1
    You are putting up total fiction. The "quotations" that you use aren't even the actual words of the Bible, they're just made up.
    We're currently studying the book of Daniel in Bible study and covered chapter 11 last Wednesday, so I spotted that misquote immediately.
    Daniel 11:14 talks about a Jewish uprising against their Egyptian overlords during Ptolemy the Third's (the king of the south) rule. Chapter eleven prophesies about the fate of Judah leading up to the Roman occupation and does not go as far as the first century AD. Read Daniel 11 for yourself.
    Before you post quotations, you should first proof them. I now have no faith in any of your nicely prepared quotations, neither do I have the inclination to do your homework for you.
    When you face God on that fateful day, you will have to answer for your own actions, not mine or those of Daniel or Jesus. You make your own choices and answer for them. God does not wand you to die, but you must choose life. to do so, you may use this link http://peacewithgod.jesus.net/?
  • holyher... Cat 2012/08/14 09:20:29
  • Cat holyher... 2012/08/14 09:41:31
    Cat
    +1
    Since I've discovered that one of your illustrated quotations was false, why should I read any more of them? You didn't do your own research and you're not going to get me to do it for you so you can stop sending this tripe to my postings, because this is my last retort.
  • holyher... Cat 2012/08/14 11:52:31
  • elijahin24 Cat 2012/08/14 20:41:49
    elijahin24
    +2
    IF there is a god, and I ever stand before him in judgment, I will tell him that I lived a life of charity, and generosity; that I was kind and loving, as best I could be; and that I did it without any fear of hell, or hope of heaven. I did it because it was good, and it served my fellow human being. If your god would send me to eternal torment because I could not pretend to believe in an idea with absolutely no evidence to support it, he is an evil god, who is unworthy of my praise.
  • Cat elijahin24 2012/08/14 22:22:06
    Cat
    +1
    As long as you didn't make yourself his enemy, I personally think you'd get in.
    My Native American ancestors never heard of Jesus or even of Moses, but they had a conscience. Even my denomination of Christianity acknowledges that God may let others in to Paradise besides those justified by Christ or by the Law of Moses. God can do whatever He wants to, He is Almighty.
    Then again, why risk it Jesus promised it to all who believe in Him and Obey His commandments.
  • elijahin24 Cat 2012/08/14 23:03:50
    elijahin24
    +1
    But belief isn't a matter of covering your ass. The only logical reason to believe ANYTHING is that it is the most logical conclusion. Any other reason is insincere.
    How would I make myself his enemy? I can't hate that which I don't believe. I do argue against the logic of faith vs. doubt. Does that make me his enemy? I stand against many of "his" religious institutions, who use their faith as an excuse to do terrible things. Does that make me his enemy?
    Ultimately, I can't live my life worrying about that. I do what I believe is right. I try to make this world a better place, and love my fellow human being, while defending them against any oppressors, regardless the reason for their hostility.
  • holyher... elijahin24 2012/08/15 05:09:44
  • Cat elijahin24 2012/08/15 15:56:24
    Cat
    +1
    Our reasoning is limited by our tiny brains. Reason tells me that one or the other belief system has done more harm or more good or good through history. Reason allows me to read The Gita, the Qur'an, The Bible, The Watch Tower, The Book of Mormon, and several different Buddhist publications and to decide which faith's fundamental beliefs, if practiced, will produce peaceful, caring, helpful, generous and loving followers. But that is only as far as reason can take me.
    Then instinct or gut feeling comes in. I was born with an innate sense that there has to be a reason or logic to the universe, thus an intelligent force behind that reason. Only we humans of all creatures seem to have that sense of the eternal and the divine. We are not driven just by instinct to hunt, gather eat, sleep, procreate, fight and die like other communal animals (wolves, chimps, etc.). We imagine, we visualize abstractions, like symbols and words, we are the artists of Earth. We each have a conscience that sets parameters for us far beyond mere survival of the pack. We all come prepackaged with the ability to understand good and evil. We must be taught that concept but it comes easily, and without a sense of right from wrong, civilization breaks down. Societies all need a set of rules (laws) in order t...






    Our reasoning is limited by our tiny brains. Reason tells me that one or the other belief system has done more harm or more good or good through history. Reason allows me to read The Gita, the Qur'an, The Bible, The Watch Tower, The Book of Mormon, and several different Buddhist publications and to decide which faith's fundamental beliefs, if practiced, will produce peaceful, caring, helpful, generous and loving followers. But that is only as far as reason can take me.
    Then instinct or gut feeling comes in. I was born with an innate sense that there has to be a reason or logic to the universe, thus an intelligent force behind that reason. Only we humans of all creatures seem to have that sense of the eternal and the divine. We are not driven just by instinct to hunt, gather eat, sleep, procreate, fight and die like other communal animals (wolves, chimps, etc.). We imagine, we visualize abstractions, like symbols and words, we are the artists of Earth. We each have a conscience that sets parameters for us far beyond mere survival of the pack. We all come prepackaged with the ability to understand good and evil. We must be taught that concept but it comes easily, and without a sense of right from wrong, civilization breaks down. Societies all need a set of rules (laws) in order to survive.
    I was raised in a nominally protestant home with a Native American dad who was just barely a Christian. I tried Buddhism for a while and felt unfulfilled. Spent a short time in a Hindu Ashram and only felt like a fish out of water, I endured a successful vision quest at age 21, and was a celebrant in the long house for several years without ever renouncing my, then tiny amount of, belief in Christianity. Something in me kept telling me to seek God and give Him (I use Him and Father as a generic, as I doubt that gender exists in that realm) due attention.
    I went from Quaker meeting room to several different churches, and I studied the Bible with a critical eye, while also studying Mormonism, Islam, The Watchtower Society, Bah'ai, and even other sects of Hinduism.
    It took surrendering to God (some call it the baptism of The Spirit, I
    t is being fully open to God and accepting the indwelling of the Holy Spirit of God into your very soul) to finally be able to grow spiritually and gain enough understanding of The Word of God, by study and fervent prayer and spiritual revelation, learning why we exist at all and of His will for us. Now I do not fear to speak boldly and to love just as boldly.
    As for your struggle against those who misquote scripture and twist religion to do evil, I applaud you. Evil should be called out wherever it lurks. Your conscience is usually going to be spot on, that's why you were given it. We have a saying, hate the sin, love the sinner. We believe in redemption, that people can change if led in love. If you've been attacking for example Roman Catholic priests and their leadership for child abuse and the cover-up activities around it I'm with you. But if you broadened that attack to the entire denomination or even worse to blame their God, you've gone over the line and need to confess to God and repent and then atone (perhaps by writing of your error on sodahead or in whatever medium the attacks were made.
    Please remember that I'm only giving my advice. I'm not your judge, only your helper and, I hope, your friend. If there is anything else I can help you with please message or email me.
    Cat out.
    (more)
  • elijahin24 Cat 2012/08/15 17:48:38
    elijahin24
    +1
    I don't doubt your sincerety, or suspect you of judging me. I love conversations like this. They are the ones where good people of different ideas, can gain understanding of one another, and maybe even be persuaded, at least on some topics.
    You're right, I blame the institution of the Roman Catholic Church for the cover-up of child-molestation; but I do not blame each member of the RCC, or even all of the leaders within it. I blame radical Islam for the 9-11 attacks, but not each invididual Muslim. I am well aware that within every belief system, there are good people and wicked ones, as well as people who are not necessarily evil, but are just douche-bags. And of course, I would include atheists in that as well.
    I don't blame God for any of the things they do. Again, It would be silly to blame what I believe to be an imaginary character, for the actions of those who believe in him. By the same token, I don't credit God with the good, done by his believers. I think a good person would be a good person, regardless of their religion.
    As for the inate understanding of right and wrong, I don't believe that is so either. At least not in terms of it having been planted in our brains. Every child is naturally selfish, and many if not most are even violent. It takes teaching, to ge...


    I don't doubt your sincerety, or suspect you of judging me. I love conversations like this. They are the ones where good people of different ideas, can gain understanding of one another, and maybe even be persuaded, at least on some topics.
    You're right, I blame the institution of the Roman Catholic Church for the cover-up of child-molestation; but I do not blame each member of the RCC, or even all of the leaders within it. I blame radical Islam for the 9-11 attacks, but not each invididual Muslim. I am well aware that within every belief system, there are good people and wicked ones, as well as people who are not necessarily evil, but are just douche-bags. And of course, I would include atheists in that as well.
    I don't blame God for any of the things they do. Again, It would be silly to blame what I believe to be an imaginary character, for the actions of those who believe in him. By the same token, I don't credit God with the good, done by his believers. I think a good person would be a good person, regardless of their religion.
    As for the inate understanding of right and wrong, I don't believe that is so either. At least not in terms of it having been planted in our brains. Every child is naturally selfish, and many if not most are even violent. It takes teaching, to get them out of that. I think that our understanding of right and wrong, is not the result of divine laws, but rather of societal evolution. I don't want to be killed, so I don't kill. I don't want you to steal from me, so I don't steal. As the generations have come and gone, we've refined our sence of morality, to include laws against rape, slavery, and assault. But the fact that these laws are relatively recent in human history, is just proof that they were NOT originally planted in our brains.

    Still, none of this is why I don't believe in God. I don't believe, for the same reason I don't believe in the Loch Ness Monster, or mermaids, or Bigfoot. It isn't that I KNOW that there is no god. But there is no solid evidence that he is real. And in the absence of evidence to the affirmative, the most logical conclusion is the negative.
    I too have studied many different faiths. I've studied them extensively. I grew up a Christian; but in the end, it just didn't add up. If there is a god and he wants me to believe, he can prove himself. But I won't be coerced with threats of Hhell, or bribed with promises of Heaven. The only reason to believe, for me; is that it is most logical conclusion.
    (more)
  • Cat elijahin24 2012/08/15 20:11:54
    Cat
    +1
    I too am enjoying our dialogue, in part because of your occupation. All the men in my family served their country I copied your message and will read it later. I have to get ready now and prepare. I conduct a Bible study on Wednesday Evenings and teach adult Sunday School on Sunday (of course). I'll leave a message for you tomorrow, I'll attach a picture of my favorite nephew (on right) and his buddies taken in 2008 or 2009. Probably similarto some of your collection. FallujahFlag
  • holyher... Cat 2012/08/16 02:33:12
  • Cat elijahin24 2012/08/15 20:15:53
    Cat
    +1
    PS: It's obvious that you are a good and moral man. I respect that a lot.
  • holyher... Cat 2012/08/16 02:34:00
  • holyher... elijahin24 2012/08/16 02:24:05 (edited)
  • holyher... Cat 2012/08/16 02:05:43
  • holyher... Cat 2012/08/15 05:06:17
  • holyher... elijahin24 2012/08/15 05:04:26
  • Swan Eshdeh 2012/08/12 17:37:19
    Woe unto the disbelievers from the meeting of an awful Day.Jesus was not the ...
    Swan Eshdeh
    +2
    can you make respect to Jesus peace be upon him ..he was good to humanity..he shall save lives. i am a Muslim and i don't like this.he is a good man and a prophet for god's sake!!
  • holyher... Swan Es... 2012/08/13 09:04:00
  • Swan Es... holyher... 2012/08/13 20:01:50
    Swan Eshdeh
    +2
    holy ? don't you ever get tired of making pictures here ?? ever??..but i have to admit this is the sweetest picture you have put ever here.
  • holyher... Swan Es... 2012/08/14 09:25:20
  • Swan Es... holyher... 2012/08/14 20:12:07
    Swan Eshdeh
    +1
    yes..this is good one too!
  • elijahin24 Swan Es... 2012/08/14 20:44:17
    elijahin24
    Is it not possible to respect the teachings and philosophy of the man, without accepting his claims of divinity?
  • Swan Es... elijahin24 2012/08/14 22:20:47
    Swan Eshdeh
    i don't know what you mean ...but the man i believe in (Peace be upon him)...i respect his teaching and acceptingevery thing regarding him.
  • elijahin24 Swan Es... 2012/08/14 23:06:30
    elijahin24
    It is my belief that Yeshua (Jesus) was just a man. A great teacher, who preached wisdom and love and peace; but a man all the same. I do not believe he was a god or the son of one. I don't believe he was a prophet. I think he was just a very wise philosopher. I think all of the miracles were added to his story after the fact, by people who were capitalizing on his name.
  • Swan Es... elijahin24 2012/08/14 23:31:34
    Swan Eshdeh
    well i agree with you till this"...I do not believe he was a god or the son of one".he really was a man not the son of god ...he was a prohet,,,he continued the message of other prophet like Moses (PBUH) and Ibraham (PBUH)...so Muhammad did (PBUH)....that what i believe in as a muslim .
  • elijahin24 Swan Es... 2012/08/15 00:26:41
    elijahin24
    +1
    My point is that I don't believe any of them were prophets., I don't believe in God. I believe in much of the philosophy of Yeshua, but not his relationship with any god.
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