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A woman claims Romney owes her a $25,000 debt for his great-grandfather, Miles P. Romney jumping bail,in the 1880's. Does she have a legitimate claim?

Steverno~POTL~PWCM~JLA 2012/08/29 05:40:05
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The Debt

MITT ROMNEY OWES ME money. Not a lot of money by his standards, but a fair little chunk of change by mine. It’s an old debt, in fact a family matter, and I’d like to say right here and now that I think it’s high time it was repaid.

Here is the story of that indebtedness:

In the 1870s, Mitt Romney’s great-grandfather, Miles P. Romney, and my great-grandfather, William Jordan Flake, were patriarchs of adjoining Mormon communities in the high, cold, hard country of northern Arizona, a region known as Apache County. They had been sent to northern Arizona by the prophet Brigham Young to settle new communities and expand the kingdom of Deseret, which was the name the Mormons liked to use for their fiefdom in the West (it’s the word for honey bees and meant to evoke their ceaseless industry).

Both Romney and Flake were descendants of early English converts to the Mormon Church: their fathers had made the great trek westward in the late 1840s and settled in Utah, where Miles Romney became known for his roles in amateur theatricals while Flake was celebrated for his horsemanship and frontier skills. A few years before they were called to become part of Brigham Young’s plan to establish a corridor from Utah to Mexico, both Romney and Flake had been told to take additional wives, much to the chagrin of their original spouses. But because polygamy was considered to be the “Divine Principle,” a commandment revealed by God, and because one did not disobey the Prophet Brigham Young, both Romney and Flake added wives to their households. As it turned out, Flake married, as his second wife, a young family friend, 16-year-old Prudence Kartchner, my great-grandmother.

Shortly after William Jordan Flake arrived in Arizona, he bought up a very large tract of land from a white settler named Stinson – the first white settler, in fact, in that part of Arizona – and founded a new town, called Snowflake, named after himself and an apostle of the church, Erastus Snow. Miles P. Romney landed in a community not far away called St. Johns, a settlement on the Little Colorado River described by one writer as a “wild amalgamation of gun-toting immigrant farmers, Native Americans, and Mexicans, many of whom despised the Mormons.”

There were complaints about the newcomers, not only over whether they actually owned title to their land (Flake could prove he did, Romney was less lucky) but also about their scandalous practice of polygamy. A new anti-polygamy law, much tougher than an older one that had rarely been enforced, had been enacted by the U.S. government in 1882 and federal marshals were under orders to make it stick this time. The marshals began rounding up the Arizona polygamists and arresting them. Both Romney and Flake became targets. But Flake, as it turned out, had become a deeply respected man, much more so than Miles Romney. One newspaper editor wrote of Romney, who had a well-known fondness for wine in spite of the Mormon prohibition against drinking, that he considered him “a mass of putrid pus and rotten goose pimples; a skunk, with the face of a baboon, the character of a louse, the breath of a buzzard and the record of a perjurer and common drunkard.” In other words, he didn’t like him.

Eventually both Romney and my great-grandfather were arrested – Flake on polygamy charges, and Romney on charges of polygamy and some related to false land claims. He beat the polygamy charge by sending two of his three wives into hiding, but not the accusation about having no title to his land, and he was arrested again. Because Romney had no money and my great-grandfather Flake did, Flake posted bail for both of them. The bail was $1,000 each, a considerable sum in the 1880s.

Now we come to the matter I’d like to bring up with Mitt.

Miles P. Romney skipped out on his bail, fleeing across the border into Mexico with his three wives, Hannah, Annie, and Catharine, and their children. He landed in Colonia Juarez where he helped establish a new sanctuary for Mormon polygamists. He left my great-grandfather Flake holding the bag. Flake, on the other hand, was eventually sent to the Yuma Territorial Prison where he served out a six-month sentence for polygamy, after which he returned to Snowflake and his two wives and children and continued to lived happily with them, undisturbed by the law, a revered leader of the community. He later became one of the first Arizona state senators, and died at the age of 94, having produced an extraordinary number of progeny. Romney stayed in Mexico, where Mitt’s father George was born.

Miles Park Romney

Fig. 2. Miles Park Romney, here pictured in theatrical costume, was said to be a "colossus of the stage." Photograph courtesy of the Special Collections Department, J. Willard Marriott Library, University of Utah, Salt Lake City, Utah.

The point is Miles P. Romney never bothered to repay my great-grandfather Flake the thousand dollars he owed him for posting his bail. Since it’s never too late to make a situation right, and since Mitt Romney seems to have sufficient funds now to cover his ancestor’s old debt, I’d like to call upon him to do so. I’ve done some calculation, and $1,000 from the 1880s would today be worth about $25,000, not counting interest (and since I’m not a smart enough to figure up the interest, I’m willing to let that part slide). Because William Jordan Flake has about 15,000 descendants living at the moment, I realize I’ll have to divide up the money should Romney do the right thing and write out that check.

However, I want to assure Mitt that I’m more than happy to be the disperser of the funds and I guarantee that all the Flakes of the world will get their fair share the moment he does the right thing.

Read more: http://lareviewofbooks.org/article.php?type=&id;=877&fulltext...

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Top Opinion

  • Stryder 2012/08/29 06:07:31
    No,she doesn't have a legitimate claim because....
    Stryder
    +12
    Kind of ironic that she has someone named "Flake" in her family. This is idiotic.

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  • Dwight-... Hawkeye 2012/08/29 13:21:47
    Dwight-AFCL>dogsbody
    +1
    If it's Leftist propaganda then the Public Library will have a copy I can get. I had a great aunt who married, went West and joined the LDS, but they were childless from what we've found.
  • Hawkeye Dwight-... 2012/08/29 13:32:52
    Hawkeye
    +2
    There are probably elements of truth in there somewhere but I got the distinct imprssion that this Judith Freeman was trying to shovel the burdens of the entire history of the Mormans onto Romney's shoulders..

    I wonder what religion SHE finally picked as her own because quite frankly,, i don't believe that ANYBODY can come out it looking like a Saint when saddled with the responsibility for their religion's entire history.. Not EVEN the ATHEISTS..
  • Dwight-... Hawkeye 2012/08/29 13:39:44
    Dwight-AFCL>dogsbody
    +1
    That would be a heavy burden. I'm going to try finding a copy without buying it. I hate spending money on propaganda.
  • mk, Smartass Oracle 2012/08/29 12:35:36
    Other Thoughts!
    mk, Smartass Oracle
    +2
    She's just wants her 15 minutes of fame.
  • ImageBandit ~ American Patriot 2012/08/29 12:33:52
    No,she doesn't have a legitimate claim because....
    ImageBandit ~ American Patriot
    +4
    when someone dies - the debt dies with them
  • Artist 2012/08/29 12:28:00
    No,she doesn't have a legitimate claim because....
    Artist
    +6
    But that was funny! Jeeze, I better watch out for some unknown cousin or frienemy may show up some day and claim that my great-somebody owed their great-somebody some money and they want it back now! Kinda reminds me of blacks wanting reparations for slavery when modern day blacks never were slaves and modern day whites never were slave owners...
  • Moonage 2012/08/29 12:16:21
    No,she doesn't have a legitimate claim because....
    Moonage
    +4
    Of all the descendants of both parties, why would this person assume Mitt owes ALL of it?

    This person is nothing but a gold digger. You divide the $25,000 by the approximately 15,000 descendants of Miles and Mitt honestly owes them about $1. Divide THAT by the 15,000 and Mitt owes this one idiot 1/15,000 of one dollar. However, since they apparently made no good faith effort to ever collect the original $1,000, then according to almost all laws, Miles never even legally owed the original money in the first place. As far as anyone truly knows, it could have been money tendered for some service we're not aware of.

    Bottom line, this is stupid.
  • Maynard 2012/08/29 12:15:34
    Other Thoughts!
    Maynard
    +4
    Does the Obama family from Kenya still owe any Goats to the Dunham family from Kansas?

    GET FRIGGEN REAL, sorta funny though.
  • +Harmonious Love+ 2012/08/29 12:06:54
    No,she doesn't have a legitimate claim because....
    +Harmonious Love+
    +5
    I'd say that over 100 years is quite long enough to hold a grudge. Move on Lady!
  • Kat 2012/08/29 11:59:10
    No,she doesn't have a legitimate claim because....
    Kat
    +5
    Totally stupid.
  • santa6642 2012/08/29 11:53:08
    Other Thoughts!
    santa6642
  • Hawkeye 2012/08/29 11:25:19
    No,she doesn't have a legitimate claim because....
    Hawkeye
    +5
    Isn't it AMAZING how these things ALWAYS turn up during these periods of time??

    I guess that even the left realizes that trotting out a string of Prostitutes ALL claiming that Mitt had sex with them just wasn't going to FLY this time so they borrowed a startegy RIGHT out of the Black Militaristic Community.. Make a claim of REPARATIONS..

    Have somebody who is owed NOTHING make a claim of indebtedness to a popular Republican Candidate who owes nothing..

    HEH,, It's GOOD to see that Obama's time in college wasn't ALL spent attached to a crackpipe..
  • ray 2012/08/29 10:42:00
    Other Thoughts!
    ray
    +5
    Was Mitt Romney chosen at random ? Their are other wives , with other children and other grand children. Perhaps look down other branches of the the clan and try to extract money from some of the Mexican Branches .
  • Space Invader 2012/08/29 10:25:28
    No,she doesn't have a legitimate claim because....
    Space Invader
    +6
    someone owes me; by these standards; $185,457.25 for a land deal from the 1700's from father....time is up; no one to pay and no one will..it is part of history..
  • Dwight-... Space I... 2012/08/29 12:41:24
    Dwight-AFCL>dogsbody
    +1
    My problem over that sort of thing would be that I mite have to pay myself for some ancestors wronging another ancestor from a different branch.
  • Space I... Dwight-... 2012/08/29 15:56:59
    Space Invader
    +2
    no you wouldn't; only if you were part of the original transaction and you would continue to profit; knowing that this actual event happened
  • Dwight-... Space I... 2012/08/29 16:31:35
    Dwight-AFCL>dogsbody
    +1
    No, it won't happen, it's not even possible. But the humour of the demand is so damned funny.
  • ed 2012/08/29 08:58:07
    No,she doesn't have a legitimate claim because....
    ed
    +3
    that was then and this is now,way to many years gone by for her to collect.It would be very interesting to hear what Romney would do in this matter.Would he pay the money or not?
  • Dagon 2012/08/29 08:57:55
  • Stevern... Dagon 2012/08/29 13:11:36
    Steverno~POTL~PWCM~JLA
    +2
    I'm posted this story as an example of how the Democrats & Obama can bring into the discussion the early days of Mormonism.And that Mitt Romney's great grandfather had practiced polygamy.

    You know the Democratic political hacks on MSNBC and other networks would happily would use Mormonism as a wedge issue to depress & flip Christians voters away from Gov.Romney.And retailing a old story like this is the perfect excuse to discuss Mormonism,in the upcoming weeks before the election!
  • Dagon Stevern... 2012/08/29 16:41:02
  • Joe61 2012/08/29 08:07:39 (edited)
    No,she doesn't have a legitimate claim because....
    Joe61
    +7
    The 1880s lol.....That would be a world record, Debts can not be rolled over from grandfather to son let alone grandchildren and great grandchildren. Mr thinks this is just a Bampot trying to make political whoopee at Romney's expense.

    I just wonder if this a genuine claim. Why she left it until the eve of his POTUS election to bringing it into the public domain?

    Obama must be experiencing total desperation if this is the only kind of ammunition he has left in the political armoury.
  • britbiker 2012/08/29 06:43:03
    No,she doesn't have a legitimate claim because....
    britbiker
    +7
    What the hell is this woman talking about ? Its an old debt. Why should some one have to pay for something that they did not make. I got several calls on some bills my mother did not pay before she died. I was expected to pay for her debt?I never received any money or benifits due to her death.
  • goatman112003 2012/08/29 06:39:45
    No,she doesn't have a legitimate claim because....
    goatman112003
    +8
    Sins of the parents can't be passed on to the children under our law.
  • Walt 2012/08/29 06:10:29
    Other Thoughts!
    Walt
    +9
    The woman doesn't understand personal responsibility. If she wants to collect, she should hire a medium and hold a seance, but as far as I know, there is no such thing as a debt collection agency capable of sending collection notices to the deceased.

    medium hold seance debt collection agency sending collection notices deceased
  • Stryder 2012/08/29 06:07:31
    No,she doesn't have a legitimate claim because....
    Stryder
    +12
    Kind of ironic that she has someone named "Flake" in her family. This is idiotic.
  • Chi~Cat Stryder 2012/08/29 09:33:27
  • gregaj7 2012/08/29 06:02:24
    No,she doesn't have a legitimate claim because....
    gregaj7
    +5
    Good luck with that.
  • shadow76 2012/08/29 06:00:42
    No,she doesn't have a legitimate claim because....
    shadow76
    +5
    That is stupid!
  • DavE 2012/08/29 05:57:47
    Other Thoughts!
    DavE
    +8
    Interesting and entertaining story.
    I'm not into paying reparations for what any ancestor did or did not do.
    And legally she doesn't have against Mitt Romney either.
  • Steverno~POTL~PWCM~JLA 2012/08/29 05:53:27
    Other Thoughts!
    Steverno~POTL~PWCM~JLA
    +7
    This sounds like a story that the nimrods at MSNBC will spend a full day covering as a 'news story'.In order to attempt to characterize Romney as an man lacking the character to pay an 'old Romney family' debt!
  • Hula girl - Friends not Fol... 2012/08/29 05:51:36
    No,she doesn't have a legitimate claim because....
    Hula girl - Friends not Followers
    +8
    What an idiot. Money grabbers and just wants her 1 minute of fame. Usless dork.
  • Mark In Irvine 2012/08/29 05:45:20 (edited)
    No,she doesn't have a legitimate claim because....
    Mark In Irvine
    +3
    even if she somehow inherited the claim, the statute of limitations on enforcement of the claim has long expired ... this DOES show that the Romneys are just a bunch of no-good, bail-jumping crooks, however ...
  • Hula gi... Mark In... 2012/08/29 05:52:40
    Hula girl - Friends not Followers
    +10
    You mean like a pot smoking dealer of the current President.

    Do you feel you are the bearer of all your relatives before you sins?
  • Mark In... Hula gi... 2012/08/29 05:54:19
    Mark In Irvine
    +4
    i'm just kidding!! of course Mitt has no responsibility for something his great-grandfather did or didn't do ... i'm joking!

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