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0bama’s Lies And Denials About Where He Was Born Go On And On

BlueMax372 2012/03/07 20:24:48

By George Spelvin

Barack Hussein Obama, using eight different names, has failed to meet eligibility requirements for the office of U.S. President. This is according to a 19 point challenge alleging he was born in Kenya to a Kenyan citizen and a teenage mother not old enough to convey U.S. citizenship.

Democratic Attorney Philip J. Berg, who filed his challenge to the nomination petition with the Pennsylvania Commonwealth on February 23, doubts in Argument 13 that “Obama ever held Natural Born Citizenship (NBC) status!”

Centering on the NBC clause, Article II, Sect. 1, Clause 5, the eligibility challenge states that Barack Hussein Obama, aka Barack Hussein Soetoro is “not a Natural Born Citizen as defined by the U.S, Constitution.”

Furthermore, Obama was “born in Kenya on August 4, 1961, (and) at the time of his birth his mother was only 18 years old and not old enough to confer U.S. NBC status to him.”

The native born Pennsylvania attorney is bringing transparency to the Obama eligibility problem, for which media pundits and liberal politicians have ridiculed birthers just for bringing it up. Berg’s argumentation point 3 says (BHO) was “born at Coast Hospital in Mombasa, Kenya located in Coast Province,’ to a father who was a Kenyan citizen, and to a mother “not old enough and did not reside in the U.S. long enough to register the Candidate’s birth in Hawai’i as a NBC. Berg cites five different case law applications here and further says that the law applied to overseas births must be in effect at the time of the birth in question.

He cites Marquez-Marques aka Moreno v. Gonzales. 455F.3rd 548 (5th Circuit 2006) and the Runnett v. Shultz 901 F.2d 782,783 (9th Cir. 1990) to further bolster the validity of his challenge.

The eight different names cited are Barack Hussein Obama; Barack Hussein Soetoro; Barack Hussein Obama II; Barack H. Obama; Barry H. Obama; Barry H. Soetoro; Barry Hussein Obama; Barry Hussein Soetoro.

Now, nearly one half of the Obama candidacy challenge has to do with his adoption by Lolo Soetoro when his mother Stanley Ann Dunham Obama married and moved to the police state of Indonesia. When a male Indonesian citizen adopts or “acknowledges a child as his son,” that child is deemed to be Indonesian because the country does not allow dual citizenship status.

The U.S. law neither allows dual citizenship nor intervention according to the 1930 Hague Convention protocols. A main exhibit to the challenge presents school records of Obama-Soetoro who holds the burden of proof for being eligible to appear on the Pennsylvania primary election ballot.

Dramatic testimony of Obama’s Kenyan grandmother, who stated in Swahili she was present at his birth, also is entered into the challenge document and provides further cause. Berg’s official challenge is a project funded by the U.S. Justice Foundation whose executive director Gary Kreep is serving as co-counsel.

The concluding analysis of this monumental legal keystone in the state whose very symbol is the crown arch can be found in the statement of Obama’s grandmother Sarah Obama who was “very adamant that Soetoro was born in Kenya!”

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  • Temlakos~POTL~PWCM~JLA~☆ 2012/03/07 20:36:09
    Temlakos~POTL~PWCM~JLA~☆
    +21
    The NBC designation requires TWO things:

    1. Born in-country,

    2. to TWO citizen parents!

    Obama demonstrably FAILS the second one. And NOW, he mightn't even meet the FIRST!

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  • BlueMax372 ☆GrayBe... 2012/03/09 00:50:57
    BlueMax372
    +2
    You are very likely correct. How we let this abortion take place is simply beyond comprehension.
  • ☆GrayBe... BlueMax372 2012/03/09 01:07:03
    ☆GrayBeard☆ ~PWCM~JLA~
    +2
    You are correct. It completely amazes me that we've gotten this deep in the crap.

    The one issue everyone overlooks is his adoption by Soetoro. I researched Indonesian law; any child, of any nationality, when adopted by an Indonesian national is automatically conferred Indonesian citizenship (same thing applies to the US, except the age is 12. Over the age of 12 and they have to go through the naturalization process).
    The Pakistan trip in the '80s is what seals the deal. The records are sealed on the trip but he most likely traveled on an Indonesian passport. If he was over the age of 18 (which he was) then he de facto acknowledged his Indonesian citizenship and forfeited his claim to American citizenship (USA does not allow dual citizenship). Everyone keeps concentrating on the Kenya angle (I do think he was born in Mombasa - I've been there, it's a hell-hole), but it's the Indonesia issue that will be his undoing.
  • strawberry ☆GrayBe... 2012/03/09 08:58:19
    strawberry
    +1
    Where did you research Obama's adoption by Soetoro.? Where is your proof GrayBear.? Soetoro was working in Hawaii, attending Hawaii Universtiy when he married Obama's mother in Hawaii. President Obama was only in Indonesia up to 4th grade attending St. Francis of Assisi Catholic School in Jakarta. After 4th grade Obama moved back to Hawaii, where Obama lived with his
    grandparents. At birth President Obama was a U.S. Citizen born in Hawaii due to his mother being a U.S. Citizen. . Obama at birth due to his father automatically was a British Citizen, later a Kenyan Citizen, but lost both British and Kenyan Citizenship. Kenyan Constitution does not allow dual citizenship except for children. President Obama was born on U.S. soil. "U.S. Constitution - Article 2 Section 1"
    http://www.usconstitution.net...
    "No person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of The United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President, neither shall any Person be eligible to that office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty-five years, and been fourteen years a Resident within the United States." So you see, all your comments, opinions mean nothing. Maybe Obama was even a Russian Citizen. LOL! Fact President Obama was born in Honolulu Hawaii, U.S. soil, whether you like it or not.
  • ☆GrayBe... strawberry 2012/03/09 23:30:38 (edited)
    ☆GrayBeard☆ ~PWCM~JLA~
    +1
    Is the kool-aid good?

    Edit: Нечетные вы должны выбрать русский ...

    Ukraine
  • K. Katt strawberry 2012/03/10 00:33:40
    K. Katt
    You are correct. I only take issue with your statement that Obama "...was a U.S. citizen born in Hawaii due to his mother being a U.S. citizen." He is a citizen simply because he was born in Hawaii. His mother's citizenship status is irrelevant. The so called "anchor babies" born in the US to illegal aliens are citizens.
  • Angela strawberry 2012/03/10 16:10:33
    Angela
    +1
    Wow..well that's it, strawberry must be right bcause she says so..unfortunately for strawberry when SHTF she will most likely regret this support of a man who is not only the enemy of the free world, but the enemy of the Creator Himself. This Prince Hall/Boule freemason is pure evil.
  • K. Katt ☆GrayBe... 2012/03/10 00:29:21
    K. Katt
    You guys are hilarious. Just for my amusement, when you say "...I researched Indonesian law..." tell me, just what did you do? I'm wondering if you aren't really Democrats who are trying to sabotage a Republican win by keeping this stuff alive so we look like a bunch of idiots.
  • ☆GrayBe... K. Katt 2012/03/10 01:01:12
    ☆GrayBeard☆ ~PWCM~JLA~
    +1
    I own an adoption facilitation service that operates in 3 Eastern European countries. Citizenship issues are not new to me. I have access to the adoption law archives of any nation that is a signatory to the Hague Convention on International Adoption.
  • K. Katt ☆GrayBe... 2012/03/10 01:28:11 (edited)
    K. Katt
    And you did your research where? Doesn't everyone have access to the adoption laws? What I am asking you is: Did you go to a law library at a courthouse in Bulgaria (or whatever Eastern European country), and read about the adoption laws of Indonesia? Is that what your response meant? Also what's your view of Lynch v. Clarke?
  • ☆GrayBe... K. Katt 2012/03/10 14:05:09
    ☆GrayBeard☆ ~PWCM~JLA~
    +1
    Native born Americans

    The term native born Americans refers to those persons who were born in the United States, as opposed to Foreign born Americans who were born outside the US. In the US a person receives citizenship by simply being born in the US. Thus all native born Americans who have not given up or lost their citizenship for any reason are US citizens. Native born Americans make the majority of European and African Americans. Among Hispanics, native born were in the minority. All members of Native American tribes were also counted as native born Americans.

    Natural-born citizen

    US constitutional definition

    The United States Constitution does not define the term "natural born citizen"; however, it does confer on Congress the power: "To establish an uniform Rule of Naturalization."

    Section 1 of Article II of the Constitution contains the clause:
    “ No Person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any Person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States. ”

    Additionally, the 12th Amendment to the Constitution states that: "[N]o person constituti...

















    Native born Americans

    The term native born Americans refers to those persons who were born in the United States, as opposed to Foreign born Americans who were born outside the US. In the US a person receives citizenship by simply being born in the US. Thus all native born Americans who have not given up or lost their citizenship for any reason are US citizens. Native born Americans make the majority of European and African Americans. Among Hispanics, native born were in the minority. All members of Native American tribes were also counted as native born Americans.

    Natural-born citizen

    US constitutional definition

    The United States Constitution does not define the term "natural born citizen"; however, it does confer on Congress the power: "To establish an uniform Rule of Naturalization."

    Section 1 of Article II of the Constitution contains the clause:
    “ No Person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any Person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States. ”

    Additionally, the 12th Amendment to the Constitution states that: "[N]o person constitutionally ineligible to the office of President shall be eligible to that of Vice-President of the United States."

    It is thought the origin of the natural-born citizen clause can be traced to a July 25, 1787, letter from John Jay to George Washington, presiding officer of the Constitutional Convention. John Jay wrote: "Permit me to hint, whether it would be wise and seasonable to provide a strong check to the admission of Foreigners into the administration of our national Government; and to declare expressly that the Commander in Chief of the American army shall not be given to nor devolve on, any but a natural born Citizen." There was no debate, and this qualification for the office of the Presidency was introduced by the drafting Committee of Eleven, and then adopted without discussion by the Constitutional Convention.

    Precedence (a little more recent / relevent):

    Dred Scott v. Sandford, 60 U.S. 393 (1857): In regard to the "natural born citizen" clause, the dissent states that it is acquired by place of birth (jus soli), not through blood or lineage (jus sanguinis): "The first section of the second article of the Constitution uses the language, 'a natural-born citizen.' It thus assumes that citizenship may be acquired by birth. Undoubtedly, this language of the Constitution was used in reference to that principle of public law, well understood in this country at the time of the adoption of the Constitution, which referred citizenship to the place of birth." (Much of the majority opinion in this case was overturned by the 14th Amendment in 1868.)

    United States v. Wong Kim Ark, 169 U.S. 649 (1898): A person born within the jurisdiction of the U.S. to non-citizens who "are not employed in any diplomatic or official capacity" is automatically a citizen.

    Weedin v. Chin Bow, 274 U.S. 657 (1927): A child born outside the U.S. cannot claim U.S. citizenship by birth through a U.S. citizen parent who had never lived in the U.S. prior to the child's birth. (This is still true today, although the specific statutes upon which the Supreme Court's ruling was based have changed since 1927.)

    Montana v. Kennedy, 366 U.S. 308 (1961): A person born in 1906, whose mother was a native-born citizen of the United States and whose father was a foreign citizen, who was born overseas and then moved to the United States, was not a citizen of the United States by birth. (Note that the relevant laws have changed considerably since 1906, so this decision does not necessarily apply to later cases.)

    Schneider v. Rusk, 377 U.S. 163 (1964): The Court voided a statute that provided that a naturalized citizen should lose his United States citizenship if, following naturalization, he resided continuously for three years in his former homeland. "We start from the premise that the rights of citizenship of the native-born and of the naturalized person are of the same dignity and are coextensive. The only difference drawn by the Constitution is that only the 'natural born' citizen is eligible to be President."

    Miller v. Albright, 523 U.S. 420 (1998): A child born overseas to an American father and a foreign mother (not married) is not a U.S. citizen unless paternity is established before an established age (in this case 21). This case challenged the law on the grounds that U.S. law requires no explicit acknowledgment of parenthood in the case of a foreign-born child to an American mother and a foreign father (not married).

    Nguyen v. INS, 533 U.S. 53 (2001): As in the Miller v. Albright case, the Court holds that a child born overseas to an American father and a foreign mother (not married) is not a U.S. citizen unless paternity is established before an established age (in this case 18). The child was brought to the U.S. before his sixth birthday and raised by his father; however, after a criminal conviction, deportation was ordered but the child claimed U.S. citizenship. His citizenship was denied because paternity had not been established prior to his 18th birthday. The Court upheld the law, once again affirming that Congress has the power to define citizenship outside the citizenship dictated by the 14th Amendment (citizenship by birth).
    (more)
  • K. Katt ☆GrayBe... 2012/03/11 04:07:31
    K. Katt
    I don't see anything here that is in disagreement with my position. Do you? If so, what? By the way if you actually read some of these cases rather than just the summaries, several cases I read made the point that "Native born citizen" and "Natural born citizen" are the same thing.
  • ☆GrayBe... K. Katt 2012/03/11 15:25:47
    ☆GrayBeard☆ ~PWCM~JLA~
    Native born and Natural born citizen are not the same thing. If you are an attorney, you would know that. Legal definitions of words can, and usually are, vastly different from everyday speech.
  • K. Katt ☆GrayBe... 2012/03/12 22:51:50
    K. Katt
    I repeat, "several cases I read made the point that "Native born citizen" and "Natural born citizen" are the same thing."
  • BlueMax372 K. Katt 2012/03/12 22:52:40
    BlueMax372
    +1
    They err.
  • K. Katt BlueMax372 2012/03/13 02:45:37
    K. Katt
    You are pretty funny.
  • ☆GrayBe... K. Katt 2012/03/13 07:28:18
    ☆GrayBeard☆ ~PWCM~JLA~
    you are pretty persistently ignorant.
  • K. Katt ☆GrayBe... 2012/03/13 07:36:53
    K. Katt
    I've given you lots of chances to educate me. I've asked you repeatedly where the cases or statutes are that support your positions But you just never show them to me. They must be somewhere, if you're so sure they exist. Maybe you should ask god to show you where they are.
  • Angela K. Katt 2012/03/10 16:18:47
    Angela
    +1
    Okay Kat is also strawberry..sisters in arms..same dialog, same mindset, same destination, same goal. Are you two related per chance?..or just on the same 'team' so to speak?
  • K. Katt Angela 2012/03/11 04:59:49
    K. Katt
    We're not sisters in arms. I'm a Tom Cat not a Pussy Cat. I don't know what her intentions are, but she is correct on this issue.
  • Angela K. Katt 2012/03/10 16:16:09
    Angela
    +1
    Well funny you should say that Katt, I'm beginning to think you are a disinfo shill..a plant just to encourage more dissent amongst the patriots, while assuming the mantle of conservativship. You are not anti Obama..you are pro Obama so stop pretending, okay?? Hmm funny your icon is an 'arched' black cat, Kat..any symbolic subliminal reference attached to that per chance??
  • Angela Angela 2012/03/10 16:17:13
    Angela
    +1
    As well as the black and red, black mass motif..hmmm interesting.
  • K. Katt Angela 2012/03/11 05:03:07
    K. Katt
    Very interesting.
  • K. Katt Angela 2012/03/11 05:02:40
    K. Katt
    A relative of mine who does animation for TV cartoons made a short animation strip for me. After my great pal, a big black tom cat, died after 15 years, he gave me the animation strip so he "could live on". This is one frame from the strip.
  • Angela K. Katt 2012/03/12 22:38:53
    Angela
    +1
    Understood..I happen to have 2 beautiful black cats myself..Ruby and Jasmine.
  • K. Katt Angela 2012/03/13 02:47:09
    K. Katt
    My old cat was Karpov and my new cats are Vargas (black) and Lola (white with beautiful blue eyes)
  • Angela K. Katt 2012/03/14 12:53:15
    Angela
    Awe..nice!! My dog (shar-pei/Pit bull) is named Lola!..nice names you've selected!!
  • strawberry BlueMax372 2012/03/09 08:27:03
    strawberry
    Rick Santorum's wife is the one who had the late term abortion.
  • BlueMax372 strawberry 2012/03/10 17:09:12
    BlueMax372
    Did I mention anywhere that I give a $h*t? I lost interest in the Republican primaries when Perry dropped out.
  • K. Katt BlueMax372 2012/03/12 18:49:18
    K. Katt
    Perry was my choice too, but I was so disappointed by his debate performances. I can see why he dropped like a stone. He should have got in in the very beginning and really boned up on a lot of issues. Too bad.
  • BlueMax372 K. Katt 2012/03/12 22:49:50
    BlueMax372
    Tell me the last time a sitting POTUS was called upon to debate a turd world rectal pore? Who the FLIP made debating skill a qual for the office? Obviously, the pink slime media.
  • K. Katt BlueMax372 2012/03/13 02:52:43
    K. Katt
    I agree that debating skill isn't necessary to be POTUS. But I thought Perry looked like he was faking it half the time and so clearly seemed out of his depth. I was really taken by surprise at that. It was also disappointing about how the extreme right wing jumped on him about his fence and illegal immigrant positions.
  • strawberry ☆GrayBe... 2012/03/09 06:25:20
    strawberry
    Where are your typed facts on here.?
  • K. Katt ☆GrayBe... 2012/03/10 00:15:39 (edited)
    K. Katt
    I'm an attorney and I am quite familiar with constitutional issues and in fact have taught several courses in Law School, one of them being Constitutional Law. If Obama was born in Hawaii, then he is a "natural born citizen" within the meaning of the constitution regardless of whether his father was born in Kenya or on the moon.
  • ☆GrayBe... K. Katt 2012/03/10 00:46:43
    ☆GrayBeard☆ ~PWCM~JLA~
    +1
    Negative, Ghostrider. A natural born citizen is a child born to two American citizens on American soil, an American protectorate, an American embassy or military base, an American flagged vessel or aircraft. Soetoro's citizenship woes go way beyond whether his father was a Kenyan or not. Besides, Granny Obama claims to have been present at his birth at Coast Hospital in Mombasa, Kenya. The Kenyan government claims he was born there.

    I doubt you are an attorney, you can't even spell 'Constitutional'. The Constitution is also not the only indicator of citizenship law. There are plenty of statutes and precedence. Research Indonesian adoption law as it relates to citizenship of the minor child. Very enlightening.

    If you understand anything about the Constitution you understand what a Constitutional crisis having a foreign born President would be. Attorneys everywhere should be calling for a motion of discovery against all his sealed records to resolve the issue, not mocking people for bringing up the issue.
  • K. Katt ☆GrayBe... 2012/03/10 01:11:38
    K. Katt
    Take a look at Lynch v. Clarke, a very old case that has been cited in most of these citizenship/alien cases:

    "Although eligibility for the Presidency was not an issue in any 19th century litigation, there have been a few cases that shed light on "natural-born citizen". The leading case is Lynch v. Clarke,[28] which dealt with a New York law (similar to laws of other states at that time) that only a U.S. citizen could inherit real estate. The plaintiff, Julia Lynch, had been born in New York while her parents, both British, were briefly visiting the U.S., and shortly thereafter all three left for Britain and never returned to the U.S. The New York Chancery Court determined that, under common law and prevailing statutes, she was a U.S. citizen by birth and nothing had deprived her of that citizenship, notwithstanding that both her parents were not U.S. citizens or that British law might also claim her through her parents' nationality. In the course of the decision, the court cited the Constitutional provision and said:

    Suppose a person should be elected president who was native born, but of alien parents; could there be any reasonable doubt that he was eligible under the Constitution? I think not. The position would be decisive in his favor, that by the rule of the common law...








    Take a look at Lynch v. Clarke, a very old case that has been cited in most of these citizenship/alien cases:

    "Although eligibility for the Presidency was not an issue in any 19th century litigation, there have been a few cases that shed light on "natural-born citizen". The leading case is Lynch v. Clarke,[28] which dealt with a New York law (similar to laws of other states at that time) that only a U.S. citizen could inherit real estate. The plaintiff, Julia Lynch, had been born in New York while her parents, both British, were briefly visiting the U.S., and shortly thereafter all three left for Britain and never returned to the U.S. The New York Chancery Court determined that, under common law and prevailing statutes, she was a U.S. citizen by birth and nothing had deprived her of that citizenship, notwithstanding that both her parents were not U.S. citizens or that British law might also claim her through her parents' nationality. In the course of the decision, the court cited the Constitutional provision and said:

    Suppose a person should be elected president who was native born, but of alien parents; could there be any reasonable doubt that he was eligible under the Constitution? I think not. The position would be decisive in his favor, that by the rule of the common law, in force when the Constitution was adopted, he is a citizen.[29]"

    Sorry about the spelling, I type very fast and sometimes miss something. Anyway, Lynch v. Clarke undermines your ideas. It is interesting why you would believe that anything Indonesian law could do would eliminate someone's US citizenship.

    What is the basis for your belief that to be a citizen your parents have to be born in the U.S. also? You should explain this to the Californians who are complaining about the "anchor babies" born in California to illegal aliens from Mexico. The courts keep saying these kids are U.S. citizens. According to your definition, how can that be? It's because you're wrong.




    Th
    (more)
  • K. Katt ☆GrayBe... 2012/03/10 03:04:22
    K. Katt
    Here's some more information on the same subject:

    A three-member Indiana Court of Appeals stated: "Based upon the language of Article II, Section 1, Clause 4 and the guidance provided by Wong Kim Ark, we conclude that persons born within the borders of the United States are 'natural born Citizens' for Article II, Section 1 purposes, regardless of the citizenship of their parents." [94] Administrative Law Judge Michael Malihi in Georgia decided a group of eligibility challenge cases saying "The Indiana Court rejected the argument that Mr. Obama was ineligible, stating that the children born within the United States are natural born citizens, regardless of the citizenship of their parents. ... This Court finds the decision and analysis of Arkeny [sic] persuasive."[95] Federal District Judge John A Gibney, Jr. wrote in his decision in the case of Tisdale v. Obama, "The eligibility requirements to be President of the United States are such that the individual must be a "natural born citizen" of the United States ... It is well settled that those born in the United States are considered natural born citizens. See, e.g. United States v. Ark [sic] ..." [96]
  • Angela ☆GrayBe... 2012/03/10 16:25:25
    Angela
    +1
    Good one Graybear...Excellent sizing up the the enemy!!
  • ☆GrayBe... Angela 2012/03/10 17:18:25
    ☆GrayBeard☆ ~PWCM~JLA~
    +1
    Thank you, ma'am. They ain't too hard to figure out. LOL
  • K. Katt ☆GrayBe... 2012/03/11 08:53:21
    K. Katt
    Perhaps, but your answers to my questions have been pretty lame so far.
  • ☆GrayBe... K. Katt 2012/03/11 15:32:41
    ☆GrayBeard☆ ~PWCM~JLA~
    Your logic is lame. Clark v Lynch is not relevant because it occurred before the 14th Amendment was ratified. You need to read the summaries on the cases I cited to have a handle on modern law. Minor v Happersett also has bearing.

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