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It's the Guns - But We All Know, It's Not Really the Guns

Lenny 2012/07/25 16:02:40
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This article was written by Michael Moore. I would like both Liberals and Conservatives to answer this one. Do you agree or disagree with Michael Moore? State your reasons why you are firm on your position of this controversial subject.

Since Cain went nuts and whacked Abel, there have always been those humans who, for one reason or another, go temporarily or permanently insane and commit unspeakable acts of violence. There was the Roman Emperor Tiberius, who during the first century A.D. enjoyed throwing victims off a cliff on the Mediterranean island of Capri. Gilles de Rais, a French knight and ally of Joan of Arc during the middle ages, went cuckoo-for-Cocoa Puffs one day and ended up murdering hundreds of children. Just a few decades later Vlad the Impaler, the inspiration for Dracula, was killing people in Transylvania in numberless horrifying ways.

In modern times, nearly every nation has had a psychopath or two commit a mass murder, regardless of how strict their gun laws are – the crazed white supremacist in Norway one year ago Sunday, the schoolyard butcher in Dunblane, Scotland, the École Polytechnique killer in Montreal, the mass murderer in Erfurt, Germany … the list seems endless.

And now the Aurora shooter last Friday. There have always been insane people, and there always will be.

But here's the difference between the rest of the world and us: We have two Auroras that take placeevery single day of every single year! At least 24 Americans every day (8-9,000 a year) are killed by people with guns – and that doesn't count the ones accidentally killed by guns or who commit suicide with a gun. Count them and you can triple that number to over 25,000.

That means the United States is responsible for over 80 percent of all the gun deaths in the 23 richest countries combined. Considering that the people of those countries, as human beings, are no better or worse than any of us, well, then, why us?

Both conservatives and liberals in America operate with firmly held beliefs as to "the why" of this problem. And the reason neither can find their way out of the box toward a real solution is because, in fact, they're both half right.

The right believes that the Founding Fathers, through some sort of divine decree, have guaranteed them the absolute right to own as many guns as they desire. And they will ceaselessly remind you that a gun cannot fire itself – that "Guns don't kill people, people kill people."

Of course, they know they're being intellectually dishonest (if I can use that word) when they say that about the Second Amendment because they know the men who wrote the constitution just wanted to make sure a militia could be quickly called up from amongst the farmers and merchants should the Brits decide to return and wreak some havoc.

But they are half right when they say "Guns don't kill people." I would just alter that slogan slightly to speak the real truth: "Guns don't kill people, Americans kill people."

Because we're the only ones in the first world who do this en masse. And you'll hear all stripes of Americans come up with a host of reasons so that they don't have to deal with what's really behind all this murder and mayhem.

They'll say it's the violent movies and video games that are responsible. Last time I checked, the movies and video games in Japan are more violent than ours – and yet usually fewer than 20people a year are killed there with guns – and in 2006 the number was two!

Others will say it's the number of broken homes that lead to all this killing. I hate to break this to you, but there are almost as many single-parent homes in the U.K. as there are here – and yet, in Great Britain, there are usually fewer than 40 gun murders a year.

People like me will say this is all the result of the U.S. having a history and a culture of men with guns, "cowboys and Indians," "shoot first and ask questions later." And while it is true that the mass genocide of the Native Americans set a pretty ugly model to found a country on, I think it's safe to say we're not the only ones with a violent past or a penchant for genocide. Hello, Germany! That's right I'm talking about you and your history, from the Huns to the Nazis, just loving a good slaughter (as did the Japanese, and the British who ruled the world for hundreds of years – and they didn't achieve that through planting daisies). And yet in Germany, a nation of 80 million people, there are only around 200 gun murders a year.

So those countries (and many others) are just like us – except for the fact that more people here believe in God and go to church than any other Western nation.

My liberal compatriots will tell you if we just had less guns, there would be less gun deaths. And, mathematically, that would be true. If you have less arsenic in the water supply, it will kill less people. Less of anything bad – calories, smoking, reality TV – will kill far fewer people. And if we had strong gun laws that prohibited automatic and semi-automatic weapons and banned the sale of large magazines that can hold a gazillion bullets, well, then shooters like the man in Aurora would not be able to shoot so many people in just a few minutes.

But this, too, has a problem. There are plenty of guns in Canada (mostly hunting rifles) – and yet the annual gun murder count in Canada is around 200 deaths. In fact, because of its proximity, Canada's culture is very similar to ours – the kids play the same violent video games, watch the same movies and TV shows, and yet they don't grow up wanting to kill each other. Switzerland has the third-highest number of guns per capita on earth, but still a low murder rate.

So – why us?

I posed this question a decade ago in my film Bowling for Columbine, and this week, I have had little to say because I feel I said what I had to say 10 years ago – and it doesn't seem to have done a whole lot of good other than to now look like it was actually a crystal ball posing as a movie.

This is what I said then, and it is what I will say again today:

1. We Americans are incredibly good killers. We believe in killing as a way of accomplishing our goals. Three-quarters of our states execute criminals, even though the states with the lower murder rates are generally the states with no death penalty.

Our killing is not just historical (the slaughter of Indians and slaves and each other in a "civil" war). It is our current way of resolving whatever it is we're afraid of. It's invasion as foreign policy. Sure there's Iraq and Afghanistan – but we've been invaders since we "conquered the wild west" and now we're hooked so bad we don't even know where to invade (bin Laden wasn't hiding in Afghanistan, he was in Pakistan) or what to invade for (Saddam had zero weapons of mass destruction and nothing to do with 9/11). We send our lower classes off to do the killing, and the rest of us who don't have a loved one over there don't spend a single minute of any given day thinking about the carnage. And now we send in remote pilotless planes to kill, planes that are being controlled by faceless men in a lush, air conditioned studio in suburban Las Vegas. It is madness.

2. We are an easily frightened people and it is easy to manipulate us with fear. What are we so afraid of that we need to have 300 million guns in our homes? Who do we think is going to hurt us? Why are most of these guns in white suburban and rural homes? Maybe we should fix our race problem and our poverty problem (again, number one in the industrialized world) and then maybe there would be fewer frustrated, frightened, angry people reaching for the gun in the drawer. Maybe we would take better care of each other (here's a good example of what I mean).

Those are my thoughts about Aurora and the violent country I am a citizen of. Like I said, I spelled it all out here if you'd like to watch it or share it for free with others. All we're lacking here, my friends, is the courage and the resolve. I'm in if you are.

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  • Mark In Irvine 2012/09/25 22:49:20
  • S. Gompers 2012/09/08 11:26:47
    I disagree with Michael Moore!
    S. Gompers
    Although China, Russia, N. Korea and many others would agree with him. Using his logic however we should outlaw cops because of the Empire State building shooting, or outlaw cars because some people drink and drive.
  • Kat 2012/09/04 18:39:27
    I disagree with Michael Moore!
    Kat
    +2
    Freaking liberal idiot.
  • santa6642 2012/09/04 17:30:44
    I disagree with Michael Moore!
    santa6642
    +3
    The man is a nut case, Our founding mean"t for the people to own Firearms not the milita.Ben Franklin wanted our second admendment to be the first , Because with out it you can not protect the first, or any others.That is why the coma was use to show it was the poeople not the milita.end of arugment
  • Dagon 2012/09/04 15:58:06
  • frank 2012/07/26 17:13:40
    I disagree with Michael Moore!
    frank
    +4
    Michael Moore is just a fat idiot.
  • Tom 2012/07/26 15:55:27
    I disagree with Michael Moore!
    Tom
    +5
    Michael Moore is nothing but a self serving egotistical oxygen stealer.
  • Denny 2012/07/26 02:18:26
    I disagree with Michael Moore!
    Denny
    +3
    The only way to arms control is to stop the law abiding persons who usually don't shoot anyone. They also happen to be the ones that are usually not shot at in the first place. As for Michael. Seems to me in recent history in Africa a million or so Tuti's were slaughtered and how about the country of Hungary awhile back. Did they just borrow those guns. Syria seems to come to mind lately. Oh!!! and does it count to use poison gas on our own people as they did in Iraq. Lets spout some numbers that make a little sense.
  • RobHom 2012/07/26 01:36:32
    I disagree with Michael Moore!
    RobHom
    +5
    He tends to write with a bit of "hyperbole"..... 75% of our US States DO NOT have the death penalty.... http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.o... And he does not seem to understand why most Europeans do not have weapons. Up until mid 1955 Germany was a country occupied by the 4 Allies who won WWII. Those allies completely and totally disarmed Germany. I remember when Germany was made sovereign again because I was there, living in Bamberg, Germany. Germany still to this day is somewhat disarmed. Even their military after the release was limited as to weaponry. Plus, Germany's population has historically been rather homogenous, and has very strict laws. German's embrace willingly laws that would make a defense lawyer or ACLU lawyer absolutely insane.

    Germans have crime....but the fact is, their population is different, and they are a somewhat socialized country...they don't have the poverty and other problems we have.
    Under German law...if you are a foreigner and caught with drugs....after your sentence, you are deported and served notice that you can never return. This even applies to US sevicemembers who got busted for drugs... I served as armed escort for more than one bonehead who got caught and deported...handed them over to the MP's at Rhein-Main.

    To really understand t...





























    He tends to write with a bit of "hyperbole"..... 75% of our US States DO NOT have the death penalty.... http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.o... And he does not seem to understand why most Europeans do not have weapons. Up until mid 1955 Germany was a country occupied by the 4 Allies who won WWII. Those allies completely and totally disarmed Germany. I remember when Germany was made sovereign again because I was there, living in Bamberg, Germany. Germany still to this day is somewhat disarmed. Even their military after the release was limited as to weaponry. Plus, Germany's population has historically been rather homogenous, and has very strict laws. German's embrace willingly laws that would make a defense lawyer or ACLU lawyer absolutely insane.

    Germans have crime....but the fact is, their population is different, and they are a somewhat socialized country...they don't have the poverty and other problems we have.
    Under German law...if you are a foreigner and caught with drugs....after your sentence, you are deported and served notice that you can never return. This even applies to US sevicemembers who got busted for drugs... I served as armed escort for more than one bonehead who got caught and deported...handed them over to the MP's at Rhein-Main.

    To really understand the reason why most European countries have lower murder rates, you would have to understand their cultures as well as their ethos....they are significantly different than ours.....

    Frankly...he's bending facts to meet his agenda...and he has completely ignored the more salient facts:

    http://newsbusters.org/blogs/...

    "MSNBC Shocker: Firearms Deaths Fall As Gun Restrictions Ease

    By Noel Sheppard | March 29, 2010 | 11:02
    A A
    Noel Sheppard's picture

    What's the likelihood of an EXTREMELY liberal media outlet publishing an article about firearm related homicides declining while permits to carry concealed weapons increase?

    About as likely as Keith Olbermann saying something nice about Sarah Palin, right?

    Well, on Wednesday, MSNBC.com actually published a piece with the following shocking headline:

    Shhh. Wait. It got better (h/t CNSNews via Weasel Zippers):

    Americans overall are far less likely to be killed with a firearm than they were when it was much more difficult to obtain a concealed-weapons permit, according to statistics collected by the federal Centers for Disease Control. But researchers have not been able to establish a cause-and-effect relationship.

    In the 1980s and ’90s, as the concealed-carry movement gained steam, Americans were killed by others with guns at the rate of about 5.66 per 100,000 population. In this decade, the rate has fallen to just over 4.07 per 100,000, a 28 percent drop. The decline follows a fivefold increase in the number of “shall-issue” and unrestricted concealed-carry states from 1986 to 2006.

    The highest gun homicide rate is in Washington, D.C., which has had the nation’s strictest gun-control laws for years and bans concealed carry: 20.50 deaths per 100,000 population, five times the general rate. The lowest rate, 1.12, is in Utah, which has such a liberal concealed weapons policy that most American adults can get a permit to carry a gun in Utah without even visiting the state.

    The decline in gun homicides also comes as U.S. firearm sales are skyrocketing, according to federal background checks that are required for most gun sales. After holding stable at 8.5 to 9 million checks from 1999 to 2005, the FBI reported a surge to 10 million in 2006, 11 million in 2007, nearly 13 million in 2008 and more than 14 million last year, a 55 percent increase in just four years.

    It must be noted that all of these vital statistics appeared on the third and final page of this article where likely few readers would see them.

    Regardless, the data were supported by charts specifically showing how gun-related deaths have declined as the number of states opting for "shall issue" permits increased:
    (more)
  • kfallslady 2012/07/26 01:16:04
    I disagree with Michael Moore!
    kfallslady
    +4
    What a bunch of Crap... Lock and Load and many of these so called flip out people would be dead and stop wasting the tax payers money.
  • none 2012/07/25 23:08:19
    I disagree with Michael Moore!
    none
    +6
    Moore is a fat liberal fool. It's people that kill, the gun is just a tool. If people in the theatre had their own guns it never would have been as bad as it was. You can't protect yourself from someone like Holmes because they don't care about the law, the only thing you can do is shoot back.
  • kudabux 2012/07/25 22:38:34
    I agree with Michael Moore!
    kudabux
    +2
    There is no reason on earth to own an automatic weapon. Period. End.
  • none kudabux 2012/07/25 23:05:02
    none
    +8
    You can't legally buy an automatic weapon without going through bureaucratic hell and paying a massive tax. What you can get is a semi-automatic weapon, get your facts straight and don't believe the BS the gun control nuts spew out. Holmes did NOT have any automatic weapons.
  • Dandydon kudabux 2012/07/25 23:24:57
    Dandydon
    +8
    The rifle he had was no more automatic then any deer rifle.

    Nutcases get their panties in a bunch because of the appearance of the rifle..

    Plain and simple
  • none Dandydon 2012/07/25 23:45:21
    none
    +5
    The great uninformed spreading misinformation and the ignorant eat it up without even checking to see if it's true.
  • Dandydon none 2012/07/25 23:50:02
    Dandydon
    +3
    Yep...
  • kudabux Dandydon 2012/07/26 00:00:14
    kudabux
    +2
    I am not well versed in weapons nor ammunition, but did not the weapon he used have a 'clip' with a roll of bullets that jammed and he resorted to his hand gun? I distinctly saw a pic of a roll of bullets. Maybe you would care to educate me?
  • Dandydon kudabux 2012/07/26 00:17:20
    Dandydon
    +5
    Automatic weapon = Pull and hold trigger and weapon continues to fire..

    Lots of people by just looking at the rifle he used,assume it's automatic.

    That's a good point you made too.
    His gun jammed and he switched to another weapon.
    Same as if that rifle was banned,he would of just switched to another weapon.

    Monsters don't care about what laws are made for law abiding citizens.

    You can search on youtube,there are plenty of videos where criminals were stopped in their tracks,from committing a crime by legal gun carrying citizens.
    For some reason media doesn't like to tell those stories.
    If there was 2,3,4 legal gun carrying citizens in that theater,it wouldn't of turned out so bad.
    There were heroes in that building,that took bullets their self for someone they loved.
    The only problem was,they were unarmed heroes...
  • kudabux Dandydon 2012/07/26 13:53:23 (edited)
    kudabux
    +2
    O please, I made an error in using 'automatic' it was a mistake. I meant semi automatic. If there were gun toting citizens in that theatre, bullets would have been flying all around the place. What a visual.
    And thanks for your explanation
  • Dandydon kudabux 2012/07/26 21:12:53
    Dandydon
    +3
    Welcome..
  • Dagon kudabux 2012/09/04 16:07:16
  • kudabux Dagon 2012/09/04 17:04:34 (edited)
    kudabux
    +2
    We just had a case in NJ where all the injured were shot by the police.
    So, your example doesn't always hold true.
  • Dagon kudabux 2012/09/04 17:23:40
  • kudabux Dagon 2012/09/04 18:02:50
  • RobHom kudabux 2012/07/26 01:52:58
    RobHom
    +2
    Ok, to put it another way....while he may have been carrying a "semi-automatic" copy of an AR-15, which is a military looking weapon...it would not matter how long the clip was...it can only be fired so fast. It fires one shot per trigger squeeze.

    Had he been carrying an M-16, which is a highly restricted weapon(if you were able to find one for sale, and you could get the license to buy it approved by the BATF after being wrung out in a serious background check) you would end up paying as much as $18,000 for the weapon.

    Now, with an M-16, the cyclic rate, or rate of fire is from 650 to 950 rounds per minute. A magazine with 100 rounds would be fired in less than 10 seconds, and when fired on full auto...very difficult to aim... The M-16 was dubbed a "spray and pray" rifle when they were issued to us in Vietnam. Yes, I have had to carry one of those POS's... A standard magazine of 20 rounds is fired off in a couple of seconds....and frankly I have serious doubts that you could fire a full one hundred round magazine at once. Its more likely that the rifle would jam and stop firing...the barrel was not intended for that kind of use.

    Since his AR-15, aka "Matty Mattel" jammed...you can see what I mean.

    In the US, any weapon even capable of firing a "3 shot burst" with one...

    Ok, to put it another way....while he may have been carrying a "semi-automatic" copy of an AR-15, which is a military looking weapon...it would not matter how long the clip was...it can only be fired so fast. It fires one shot per trigger squeeze.

    Had he been carrying an M-16, which is a highly restricted weapon(if you were able to find one for sale, and you could get the license to buy it approved by the BATF after being wrung out in a serious background check) you would end up paying as much as $18,000 for the weapon.

    Now, with an M-16, the cyclic rate, or rate of fire is from 650 to 950 rounds per minute. A magazine with 100 rounds would be fired in less than 10 seconds, and when fired on full auto...very difficult to aim... The M-16 was dubbed a "spray and pray" rifle when they were issued to us in Vietnam. Yes, I have had to carry one of those POS's... A standard magazine of 20 rounds is fired off in a couple of seconds....and frankly I have serious doubts that you could fire a full one hundred round magazine at once. Its more likely that the rifle would jam and stop firing...the barrel was not intended for that kind of use.

    Since his AR-15, aka "Matty Mattel" jammed...you can see what I mean.

    In the US, any weapon even capable of firing a "3 shot burst" with one pull of the trigger is considered an "automatic" and is not easily obtained, period.

    What I can't help but wonder about....is how and why the Fire Door of the theater was opened, propped open...without an alarm going off!!
    (more)
  • kudabux RobHom 2012/07/26 13:57:02
    kudabux
    +3
    Thanks for the explanation; and the Fire Door alarm, good point.
  • RobHom kudabux 2012/07/26 15:04:26
    RobHom
    +3
    You're welcome. I have a feeling at some point....someone is going to bring that up.... whoops....it already has been brought up, and its going to keep surfacing.....
    http://now.msn.com/here-comes...

    http://thecelebritycafe.com/f...

    "First, Karpel is going after the Century 16 Theater, noting that it was responsible for having an alarm go off when the emergency door is opened. It has been reported that Holmes entered the theater with a ticket to prop the emergency door open and no alarm went off."

    And its probably going to bankrupt the theater chain as a common error. Would I fault the theater chain for not having their fire doors alarmed? Yes, because it is a standard practice in commercial venues.
  • kudabux RobHom 2012/07/26 15:11:04
    kudabux
    +2
    Agreed
  • Andy Fl... RobHom 2012/09/08 13:43:11
    Andy Fletcher
    The part about the alarmed door is troublesome. Both mechanical (pressure) switches and magnetic (proximity) switches are easily subverted. If the sensor is in the actuall door hardware, these too are easily bypassed and disabled. It takes minimal knowledge to do so, and at worst, when caught if they fail to disable them, it would be very easy, and especially so for a psychopath, to fabricate a reasonable explanation that would likely get them banned from the theatre, but not draw any real suspiscion. The suit against the film producers won't likely get very far. It's total BS and anybody with a capacity to think knows this. Most folks my age grew up with "army men" toys and guns. We would stage horrific scenarios of mass destruction including melting the little plastic warriors with gasoline, charcoal starter fluid, white gas (coleman fuel), naptha (lighter fluid), flame throwers made from a match and a can of hairspray or bug spray. The proverbial 99.999% of us turned out just fine.

    The best chance for a successful suit will be against his doctors, but even they are constrained in what they can divulge prior to an incident.
  • RobHom Andy Fl... 2012/09/08 21:33:10
    RobHom
    What you say carries truth....but the reality is this: 12 people will be sitting in judgement....and it is they who will decide. Juries do some really goofy things...and I suspect they will again. Going after the movie producers is a waste....but I was referring to the owners of the theater. That will be a true fracas....

    I'm 62, and I grew up blowing stuff....with real M-80's that could take most of your hand off... In fact as a kid...living in Germany...my backyard was the Army training area for the Infantry and Armor as well as Artillery stationed at Bamberg....and we used to find lots of "simulators"....the ones for hand grenades, artillery rounds...tank rounds.... Yee-HAAA!

    We blew up lots of stuff....in fact we did so much stupid stuff...I'm really surprised we survived it... Digging around in the area we sometimes even found live ammo from WWII....scared the crap out of our parents and they had to call EOD out when we found some mortar rounds....

    We used hairspray and bugspray for flame throwers too!! I'm surprised we didn't incinerate ourselves!!

    Yep...the 99.999% percent of us turned out fine! I even ran with sharp object in my hands....never wore knee pads or rubber helmet when riding a scooter or bike....know really well what "road rash" is....and pain was a real teaching tool!! If it hurts, it is probably smart not to repeat the action or stupid stunt!! :->
  • Andy Fl... RobHom 2012/09/08 22:03:26
    Andy Fletcher
    ROFL~Bike helmet? Pads? WTH are these things you speak of? I found a couple of live 20mm rounds as a kid. I can't even remember where now, just that they were big. It was somewhere in the neighborhood of Ft Lewis though. And yeah, you are right, it's a wonder my brothers and I survived. Mom and Pops didn't even WANT to know. The only requirement was put on clean underwear every day in case we wound up in the hospital mom was in charge of pediatrics in LoL. My older brother and I, we were like 11 and 9, and we found an old shotgun shell in the garage. He got the bright idea for us to stuff it in the handle bars of his bicycle. I held the bars, he used a 12 penny nail as firing pin and a big rock as the hammer. Of course he blew the snot out of his fingers and I got second degree burns on my hands. We would build model cars just to load them up with firecrackers and lighter fluid and send them down the hill. We played tackle football in the paved streets. And we played cowboys and indians, cops and robbers, soldier/army, and any other of a number of "violent" games. We would get the whole block in on it at times. I don't know anyone who grew up to be extraordinarily violent or crazy. The men and women on both sides of the family were hunters and fishermen. We had dodge ball and ...
    ROFL~Bike helmet? Pads? WTH are these things you speak of? I found a couple of live 20mm rounds as a kid. I can't even remember where now, just that they were big. It was somewhere in the neighborhood of Ft Lewis though. And yeah, you are right, it's a wonder my brothers and I survived. Mom and Pops didn't even WANT to know. The only requirement was put on clean underwear every day in case we wound up in the hospital mom was in charge of pediatrics in LoL. My older brother and I, we were like 11 and 9, and we found an old shotgun shell in the garage. He got the bright idea for us to stuff it in the handle bars of his bicycle. I held the bars, he used a 12 penny nail as firing pin and a big rock as the hammer. Of course he blew the snot out of his fingers and I got second degree burns on my hands. We would build model cars just to load them up with firecrackers and lighter fluid and send them down the hill. We played tackle football in the paved streets. And we played cowboys and indians, cops and robbers, soldier/army, and any other of a number of "violent" games. We would get the whole block in on it at times. I don't know anyone who grew up to be extraordinarily violent or crazy. The men and women on both sides of the family were hunters and fishermen. We had dodge ball and teams were picked by the kids for sports. Somebody always had to be last. There was always a winner and a loser. Some kids got left back in school. You teased them (now bullying) too much you might get your ass kicked. I didn't know a single kid that didn't at least occasionally catch a whoopin' from either their mother or father. Funny, I don't personally know a single person that grew up to be a serial killer or mad bomber.
    (more)
  • RobHom Andy Fl... 2012/09/09 15:25:29
    RobHom
    Sounds like your upbringing paralleled mine!! We had fun as kids!! Kids today have no idea how much fine it is to have a really serious rock fight or throw mudballs at cars and then have the drivers stop and chase you... :-> Those were the days when you got in a fight, and it was real...but when it was over...you and the other kid were friends.....

    My dad was an Army Officer....I went to 14 different schools before I graduated High School....and almost always I was the smallest guy in my class...so to keep the majority of kids off my back... I would single out the largest kid in the class and jump on him at recess!! Usually got my butt beat...but it convinced every other kid that i was either nuts or brave enough to stand my ground....

    Dodge ball, sand lot football...tackle that is without helmets or shoulder pads. Baseball...no batting helmets...and most all of the games were played with "combat rules"....just about anything worked!

    Kids nowadays have no idea how much fun they are missing!!
  • Dagon kudabux 2012/09/04 16:04:11
  • kudabux Dagon 2012/09/04 18:08:32
    kudabux
    +1
    Isn't an AK47 an automatic? You might not be a threat, but wat if some nut who steals it from you? Just a hypothetical question
  • Dagon kudabux 2012/09/04 19:38:51
  • Lenny kudabux 2012/09/04 18:06:20
    Lenny
    +3
    I think we have enough gun control, what we need is an idiot control with all of these recent public shootings! I wish I knew the answer.
  • Kat Lenny 2012/09/04 18:42:12
    Kat
    +1
    If they enforced the laws we currently have and punished criminals it wouldn't keep happening.
  • seattleman 2012/07/25 22:28:38
    I agree with Michael Moore!
    seattleman
    +3
    The second amendment does not give us the right to gun ownership. It does not give us the right to bear arms, unconditionally. WELL REGULATED is a key phrase within the 2nd amendment that many seem to forget.

    Nobody - absolutely nobody - is trying to ban all guns Those of us who favor more gun control are advocating for more common sense regulations. It is simply too damn easy for Americans to stockpile a cashe of weaponry (like the Aurora, CO nutball did). I don't want to take guns from those who wish to protect their home, go hunting, or otherwise use their guns responsibly. I don't think anybody does. But I think it's significant that the Aurora, Co murderer amassed his arsenal of guns and ammo legally - and without notice.
  • kudabux seattleman 2012/07/25 22:39:00
    kudabux
    +2
    Well said.
  • RobHom seattleman 2012/07/26 02:11:55
    RobHom
    +2
    Problem is....SCOTUS disagrees with you and in fact has affirmed the right of the individual to possess and bear arms. http://patriotpost.us/perspec... So it appears you are wrong. And it seems that just about every State Constitution in the nation embraces the 2d Amendment by providing the same rights to citizens of the respective states.
    http://www2.law.ucla.edu/volo...

    Actually the Brady group and some others are trying to get bans on all guns.

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