Is it contradictory for an atheist to give to charity?

I meant to answer "no" - not "yes", so please imagine that the little banner above is green, and has a no in it.

Anyway, whether they like it or not, Atheists are creations of God, and made in the image and likeness of God. They possess God's natural state of discernment which is the conscience. The conscience informs all persons of what is right and wrong. Also, Atheists tend to be secular humanists, and believe that all power is invested in man. They simply take care of fellow human beings as humanists rather than Christians or Muslims or Jews, etc. The point is, it's reasonable for Atheists, even within their own deeply flawed theology (or what they'll try to say is a complete lack of theology), to be kind. It's probably not as universal as those who would self identify as acknowledging God, and some may even purposely repress the God instilled tendency towards charity. But I know of many atheists who are open to many charities and causes. And, as a Christian, I will say that I am not open to all charities and causes myself. I always take time to investigate their stewardship, moral or ethical intent, how much money goes to actual provision of service. That sort of thing. This is also discernment. You're more likely to see me give to Catholic Charities, Salvation Army, or Red Cross than to the ACLU, Planned Parenthood, or the DNC for instance. Whereas, an Atheist's charities might be precisely the other way around (though not neccissarily, I want to stress). Never the less, still believing that they are doing good, which is an intangible unless it has a reference against the concept of bad. Then we have to get into the conversation of where do the concepts of good and bad come from? And......well you get the idea ;-) Anyway..............I am open to, and have witnessed good hearts in persons with and without God.

Someone, (I don't think it was you, so sorry), said I must not know much about Atheism. This is untrue, since I once held several of the Atheist tenents of belief. I don't want to be presumptuous, as the gentleman who made this claim about me was, so I want to try to word this carefully. I can tell you're somewhat educated, but would it be fair to say that the focus of your education has not been classical philosophy, or Christian history and theology? It sounds as if you may have a little Nietzche in your backgroud. In actual history, superstitions have developed as offshoots of the religions which were natural to the culture. Superstitions are generally counted heresy against the religion from which they sprung, and differ. And they are simply what they are. Superstitions. Superstition has no legitimate standing in most world religions, and certainly not in the revealed teachings and traditions of Judaism and Christianity. Christians and Jews who have branched out into some kind of superstitious interpretive practice are referred to as heretics.

I'm guessing your book of Goat hearders is the Holy Bible? That's usually the one bandied about in these types of discussions. The Bible has an odd, but quite real patholgy and history.

There are no better historical documents for 1st century Judea then the New Testament of the Holy Bible. Jesus the Christ, (Yeshua bar Josef) certainly existed, and the Gospels and the Acts of the Apostles are the most fleshed out 1st century biographies we have for any figure living at that time. See how much history you can find which was written by eye witnesses, of any other figure at that time in human history. Jesus can not be ignored, or brushed off as superstition. People must make a stand on Jesus. Not whether he existed. He did. But was he who he said he was? The answer to this question in your self, actually defines who you are. If Jesus was just a wandering Jew telling stories, and causing trouble, and was not the incarnation of God entering human history, taking upon himself the sins of the world, dying, and then rising again, then Christianity, and all that led up to it, and all that has happened since is pure folly. You would be correct in your asessment of religion. But if it's true, it is the most significant thing that there is, and it changes a person completely and changes the world. Western civilization was built upon this little itinerant Jewish teacher of 3 years. We have a demarcation of human history itself which is based on the incarnation (B.C./AD). All great writing, theater, music, culture and any other expression of western man referenced the incarnation. The older writings gave prophesy of the incarnation. I can accept, and even have respect for an honestly derived, and profoundly felt Atheism. But what I don't go for, and what even Atheists should fight against, is the offhand dismissal of the greatest minds of the past 5,000 years as some kind of a Joke. To be dismissive of the practice and profession of Christianity or Judasism. To approach them as second class ideologies, and the consideration of Christians as uneducated or in someway lacking. Christianity is a quite valid conclusion to a great deal of evidence. It can be arrived at intellectually, just as Atheism can. We are not delusional, cave dwelling morons. We have many doctors, scientists, philosophers etc., and frankly up until modernism and post modernism, and it's attendant new philosophies of nihilism and moral relativism, it was the philosophy of the intellectual elite, and practice of the faithful. I'm starting to write a book here, and I'm sorry about that. But I just ask that you are respectful of Christian theology. I will at all times try to remain respectful of Atheism. My stint with it was born of a combination of peer group, a lot of Ayn Rand, some Nietzche and my lack of exposure to Aristotle, Aquinas, Augustine, Chesterton, C.S. Lewis, the Church Fathers, The Church Doctors, The saints. etc. In our little karass of intellectual peeps, it's kind of amazing looking back that we claimed such knowledge without ever having studied any of the above together in reading groups. If we did allow for anything religious, it was always "new age" religious. You know, Urantia Book, Ruth Montgomery, Jane Roberts, TM, Edgar Cayce, Carlos Castaneda etc. It's like our whole pursuit was to stay away from the possibility of Jesus Christ.

Anyway, I hope your journey will lead you to other considerations, but if not, I hope you study them all richly, and are always open to truth. Wherever it may lead, and no matter how inconvenient to our nature.

Peace,

Steven

Been in where long? I have been here on Soda over a year. I have been here on Earth for almost 50 years. And I stand by my statement: I have never said any such thing nor has any Christian I know said any such thing. Are there some misguided Christians who have made such a statement? Of course there are. But my statement was I have not nor has any I know.

I listen to everything my Pastor says. One of the most important things he has said about non-believers is this:

"2 Timothy 2:23-26 - "Again I say, don’t get involved in foolish, ignorant arguments that only start fights. 24 A servant of the Lord must not quarrel but must be kind to everyone, be able to teach, and be patient with difficult people. 25 Gently instruct those who oppose the truth. Perhaps God will change those people’s hearts, and they will learn the truth. 26 Then they will come to their senses and escape from the devil’s trap. For they have been held captive by him to do whatever he wants."

As we're reminded from the Scripture above, we "must be kind to everyone, be able to teach, and be patient with difficult people."

If you do this, those who oppose you will be more willing to hear what you have to say and perhaps turn from their error, misunderstanding, confusion, selfishness, etc.

What you must do is reflect a Christlike character at all times and check your motives to be sure they are of God and not of yourself. Remember to love as Christ has loved us."

Granted, it is not easy following this direction, for most non-believers are extremely contentious and quarrelsome. Patience is not one of my virtues, but I strive for it.