Gay, bisexual, or straight?
SinkingSouls
2012/06/05 21:44:01
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And what is your opinion on gays/bisexuals?
I'm bisexual.
I'm bisexual.
Top Opinion
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Straight/doesn't support gays.
I. Every single religion (except for Atheism and Buddhism) acknowledges that homosexual intercourse is immoral, including Christianity, Judaism, Islam, Hinduism, Sikhism, Baha'i Faith, and Zoroastrianism. Why would separate religions (many of which didn't meet until after their moral laws were established) all have the exact same knowledge that homosexual intercourse was wrong?
II. The American Psychological Association found that sexually active homosexuals suffer more frequently from mental illness and depression than homosexuals who remain celibate or have heterosexual relationships.
III. Every country since 3000 BC (excluding Ancient Greece and the Roman Empire) banned homosexual intercourse until 1960 because they knew it was immoral and detrimental to society. Many of these societies developed these laws before they had even met, meaning that there was a natural understanding that homosexuality was immoral.
Ancient Greece and the Roman Empire were the only states to legalize homosexuality in their laws, which they suffered greatly for. In both circumstances, the legalization of homosexuality led their societies to generally abandon all ethical decisions and engage themselves in great crimes like murder, rape, ...
I. Every single religion (except for Atheism and Buddhism) acknowledges that homosexual intercourse is immoral, including Christianity, Judaism, Islam, Hinduism, Sikhism, Baha'i Faith, and Zoroastrianism. Why would separate religions (many of which didn't meet until after their moral laws were established) all have the exact same knowledge that homosexual intercourse was wrong?
II. The American Psychological Association found that sexually active homosexuals suffer more frequently from mental illness and depression than homosexuals who remain celibate or have heterosexual relationships.
III. Every country since 3000 BC (excluding Ancient Greece and the Roman Empire) banned homosexual intercourse until 1960 because they knew it was immoral and detrimental to society. Many of these societies developed these laws before they had even met, meaning that there was a natural understanding that homosexuality was immoral.
Ancient Greece and the Roman Empire were the only states to legalize homosexuality in their laws, which they suffered greatly for. In both circumstances, the legalization of homosexuality led their societies to generally abandon all ethical decisions and engage themselves in great crimes like murder, rape, and theft. Finally, in both cases, the soldiers grew so demoralized and spiteful of their societies that they intentionally allowed foreign invaders to destroy them.
IV. Homosexual intercourse is just as immoral as incest, bestiality, and pedophilia. There is no moral difference between these sexually immoral acts.
And yeah studies show that homosexuals are more likely to suffer from depression and other mental illnesses but again who could blame them with things like bullying and people calling them immoral. I would be depressed too.
You have a right to you're own beliefs when it comes to sex and that's fine but seriously don't put homosexuality on the same level as pedophilia especially when you have no idea what it's like.
-Why not? They are both immoral sexual acts; you can add in bestiality and incest for good measure too. All of these acts are morally the same; you can not try and justify homosexuality without accidently trying to justify incest, bestiality, and pedophilia.
"Pedophilia acts against children are a monstrosity"
-I'm glad we agree on one thing.
"and it stays with you for the rest of your life."
-Yes, just like incest, bestiality, and pedophilia.
"My sister was sexually abused by a pedophile and since then she has become a lesbian."
-While I offer her condolence for her role as a victim to a pedophile, in dominating other women sexually and emotionally, she has become like the pedophile.
"When she came out to me she said that she could never go to bed with a man after what happened. And who could blame her? Who could blame anyone?"
-No one says that she has to sleep with men; merely that she shouldn't engage in homosexual intercourse. Who could blame her if she became a thief or a murderer after such a horrific experience? Still, it doesn't justify theft or murder. While a tragedy, all people (including victims) are responsible for their actions.
"And yeah studies show that homosexuals are more likely to suffer from depression...
-Why not? They are both immoral sexual acts; you can add in bestiality and incest for good measure too. All of these acts are morally the same; you can not try and justify homosexuality without accidently trying to justify incest, bestiality, and pedophilia.
"Pedophilia acts against children are a monstrosity"
-I'm glad we agree on one thing.
"and it stays with you for the rest of your life."
-Yes, just like incest, bestiality, and pedophilia.
"My sister was sexually abused by a pedophile and since then she has become a lesbian."
-While I offer her condolence for her role as a victim to a pedophile, in dominating other women sexually and emotionally, she has become like the pedophile.
"When she came out to me she said that she could never go to bed with a man after what happened. And who could blame her? Who could blame anyone?"
-No one says that she has to sleep with men; merely that she shouldn't engage in homosexual intercourse. Who could blame her if she became a thief or a murderer after such a horrific experience? Still, it doesn't justify theft or murder. While a tragedy, all people (including victims) are responsible for their actions.
"And yeah studies show that homosexuals are more likely to suffer from depression and other mental illnesses but again who could blame them with things like bullying and people calling them immoral."
-I argue that it is more of a result of homosexuals having a guilty conscience for their immoral actions. Much like a serial killer goes through depression for his horrible sins.
"but seriously don't put homosexuality on the same level as pedophilia"
-Considering their nearly identical role, I must use the two to explain why both are wrong. My point isn't to justify pedophilia; my point is to show how two similar forms of sexual immorality are treated arbitrarly different. Even with your personal feelings, the two are not morally any different.
"especially when you have no idea what it's like."
-I wish that I could claim that privilege, but too many of my friends have lost everything and turned to homosexuality. That's how I know how immoral homosexuality is.
As for the Christian religious aspect of all this? Don't take every single word of the Bible that seriously. I mean yeah it's good that you're dedicated to your religion but The bible and other recordings of Jesus could have very easily been mistranslated. The english language wasn't around during the time of Jesus and many other cultures studied the bible before the english language came along so the Bible had to have been translated over and over again from one language to another before it was translated into english. This leaves a lot of room for error. Many words in the english language didn't exist during the time of Jesus.
For example, in Portuguese, 'for' and 'with' are the same word. Many words in the original Bible did not exist in the english language and vice versa so what I'm saying is try to be a good person and follow your own morals but don't take the Bible seriously every word for word.
-I've had the misfortune of meeting, and observing many homosexuals (I attend a public university, where homosexuality is heavily promoted). Most unfortunately, I've had friends who turned homosexual which has shown me the inherent changes of the lifestyle.
"The bible and other recordings of Jesus could have very easily been mistranslated."
-That's why it's best to read the New International Version (the version which was co-translated by Christians, Jews, and Atheists).
"the Bible had to have been translated over and over again from one language to another before it was translated into english."
-For the King James version, yes. For the New International Version, no.
"try to be a good person and follow your own morals but don't take the Bible seriously every word for word."
-Perhaps not every word, but homosexuality being immoral is a reoccurring theme throughout the entirety of the Holy Bible (New and Old Testament).
"Every one that is found shall be thrust through; and every one that is joined unto them shall fall by the sword. Their children also shall be dashed to pieces before their eyes; their houses shall be spoiled, and their wives ravished." (Isaiah 13:15-16)
"If a man is caught in the act of raping a young woman who is not engaged, he must pay fifty pieces of silver to her father. Then he must marry the young woman because he violated her, and he will never be allowed to divorce her." (Deuteronomy 22:28-29 NLT)
What kind of idiot would force a woman to marry her rapist? Answer: Apparently God
"When a man sells his daughter as a slave, she will not be freed at the end of six years as the men are. If she does not please the man who bought her, he may allow her to be bought back again. But he is not allowed to sell her to foreigners, since he is the one who broke the contract with her. And if the slave girl's owner arranges for her to marry his son, he may no longer treat her as ...
"Every one that is found shall be thrust through; and every one that is joined unto them shall fall by the sword. Their children also shall be dashed to pieces before their eyes; their houses shall be spoiled, and their wives ravished." (Isaiah 13:15-16)
"If a man is caught in the act of raping a young woman who is not engaged, he must pay fifty pieces of silver to her father. Then he must marry the young woman because he violated her, and he will never be allowed to divorce her." (Deuteronomy 22:28-29 NLT)
What kind of idiot would force a woman to marry her rapist? Answer: Apparently God
"When a man sells his daughter as a slave, she will not be freed at the end of six years as the men are. If she does not please the man who bought her, he may allow her to be bought back again. But he is not allowed to sell her to foreigners, since he is the one who broke the contract with her. And if the slave girl's owner arranges for her to marry his son, he may no longer treat her as a slave girl, but he must treat her as his daughter. If he himself marries her and then takes another wife, he may not reduce her food or clothing or fail to sleep with her as his wife. If he fails in any of these three ways, she may leave as a free woman without making any payment." (Exodus 21:7-11 NLT)
"From there Abraham journeyed toward the territory of the Negeb and lived between Kadesh and Shur; and he sojourned in Gerar. And Abraham said of Sarah his wife, “She is my sister.” And Abimelech king of Gerar sent and took Sarah. But God came to Abimelech in a dream by night and said to him, “Behold, you are a dead man because of the woman whom you have taken, for she is a man's wife.” Now Abimelech had not approached her. So he said, “Lord, will you kill an innocent people? Did he not himself say to me, ‘She is my sister’? And she herself said, ‘He is my brother.’ In the integrity of my heart and the innocence of my hands I have done this.” ..."
Genesis 20:1-18 ESV
There's plenty of rape and incest in the Bible. Apparently it's ok to rape a woman and marry you're sister but it's not ok to have a same-sex relationship. Yeah, ok...either the Bible was written by a bunch of sexist, rapist, psychos, or the big man upstairs was half asleep when he instructed the people who wrote the Bible.
-A valid point and a major reason that I'm not Catholic. Fortunately, most other denominations are more faithful to God's Laws.
"It's funny because there are many passages in the Bible that glorify rape and incest."
-Nope, you may not understand these passages, but that doesn't change the Holy Bible any. I am willing to answer any questions about the Holy Bible you have.
"Apparently it's ok to rape a woman and marry you're sister but it's not ok to have a same-sex relationship."
-Nope, both are wrong (along with Bestiality). Conveniently, it's all explained in the same region of the Holy Bible. Read Leviticus 18:6-23.
"Genesis 20:1-18 ESV"
-This passage actually helps me because God is punishing him for having sexual relations with his sister in this text. This only signifies that incest is wrong.
"Isaiah 13:15-16"
-A unique context that occurred before God made laws prohibiting rape.
"Deuteronomy 22:28-29 NLT & Exodus 21:7-11 NLT)"
-Two laws that God later revoked fortunately.
-All non-marital sex is immoral. Sex is described in the Bible as a method for a husband and wife to become one in spirit. Non-marital sex is a violation of this combination between a husband and wife.
"And in the passage about Abraham and Sarah if you read the passage it's saying how God is punishing Abilemech for taking a woman who was another man's wife as Sarah was married to Abraham."
-They are all being punished for their immorality. That doesn't justify incest at all. Again refer to Leviticus 18:6-23.
Just to clarify reality, no matter what the Bible says (And I'm speaking from experience, just some helpful advice) Waiting for marriage before sex makes for an awful honeymoon. I don't know how it is for men but for women, the first few times a woman has intercourse it is VERY painful and more than likely the woman will start bleeding. And this is a legitimate question I have, why does the Bible glorify virgins? There's nothing great about being a virgin (with the exception of no STDs) Many people argue that this id god's way of punishing women for the actions of Eve. (If god is really punishing all women because of what one woman did then he doesn't sound like such a great guy.
"That doesn't justify incest at all."
When Adam and Eve were created and had only boys where did the grandchildren come from? Yup, that's right oedipus complex at it's best.
Seriously there are many passages in the Bible that seem to teach the complete opposite of morality.
"I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man; she must be silent." (1 Timothy 2:12)
1 Corinthians 14:34-35
"As in all the congregations of the saints, women should remain silent in the churches. They are not allowed to speak, but must be in submission, as the Law says."
The Bible cap...
Just to clarify reality, no matter what the Bible says (And I'm speaking from experience, just some helpful advice) Waiting for marriage before sex makes for an awful honeymoon. I don't know how it is for men but for women, the first few times a woman has intercourse it is VERY painful and more than likely the woman will start bleeding. And this is a legitimate question I have, why does the Bible glorify virgins? There's nothing great about being a virgin (with the exception of no STDs) Many people argue that this id god's way of punishing women for the actions of Eve. (If god is really punishing all women because of what one woman did then he doesn't sound like such a great guy.
"That doesn't justify incest at all."
When Adam and Eve were created and had only boys where did the grandchildren come from? Yup, that's right oedipus complex at it's best.
Seriously there are many passages in the Bible that seem to teach the complete opposite of morality.
"I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man; she must be silent." (1 Timothy 2:12)
1 Corinthians 14:34-35
"As in all the congregations of the saints, women should remain silent in the churches. They are not allowed to speak, but must be in submission, as the Law says."
The Bible captures the ideals of the time that it was written, not the ideals of god. If god really thinks that women must be submissive then I'll take my chances with Atheism
-No, keeping a marriage pure and meaningful is not "awful."
"why does the Bible glorify virgins?"
-Sex is a holy act through which two people's souls unite. If you have casual sex all the time, you've corrupted your soul.
"When Adam and Eve were created and had only boys where did the grandchildren come from? Yup, that's right oedipus complex at it's best."
-Adam and Eve died, Abel was murdered by Cain, and then Cain was exiled. God created more people because their bloodline was over. Or are you arguing that one man asexually reproduced? If so how is that incest?
For 1 Timothy 2:12 and 1 Corinthians 14:34-35
-These may not be socially acceptable in the United States, but consider how few people divorce in Muslim countries where the man has authority over his wife. It is a method of preventing affairs and divorce (Jesus forbade divorce). I think the legitimacy of this may have changed with time, but it is only statistical fact that male dominated societies prevent affairs and divorce.
"I'll take my chances with Atheism"
-Ah, the religion of Murder. Take a look at the statistics
Atheism: 111,367,344 murders (at absolute minimum; there are smaller incidences that I haven't included).
Shamanism: 60,000,000 murders
Shintoism...
-No, keeping a marriage pure and meaningful is not "awful."
"why does the Bible glorify virgins?"
-Sex is a holy act through which two people's souls unite. If you have casual sex all the time, you've corrupted your soul.
"When Adam and Eve were created and had only boys where did the grandchildren come from? Yup, that's right oedipus complex at it's best."
-Adam and Eve died, Abel was murdered by Cain, and then Cain was exiled. God created more people because their bloodline was over. Or are you arguing that one man asexually reproduced? If so how is that incest?
For 1 Timothy 2:12 and 1 Corinthians 14:34-35
-These may not be socially acceptable in the United States, but consider how few people divorce in Muslim countries where the man has authority over his wife. It is a method of preventing affairs and divorce (Jesus forbade divorce). I think the legitimacy of this may have changed with time, but it is only statistical fact that male dominated societies prevent affairs and divorce.
"I'll take my chances with Atheism"
-Ah, the religion of Murder. Take a look at the statistics
Atheism: 111,367,344 murders (at absolute minimum; there are smaller incidences that I haven't included).
Shamanism: 60,000,000 murders
Shintoism: 24,000,000 murders
Christians 13,800,000 murders
Muslims: 1,000,000 murders
Atheism:
Reign of Terror (50,000 deaths)
Red Terror (72,344 deaths)
The Great Purge (20,000,000 deaths)
Chinese Government Murders (90,000,000 deaths)
Cambodian Genocide (745,000 deaths)
Burmese Genocide (500,000 deaths)
I didn't say marriage wasn't meaningful. I'm saying that if you wait until you're honeymoon after the wedding to perform sexual intercourse it's going to be very painful and not very pleasurable. At least for the woman. The first time for the woman is always painful I don't know if it's like that for men.
The numbers are way higher for Christian murders. How many people did the church execute from the beginning of Christianity?
Christianity: 182,695,000 (minimum)
Witch Trials - at least 5,000,000 (Europe not Salem)
Holocaust: 6,000,000
Spanish Inquisition: about 1,000,000
Crusades: Estimated to be over 20,000,000
Trail of Tears: 4,000
Peasants of Steding: between 5,000 and 11,000
Battle of Jerusalem: over 60,000
Battle of Askalon: 200,000
Archbishop of Tyre: 10,000
Pope Innocent III: 70,000
Pope Pius V: 20,000
Mandenburg: 30,000
Bohemian: 10,000
Basel and Strasbourg: 2,000
Seville: 4,000 slain, 25,000 enslaved
Chmielnitzki massacres: 200,000
Manifest Destiny: 150,000,000
Vietnam Rebellion: 80,000
The Great Purge had nothing to do with atheism. Stalin forced people to worship him and killed off anyone who he didn't like or didn't worship him. That's not atheism.
Burmese genocide again has nothing to do with Atheism, it's ethnic groups killi...
I didn't say marriage wasn't meaningful. I'm saying that if you wait until you're honeymoon after the wedding to perform sexual intercourse it's going to be very painful and not very pleasurable. At least for the woman. The first time for the woman is always painful I don't know if it's like that for men.
The numbers are way higher for Christian murders. How many people did the church execute from the beginning of Christianity?
Christianity: 182,695,000 (minimum)
Witch Trials - at least 5,000,000 (Europe not Salem)
Holocaust: 6,000,000
Spanish Inquisition: about 1,000,000
Crusades: Estimated to be over 20,000,000
Trail of Tears: 4,000
Peasants of Steding: between 5,000 and 11,000
Battle of Jerusalem: over 60,000
Battle of Askalon: 200,000
Archbishop of Tyre: 10,000
Pope Innocent III: 70,000
Pope Pius V: 20,000
Mandenburg: 30,000
Bohemian: 10,000
Basel and Strasbourg: 2,000
Seville: 4,000 slain, 25,000 enslaved
Chmielnitzki massacres: 200,000
Manifest Destiny: 150,000,000
Vietnam Rebellion: 80,000
The Great Purge had nothing to do with atheism. Stalin forced people to worship him and killed off anyone who he didn't like or didn't worship him. That's not atheism.
Burmese genocide again has nothing to do with Atheism, it's ethnic groups killing each other for control.
The Red Terror had nothing to do with religion, it was rebels killing people who were against the revolution.
I don't know too much about the killings of the Chinese government but I do know that most Chinese people are not atheist.
Cambodian Genocide again had nothing to do with religion it was just some psycho's idea of create an agrarian society.
-For yourself possibly. Not every woman has the same first experience.
"I don't know if it's like that for men."
-It's not and it's not always for women.
"How many people did the church execute from the beginning of Christianity?"
-Few.
You're numbers are vastly off. Your numbers are entirely fiction based on what you'll find as normal averages. Also note that many of these such as the Trail of Tears, Peasants of Steding, and Manifest Destiny did not target people because of their religious belief. For example, many Cherokee were Christians but were killed in the Trail of Tears and Manifest Destiny. Even so, I'll count them to be generous.
Witch Trials (Europe)- 40,000 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
Spanish Inquisition- 2,250 http://askville.amazon.com/pe...
Trail of Tears: 4,000 (You were actually correct on this one.)
Peasants of Steding: 5,000 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
Manifest Destiny: Unknown http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
I was only counting the murder of citizens or helpless groups. If I were to include wars, I'd have to add all of China, Vietnam, Cambodia and the Soviet Union's wars as well. There is a big di...
-For yourself possibly. Not every woman has the same first experience.
"I don't know if it's like that for men."
-It's not and it's not always for women.
"How many people did the church execute from the beginning of Christianity?"
-Few.
You're numbers are vastly off. Your numbers are entirely fiction based on what you'll find as normal averages. Also note that many of these such as the Trail of Tears, Peasants of Steding, and Manifest Destiny did not target people because of their religious belief. For example, many Cherokee were Christians but were killed in the Trail of Tears and Manifest Destiny. Even so, I'll count them to be generous.
Witch Trials (Europe)- 40,000 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
Spanish Inquisition- 2,250 http://askville.amazon.com/pe...
Trail of Tears: 4,000 (You were actually correct on this one.)
Peasants of Steding: 5,000 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
Manifest Destiny: Unknown http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
I was only counting the murder of citizens or helpless groups. If I were to include wars, I'd have to add all of China, Vietnam, Cambodia and the Soviet Union's wars as well. There is a big difference between killing a soldier and a 3 year old girl. Is defending against a Muslim attack really considered murders too (as in the cases of Tyre, Innocent III, and Pius V)? Just for the record, you're numbers will still off though.
Crusades: 15,000 Muslim killed http://answers.yahoo.com/ques...
Battle of Jerusalem: 25,000 Ottomans killed http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
Battle of Askalon: Unrecorded without estimate http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
Archbishop of Tyre's defense against Muslim invaders: Unrecorded and Unknown http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
Pope Innocent III- You already counted the Crusades.
Pope Pius V: 20,000 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
30 Years War (Mandenburg): 30,000 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
Khmelnytsky Uprising (Chmielnitzki massacres): Unknown http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
Vietnam Rebellion: 641,000 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
I'm not sure what you mean by: Bohemian, Basel and Strasbourg, Seville (If it's the Spanish reclaiming Spain from the Muslims it falls under category 2.).
"Holocaust: 6,000,000: 200,000"
-Hitler was personally very anti-Christian and had his own pagan beliefs in secret. I will post a response to this one showing you the evidence. You can start a pagan murders list if you'd like.
"Christianity: 182,695,000 (minimum)"
-Being generous and counting the Trail of Tears, Peasants of Steding, and Manifest Destiny which had no religious inclination except that Christians were involved in the killings, you only get: 40,000+2,250+4,000+5,000=11,0... (even though you neglected 2 million legitimate deaths of civilians; it is more like 13,000,000) That is 169 million over the real number. You're mathematics and facts need some work.
"The Great Purge had nothing to do with atheism."
-Really so that's why Joseph Stalin who was a self professed Atheist specifically targeted Christians in the Soviet Union to be executed (even the ones who supported him)? I call that an Atheist murder of Christians.
"Burmese genocide again has nothing to do with Atheism, it's ethnic groups killing each other for control."
-That's why the government is self defined as Atheist and all of the rebels and victims identify as Christians? The Burmese government has openly admitted that it is a religious cleansing.
"The Red Terror had nothing to do with religion"
-Again, Lenin another self professed Atheist specifically killed Christians (even the ones who supported him)?
"I don't know too much about the killings of the Chinese government but I do know that most Chinese people are not atheist."
-Most Chinese are atheist according to religious demographics and they also specifically targeted Christians for genocide.
"Cambodian Genocide again had nothing to do with religion it was just some psycho's idea of create an agrarian society."
-I will give you this one; there wasn't a religious focus on these genocides. Although this would be just as legitimate as the Trail of Tears, Peasants of Steding, and Manifest Destiny as you included.
But in terms of our debate I would have to accept defeat. It has become quite obvious that you are the better litigator and I have accepted that. Does that change my view of religion, no, but I have to say my respect for you has grown, a little.
I have to apologize for some of my earlier posts especially for the one about pedophilia. I let my emotions get the best of me. Sorry it's just that was a soft spot.
-By admiting that, you have gained some of my respect. It takes a lot of courage to admit that.
While I can understand that you want to keep your religious beliefs, there are just some historical truths you have to accept like:
I. Hitler was very much Anti-Christian.
II. Atheism has killed more civilians and helpless groups than any other religion, and yes they were specifically targeted to genocide religious groups, mainly Christians.
III. Most people in the world currently believe homosexuality is immoral (60%).
To do otherwise, you have to lie to yourself and reject reality. If that's your case, do you think that your view is really the correct one?
There was a time in my life a long time ago where I was a devout Catholic. But after a while I started to move away from those beliefs. My mom pulled me out of CCD when I was little because I kept having nightmares about going to hell. Some of the things that they preached just didn't make sense to me. And then the incident with my sister happened and that was the end of it.
Don't get me wrong I know there's something else out there. I do believe in guardian angels and I have a million stories about that but I don't wanna bore you anymore with my life stories.
So yeah, it's not really that I'm a practicing Atheist, (if that makes any sense) it's just I'm not a practicing anything
-Like what?
"Don't get me wrong I know there's something else out there. I do believe in guardian angels"
-Fair enough, it sounds like you are more of an Agnostic or Theist, not Atheist.
"just I'm not a practicing anything"
-Like I said, it sounds like you are more of an Agnostic or Theist, not Atheist. Which in that case, I submit to you this logic. Since every religion (except for Buddhism and Atheism) says homosexuality is immoral, isn't it logical that God gave His followers common laws? Considering they developed these similar religious laws while they never met each other, it would otherwise be a great "coincidence."
Just for common framework:
a•the•ism- the doctrine or belief that there is no God
ag•nos•ticism- The belief that nothing is known or can be known of the existence or nature of God or of anything beyond material phenomena; a group who claims neither faith nor disbelief in God
the•ism- Belief in the existence of a god or gods, esp. belief in one god as creator of the universe, intervening in it and sustaining a personal relation to his creatures
As for the second part about similar laws, I can't really answer that. There are similarities that seem to be repetant in every culture. One example is the legends of dragons, which exists in folklore across the world. Does that mean dragons exist or existed? Who knows? There are plenty of mysteries that no one can explain.
-That's a very interesting topic. I think some of the Biblical stories have been exaggerated to make their moral lessons more clear. Interestingly, geologists have found evidence that a giant flood did take place in the region (the fertile crescent), although not the entire world using dating methods on the water marks found on high altitudes that shouldn't be there otherwise. Additionally Samaria (one of the Hebrew's enemies) also has a detailed record of a giant flood called the Epic of Gilgamesh. Because the two states were enemies and couldn't understand the other's language (spoken or written), historians suspect there really was a great flood in the region with "the ark," although not a global flood at all. Additionally, it is farfetched to think that there was "two of every animal." Historians suspect that there was a man (of unknown identity) who used a large ark to survive the flood, where he probably cared his livestock for food. Exaggerated yes, but historians suspect the flood, the ark, and some animals aboard the ark really did occur.
"Once I asked my tea...
-That's a very interesting topic. I think some of the Biblical stories have been exaggerated to make their moral lessons more clear. Interestingly, geologists have found evidence that a giant flood did take place in the region (the fertile crescent), although not the entire world using dating methods on the water marks found on high altitudes that shouldn't be there otherwise. Additionally Samaria (one of the Hebrew's enemies) also has a detailed record of a giant flood called the Epic of Gilgamesh. Because the two states were enemies and couldn't understand the other's language (spoken or written), historians suspect there really was a great flood in the region with "the ark," although not a global flood at all. Additionally, it is farfetched to think that there was "two of every animal." Historians suspect that there was a man (of unknown identity) who used a large ark to survive the flood, where he probably cared his livestock for food. Exaggerated yes, but historians suspect the flood, the ark, and some animals aboard the ark really did occur.
"Once I asked my teacher in church, "When god sent the flood, did he kill the babies too?" The teacher just looked at me and replied that it was the "Will of God."
-Biblically God is a "jealous and wrathful God." God has little mercy for the immoral; non-Biblical history seems to show the same thing.
"As for the second part about similar laws, I can't really answer that."
-Neither can anyone who doesn't believe in the Divine.
"There are similarities that seem to be repetant in every culture. One example is the legends of dragons, which exists in folklore across the world."
-Not really. The myth of the dragon began in China and was spread by J.R.R. Token's The Hobbit. Before the Hobbit, the rest of the world had no dragon myth (excluding Korea which got it from China).
"There are plenty of mysteries that no one can explain."
-Usually there is a common sense answer if you're willing to spend the time researching it.
As for the mysteries part, there is no one on this planet who will ever know everything. I will never know everything and there will be questions that I will never find the answer to. And that's perfectly fine with me. What's life without mysteries? Life would be very boring.
"Biblically God is a "jealous and wrathful God." God has little mercy for the immoral; non-Biblical history seems to show the same thing."
How is an infant immoral or what makes an infant immoral? If the flood did happen and wiped out everything in it's path then innocent children must've died. Not to mention kittens and puppies *sniff* *sniff* But I agree with you on the point that that story was probably exagerated. But would god really sacrifice the innocent just to make a point?
-You're correct. According to Wikipedia, the Knights from the Crusades brought back popular culture from the East; the Muslims did trade with the Chinese and that's how it spread. Thank you for teaching me something new. : )
"What's life without mysteries?"
-Order, stability, and prosperity.
"How is an infant immoral or what makes an infant immoral?"
-I'd predict that God rewarded them in the Afterlife for dying so early on Earth.
"Not to mention kittens and puppies"
-Considering animals have no souls, they are as important as plants in a religious sense.
"But would god really sacrifice the innocent just to make a point?"
-Based on Biblical Passages and history, the innocent are often included when the guilty are punished by God. I suspect that God takes that in consideration for the Afterlife.
I've always wondered what life in the afterlife would be like. Would it be a world that's just absent of evil? Would it be like a world where everything's perfect? I don't know.
As for the mysteries thing. Well, why do people like to read crime novels? It's the same idea. Wonder is one of the things that makes life interesting.
-At least according to Christianity, Judaism, Islam, and Sikhism, (Although Islam does consider animals to be a divine creation of God, to which you can't even paint an animal because it's an insult to God.) yes. Religions like Buddhism and Hinduism believe that animals are former and future people so they should be treated as such (although some Hindus still eat beef so I don't get it).
"A mother cat shows her kittens love just like a human mother does."
-You've apparently never had a pet cat that had kittens then. Our cat neglected the kittens usually and wouldn't care if someone took a kitten away. Animals lack compassion and meaningful emotion; they are just beasts of instinct.
"A dog show's loyalty and love to his owner."
-Yes, God made them loyal, but they still have no soul or meaningful emotion. A dog is just an animal.
"As for plants, I have no idea on that one since they don't really do much."
-Logically, they are the same as animals. The difference is that people have emotional connections to animals but not plants (unless you find a hippie), but emotional connections don't change realities. Just because a hippie high on LSD loves a tree, doesn't mean the tree has a soul.
"I've always wondered what life in the afterlife would be like."
-Only G...
-At least according to Christianity, Judaism, Islam, and Sikhism, (Although Islam does consider animals to be a divine creation of God, to which you can't even paint an animal because it's an insult to God.) yes. Religions like Buddhism and Hinduism believe that animals are former and future people so they should be treated as such (although some Hindus still eat beef so I don't get it).
"A mother cat shows her kittens love just like a human mother does."
-You've apparently never had a pet cat that had kittens then. Our cat neglected the kittens usually and wouldn't care if someone took a kitten away. Animals lack compassion and meaningful emotion; they are just beasts of instinct.
"A dog show's loyalty and love to his owner."
-Yes, God made them loyal, but they still have no soul or meaningful emotion. A dog is just an animal.
"As for plants, I have no idea on that one since they don't really do much."
-Logically, they are the same as animals. The difference is that people have emotional connections to animals but not plants (unless you find a hippie), but emotional connections don't change realities. Just because a hippie high on LSD loves a tree, doesn't mean the tree has a soul.
"I've always wondered what life in the afterlife would be like."
-Only God knows. Not even the Holy Bible describes it.
"Well, why do people like to read crime novels? It's the same idea."
-I'm sure different people have many different reasons for their interest. I used to watch CSI Miami just to laugh and make fun of how ridiculous it was; I couldn't have cared less about their plots.
"Wonder is one of the things that makes life interesting."
-Not for me anyway. Knowledge makes life interesting for me.
"Just because a hippie high on LSD loves a tree, doesn't mean the tree has a soul."
lol no but's rather amusing to watch. hahaha
My point with the hippie was that he might love trees and say trees have souls, but they don't. You might love cats and say that cats have souls, but they just don't have them any more than the tree does.
And just so you know if you ever get sick of talking to me just say so I don't wanna bore you to death.
I'm happy to talk to you since you are actually polite and listen to what I have to say. Regardless of views, I think insults are inappropriate in a conversation or debate.
I wonder if other creatures have thoughts. And if animals have no soul then why did god create them in the first place? I mean, I understand creating livestock animals like chickens and cows but why other creatures if they have no soul and no divine purpose?
I'm sure that each creature has it's own purpose for God creating it, but I think we'll never know some of them.
It's not for you to judge if a gay person has sex with his partner whether he be married to the person or not.It's none of your business. Many heterosexual do alot of different kinds of sexual acts married or not with their mates.For example:Their are heterosexual women who enjoy who recieve anal and also pleasure their man with vibrators anally.There are men that enjoy it.That is also something that is none of anybodys' business.
-Why not? They are both immoral sexual acts; you can add in bestiality and incest for good measure too. All of these acts are morally the same; you can not try and justify homosexuality without accidently trying to justify incest, bestiality, and pedophilia.
"Pedophiles can be men or women who are straight that molest children.The person can be a heterosexual who is married who craves little girls or vice versa.It could be a heterosexual woman who craves little boys or teen boys under 18.Then there's creeping Jerry Sandusky who is married to a woman for a zillion yrs and has his own adult children who raped young boys and teens."
-True. My point is that pedophilia is immoral (which you hopefully agree with) and homosexuality is immoral. The two are not any morally different from one another.
"It's not for you to judge if a gay person has sex with his partner whether he be married to the person or not."
-Who says that I'm judging anything? However, I would be a horrible Christian to abandon Jesus's commandment to "spread the Word of God to all creation." Homosexuality is immoral and I'm tired of it destroying people's lives, damaging society, and creating unhappiness.
Perhaps you've heard this quote from Edmund Burke, "All that...
-Why not? They are both immoral sexual acts; you can add in bestiality and incest for good measure too. All of these acts are morally the same; you can not try and justify homosexuality without accidently trying to justify incest, bestiality, and pedophilia.
"Pedophiles can be men or women who are straight that molest children.The person can be a heterosexual who is married who craves little girls or vice versa.It could be a heterosexual woman who craves little boys or teen boys under 18.Then there's creeping Jerry Sandusky who is married to a woman for a zillion yrs and has his own adult children who raped young boys and teens."
-True. My point is that pedophilia is immoral (which you hopefully agree with) and homosexuality is immoral. The two are not any morally different from one another.
"It's not for you to judge if a gay person has sex with his partner whether he be married to the person or not."
-Who says that I'm judging anything? However, I would be a horrible Christian to abandon Jesus's commandment to "spread the Word of God to all creation." Homosexuality is immoral and I'm tired of it destroying people's lives, damaging society, and creating unhappiness.
Perhaps you've heard this quote from Edmund Burke, "All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."
"It's none of your business."
-When the American media is seeking to make Christian children into homosexual Atheists, it becomes my business.
"Many heterosexual do alot of different kinds of sexual acts married or not with their mates."
-If it cheers you up, I oppose non-marital intercourse too.
"Their are heterosexual women who enjoy who recieve anal and also pleasure their man with vibrators anally."
-These are certainly gray areas. The Holy Bible has nothing to say about anal sex, only that intercourse between two people of the same gender is wrong. In my personal opinion, the first probably isn't too bad if the woman consents, but the second one only leads men to homosexuality. However, I have no absolute stance since no religion covers this.
"That is also something that is none of anybodys' business."
-Since there is no religion that officially opposes either of these; I'll agree that this part should be between couples.
The media doesn't make children athiests.Their parents can be influencial if they are agnostic or athiest.Usually by the time a child or teen is an adult they make their own determination.I have a friend that grew up a christian and as an adult he is now agnostic.I believe gay people born that way.I have had many gay friends who are great people.The accountant to the N.Y. Yankees is gay.I know him personally.I have a gay friend that's a lawyer, A host for HSN,Dentist etc.great guys.If they want to have anal that's their business.I could careless what they do in their bedroom.Just like I could careless if a married couple is into whips,handcuffs etc.There are many religious figures who are gay.I knew a gay pastor.Great guy.Many athiests and agnostics are straight.Nice people too.I cannot stand hypocrites though.People that go to church then come home and abuse their spouse and children or who cheat on their spouses.
-As much as I would like to give a woman Cunnilingus, I must admit that I know of a lesbian who said, "I enjoyed oral so much that I became a Lesbian so that I'd get more of it." Another gray area.
"The media doesn't make children athiests."
-I personally know many people who became Atheists as a result of such means.
"Their parents can be influencial if they are agnostic or athiest.Usually by the time a child or teen is an adult they make their own determination."
-While these also occur, the media has been the main influence in modern culture.
"I believe gay people born that way.I have had many gay friends who are great people."
-While the attraction is debatably uncontrollable (still unproven), the religious and the traditional meaning of homosexuality was simply, "one who has intercourse with their own gender." All homosexual intercourse is completely controllable. People control who they have sex with and if they have sex. In the religious and traditional definition, homosexuality is completely a choice.
"If they want to have anal that's their business."
-It depends on who they have anal with (as you point out). It is immoral to arguably a gray area.
"Just like I could careless if a married couple is ...
-As much as I would like to give a woman Cunnilingus, I must admit that I know of a lesbian who said, "I enjoyed oral so much that I became a Lesbian so that I'd get more of it." Another gray area.
"The media doesn't make children athiests."
-I personally know many people who became Atheists as a result of such means.
"Their parents can be influencial if they are agnostic or athiest.Usually by the time a child or teen is an adult they make their own determination."
-While these also occur, the media has been the main influence in modern culture.
"I believe gay people born that way.I have had many gay friends who are great people."
-While the attraction is debatably uncontrollable (still unproven), the religious and the traditional meaning of homosexuality was simply, "one who has intercourse with their own gender." All homosexual intercourse is completely controllable. People control who they have sex with and if they have sex. In the religious and traditional definition, homosexuality is completely a choice.
"If they want to have anal that's their business."
-It depends on who they have anal with (as you point out). It is immoral to arguably a gray area.
"Just like I could careless if a married couple is into whips,handcuffs etc."
-Another gray area that religion says nothing about. I am of the general view that, "if the Bible doesn't say it's wrong, who am I to say it's wrong?"
"There are many religious figures who are gay.I knew a gay pastor.Great guy."
-Certainly a poor "pastor" then. How can you claim to represent something that you directly oppose? That's like having a "vegetarian" who eats meat. Romans 1:18-32 says that no homosexual (in the context of if they have homosexual intercourse) can be a Christian.
"Many athiests and agnostics are straight."
-Not according to demographics. Most Atheists are homosexuals (or an offshoot like "bisexual," "transgender," and all the other fictional sexes).
"I cannot stand hypocrites though."
-You just said that you liked a "gay pastor." How do you get more hypocritical than that?
"People that go to church then come home and abuse their spuse and children or who cheat on their spouses."
-I oppose that and all forms of immorality.
Psychopathy is a personality disorder that has been variously described as characterized by shallow emotions (in particular reduced fear), stress tolerance, lacking empathy, coldheartedness, lacking guilt, egocentricity, superficial charm, manipulativeness, irresponsibility, impulsivity and antisocial behaviors such as parasitic lifestyle and criminality.