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Does California have the right to ban “gay conversion” therapy sessions?

L.A. Times 2012/12/04 17:11:47
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A federal judge on Monday blocked California from enforcing its new gay-conversion ban on therapy that seeks to change the sexual orientation of minors from gay to straight.

The Los Angeles Times' Sacramento Bureau Chief Evan Halper reported that U.S. District Judge William Shubb ruled that the new law, SB 1172, signed by Gov. Jerry Brown earlier this year, may inhibit the 1st Amendment rights of therapists who oppose homosexuality. The judge signed a temporary injunction that prohibits the state from enforcing the ban, the first of its kind in the nation, against the three plaintiffs in the suit pending trial.

jerry brown

Read More: http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/lanow/2012/12/la-n...

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  • ProudProgressive 2012/12/04 17:47:05
    Yes
    ProudProgressive
    +61
    "Gay conversion" is not scientifically valid and is in fact nothing more than an attempt to brainwash individuals by religious extremists. It does not benefit anyone (except those who make money by selling this nonsense) and poses a danger to any individual unfortunate enough to fall into their clutches.

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  • Martyr4Christ 2013/04/18 14:35:42
    No
    Martyr4Christ
    +1
    There is WAY more to this than meets the eye, and affects the rights of parents across the board!

    PLEASE read the official bill here: http://leginfo.legislature.ca... ,
    AND what NARTH – (National Association for Research and Therapy of Homosexuality) thinks about it here: http://narth.com/2012/05/cali...

    BEFORE answering.

    This ban could potentially INCREASE sexual abuse of minors and PROTECT abusers by limiting the scope of practice of professionals like psychiatrists, SCHOOL psychologists, therapists, nurses etc, from providing "reparative" therapy to minors and punishing them through discipline administered via their license holding agency,from providing "reparative" therapy to minors.

    This may cause those who suffer from UNWANTED same-sex attractions to be brainwashed to accept homosexual behavior, thus helping to mold, accept and ENCOURAGE homosexuality behavior into a child's life AGAINST THEIR WILL.
  • Mdougla... Martyr4... 2013/08/02 22:31:15 (edited)
    Mdouglas231
    Your post is so replete with falsities it's not even funny. "This ban could potentially INCREASE sexual abuse of minors and PROTECT abusers"??? What convoluted thinking led you to THAT premise? This bill would simply ban the so-called use of "conversion therapy" which has nothing to do with the sexual abuse of minors. It has EVERYTHING to do with preventing the psychological abuse of minors by the quack pseudo-therapists hired by churches and religious groups to brainwash young people into thinking their natural, God-given homosexual orientation is somehow "wrong" or "evil". THAT is the brainwashing involved, and THAT is why this bill even came up for a vote! You push this term "reparative therapy" -- but it's a truly "loaded term" in and of itself -- it presupposes that there is something "broken" in the psychological make-up of a child that needs to be "repaired". We will state it again for the record -- virtually EVERY healthcare professional is against this type of "therapy". The AMA and the APA have come out against it. It has no foundation among reputable psychologists and psychiatrists. It was the invention of radical religious anti-gay zealots who want to brainwash young people into rejecting their basic sexual orientation. PERIOD. END OF DISCUSSION.
  • Martyr4... Mdougla... 2013/08/06 01:48:37
    Martyr4Christ
    +1
    "natural, God-given homosexual orientation".......I am a true, KJV Bible-believing born-again Christian and I worship the omnipotent, omnipresent God (the same as Abraham, Isaac and Jacob).I can assure you--God has NEVER "given" anyone homosexual orientation. And it is 100% unnatural.
    If it was natural, gays would be able to produce offspring homo sexually...common sense makes it clear this is impossible. Therefore, without biological reproduction between 2 men, for example, there is no mechanism which exists to pass "homosexual orientation" on naturally as an innate trait. There is simply NO organic cause, connection or representation of homosexuality in nature.

    This is 100% true whether you choose to face it or not.

    My brother-in-law is a board-certified medical director (M.D.), in 2006 he earned the Gold Medal Award for Excellence in Biological Psychiatry. In the 12 years I've known him, he has been an excellent resource providing a wealth of information. The general consensus among doctors is that GLBT behavior is indeed a DISORDER, the main causes of Same-Sex Attachment Disorder all stem from childhood trauma--sexual abuse being the most significant cause. The gay activists harassed and bullied and basically exhausted the medical association until they relented to the manipulative harassment of the gay community to remove the classification of the disorder..underhanded indeed

    fgh
  • Mdougla... Martyr4... 2013/09/13 20:14:14 (edited)
    Mdouglas231
    You can "assure me" that God didn't give anyone homosexual orientation? How can you possibly do that? Do you have a "pipe-line" to God? Maybe you can reach Him on your cellphone? It's that type of hyperbole that turns off so many people to you religious zealots. Hey, I was raised in the Episcopal Church, and I never heard anything from the pulpit that condemned homosexuals. Only you "born-again" type religious holy-rollers claim to have an infallible knowledge of God's intent. And statements like "it is 100% true" might be meant to silence your critics, but they do not impress me, because they claim an "authority" that has never been established. In fact, I simply know it is NOT "100% true". There may be some true "bisexuals" who have been "induced" into a homosexual lifestyle, but to claim as you do to know the facts of literally MILLIONS of people's sexual orientation is patently absurd. Only a deluded person with a "God" complex would even say it.

    As for this brother you claim, who happens to be a doctor, well if he's from the same intolerant religious background as you, I'm not a bit surprised by his views. But so what? He doesn't speak for the AMA, the American Psychological Assn, or the American Pediatric Assn. In fact, it sounds like he's goin...

    You can "assure me" that God didn't give anyone homosexual orientation? How can you possibly do that? Do you have a "pipe-line" to God? Maybe you can reach Him on your cellphone? It's that type of hyperbole that turns off so many people to you religious zealots. Hey, I was raised in the Episcopal Church, and I never heard anything from the pulpit that condemned homosexuals. Only you "born-again" type religious holy-rollers claim to have an infallible knowledge of God's intent. And statements like "it is 100% true" might be meant to silence your critics, but they do not impress me, because they claim an "authority" that has never been established. In fact, I simply know it is NOT "100% true". There may be some true "bisexuals" who have been "induced" into a homosexual lifestyle, but to claim as you do to know the facts of literally MILLIONS of people's sexual orientation is patently absurd. Only a deluded person with a "God" complex would even say it.

    As for this brother you claim, who happens to be a doctor, well if he's from the same intolerant religious background as you, I'm not a bit surprised by his views. But so what? He doesn't speak for the AMA, the American Psychological Assn, or the American Pediatric Assn. In fact, it sounds like he's going against the vast and well-considered judgement of his peers. Again, you show your incredible arrogance and conceit by pretending that somehow a band of "gay activists" brow-beat literally thousands of doctors and scientists into "accepting" something that they don't really believe. Face the facts -- knowledge and reason have moved well past the "Middle Ages" ignorance of people like you and your brother.

    And just what, may I ask, separates you from the religious fanatics of Islam? They, too, claim a special knowledge of God's (Allah's) will, and the willingness to enforce that supposed "will" here on earth. Oh, and BTW, they also specialize in persecuting homosexuals. Sorry, but I see little difference between you and the mad Imams who rule Iran.
    (more)
  • Martyr4... Mdougla... 2013/09/14 16:41:35
    Martyr4Christ
    Actually, my brother-in-law believes in God(he said as a doctor he has seen miracles that cannot possibly be explained by science, but he is taught to suppress this), but says the medical community is notorious for conforming their views to the requirement of government and state, because state has the power to suspend their license WITHOUT cause if they aren't promoting a strictly scientific (evolution) point of view. So he is persecuted for his belief and bullied into hiding it. Not very "democratic", wouldn't you say?

    You accuse me of being a "religious zealot" and your prejudice is in error. You are quick to assume that all Christians despise homosexuals. You are wrong. I do not hate or look down on anyone, nor do I have some holier-than-thou "God complex". Those characteristics are manifested in most atheists I have encountered. I am merely a humble servant of Jesus Christ. I do NOT harbor malevolence or hostility toward anyone, or any group of people. The violent, destructive, evil Westboro Baptist criminals are NOT true Christians (neither are the wolves in sheep's clothing in the Roman Catholic Church).& directly oppose the teachings of Christ and I believe their hostility toward homosexuals is inhumane & unacceptable. ,

    I oppose homosexual behavior, but not the homosexu...





    Actually, my brother-in-law believes in God(he said as a doctor he has seen miracles that cannot possibly be explained by science, but he is taught to suppress this), but says the medical community is notorious for conforming their views to the requirement of government and state, because state has the power to suspend their license WITHOUT cause if they aren't promoting a strictly scientific (evolution) point of view. So he is persecuted for his belief and bullied into hiding it. Not very "democratic", wouldn't you say?

    You accuse me of being a "religious zealot" and your prejudice is in error. You are quick to assume that all Christians despise homosexuals. You are wrong. I do not hate or look down on anyone, nor do I have some holier-than-thou "God complex". Those characteristics are manifested in most atheists I have encountered. I am merely a humble servant of Jesus Christ. I do NOT harbor malevolence or hostility toward anyone, or any group of people. The violent, destructive, evil Westboro Baptist criminals are NOT true Christians (neither are the wolves in sheep's clothing in the Roman Catholic Church).& directly oppose the teachings of Christ and I believe their hostility toward homosexuals is inhumane & unacceptable. ,

    I oppose homosexual behavior, but not the homosexual. There is a huge difference.

    When people despise me and persecute me, I pray they find peace and understanding. Comfort instead of chaos.

    Keep in mind, not everyone who claims to be Christian follows Christ. And those who do have no anger or hatred in their heart.

    fghh
    (more)
  • Mdougla... Martyr4... 2013/09/25 19:32:47
    Mdouglas231
    Your brother is a quack, and you are a fanatic. End of discussion.
  • Martyr4... Mdougla... 2013/09/25 19:38:50
    Martyr4Christ
    +1
    Ad hominem attack=logical fallacy. FAIL. Try refuting the argument with reason and rational composure. If you can, that is.
  • Mdougla... Martyr4... 2013/12/29 19:50:39
    Mdouglas231
    I've posted TWO lengthy discussions on the subject already, but have come to the conclusion that there's no use trying to change a closed mind, such as yours. So as I said before -- end of discussion.
  • hajkorten 2013/03/05 00:05:20 (edited)
  • larry.d... hajkorten 2013/06/24 16:15:36
  • Martyr4... larry.d... 2013/09/14 16:47:49
    Martyr4Christ
    The only thing your statement proves is that you are filled with animosity and it manifests in your hate speech.

    rude
  • Mdougla... hajkorten 2013/08/02 22:18:36
    Mdouglas231
    "Clinical science" by whom? Christian-supported "clinical science"? ACTUAL SCIENCE by numerous university medical centers and institutes, and backed by the APA and AMA, conclude just the opposite of your statement -- that true sexual orientation cannot be "changed" like someone changes a light bulb. It is with you for life. There certainly are cases of homosexuals (usually thru church and/or family pressure) who have "forsaken" the homosexual lifestyle and profess to now be good little "heteros", but it is not scientific, or even truthful. And the fact that homosexuals often enter into marriage, have children, lead so-called "normal" lives is hardly new... they've been doing that for many centuries, since the Catholic Church started outlawing and condemning homosexuality in the waning days of the Roman Empire, and the days of the Holy Roman Empire. Then it got worse during the days of the Inquisition. If your option was to try and lead a "normal" lifestyle, or to be ostracized (or worse -- tortured and killed) -- which option do you suppose most homosexuals would take? You also mention "reparative process" and the very name connotes a believe that something within the homosexual person is "broken" and needs "repairing". But what's really broken is the nar...
    "Clinical science" by whom? Christian-supported "clinical science"? ACTUAL SCIENCE by numerous university medical centers and institutes, and backed by the APA and AMA, conclude just the opposite of your statement -- that true sexual orientation cannot be "changed" like someone changes a light bulb. It is with you for life. There certainly are cases of homosexuals (usually thru church and/or family pressure) who have "forsaken" the homosexual lifestyle and profess to now be good little "heteros", but it is not scientific, or even truthful. And the fact that homosexuals often enter into marriage, have children, lead so-called "normal" lives is hardly new... they've been doing that for many centuries, since the Catholic Church started outlawing and condemning homosexuality in the waning days of the Roman Empire, and the days of the Holy Roman Empire. Then it got worse during the days of the Inquisition. If your option was to try and lead a "normal" lifestyle, or to be ostracized (or worse -- tortured and killed) -- which option do you suppose most homosexuals would take? You also mention "reparative process" and the very name connotes a believe that something within the homosexual person is "broken" and needs "repairing". But what's really broken is the narrow-minds of bigots like you who "ignore like the plague" all the scientific, medical, and psychological advances over the past 50 years on the subject of homosexuality. You pretend like it never happened. You act like the world is still living in the ignorance of yesteryear.
    (more)
  • hajkorten Mdougla... 2013/08/02 22:58:40
  • Mdougla... hajkorten 2013/09/13 20:32:41
    Mdouglas231
    Aside from being absurd, just what the heck does any of your rant have to do with the issue at bar? Stick to the subject, please.
  • hajkorten Mdougla... 2013/09/13 21:37:29 (edited)
  • Mdougla... hajkorten 2013/09/25 19:31:10
    Mdouglas231
    It's just a shame that this site doesn't have a button to flag as spam.
  • hajkorten Mdougla... 2013/08/02 23:03:23
  • Mdougla... hajkorten 2013/09/25 19:31:26
    Mdouglas231
    Spam.
  • Martyr4... Mdougla... 2013/09/25 19:42:05
    Martyr4Christ
    You cannot refute it, so you get angry and throw a tantrum.
  • Mdougla... Martyr4... 2013/12/29 19:46:18
    Mdouglas231
    I DID refute it, if you'd care to actually read my comments (what you choose to call a "tantrum"). You cannot refute the facts I brought up, so you throw up a "smoke screen" to try and cover yourself. An tired, old rhetorical exercise.
  • Katsumi33 2012/12/30 04:42:59
    Yes
    Katsumi33
    +2
    Gay therapy conversion is just an outdated idea that came from a time when being gay was unacceptable. In today's society it is practically as antique and useless as the corset!
  • hajkorten Katsumi33 2013/03/05 00:20:15
  • holly g... Katsumi33 2013/04/18 17:54:07
    holly go lightly
    +1
    So if a person wants it the should not be allowed to have it .How Liberty minded of you.
  • Jaison Agy 2012/12/29 15:01:28
    Yes
    Jaison Agy
    Yes they have right to ban the gay conversation & i don't think usa has any shortage of girls that make guys turn to a gay
  • DeejaySpaniel 2012/12/26 12:48:32
    Yes
    DeejaySpaniel
    +2
    Far more dangerous and harmful than being gay ever could be.
  • hajkorten DeejayS... 2013/03/05 00:22:42
  • Mtg303 2012/12/26 07:40:34 (edited)
    Yes
    Mtg303
    +2
    Yes California has the right and obligation to ban such therapy. Any type of "conversion" therapy administered to minor children and teenagers has the potential to become abusive and dangerous to those being "converted". Given the past history of specialty schools and programs in the US investigated through the US GAO and the passed Stop Child Abuse in Residential Programs for Teens Act of 2008 (H.R. 6358), how could gay-conversion therapy possibly be a good idea?.

    http://georgemiller.house.gov...

    Why do we need such laws? Ask any survivor of a WWASP or similar program in the US or abroad about the psychological, physical and sexual abuse that happens in conversion programs and therapies. Ask them how are their family relationships now and whom do they trust. Parents considering conversion therapy for their minor child/youth should search through the message boards of survivors from these programs. Many of these people were hurt deeply. The people overseeing these programs went largely unpunished for their crimes and made millions in profits.

    http://caica.org/index.htm
  • hajkorten Mtg303 2013/03/05 00:26:44
  • Mdougla... hajkorten 2013/08/02 22:01:29
    Mdouglas231
    You are getting very "off topic". What does pedophilia have to do with the subject at issue -- namely this so-called conversion therapy? Nothing. Please stay on topic.
  • hajkorten Mtg303 2013/03/05 00:30:56
  • Mdougla... hajkorten 2013/09/13 20:36:47
    Mdouglas231
    You go on and on, with "diarrhea of the keyboard", boring the hell out of everyone -- but basically it's all "smoke and mirrors". Please stay on subject -- whether the State of California has the right to ban conversion therapy or not.
  • hajkorten Mtg303 2013/03/06 23:13:25
  • Martyr4... hajkorten 2013/04/18 13:52:09
    Martyr4Christ
    +1
    What a sad phenomenon. Interestingly, EVERY single gay/lesbian I have ever known mentions sexual abuse in their youth, but then goes on to DISMISS the idea that there may be a relation between the two. Perhaps the pain from such traumatic experiences as a youth is so intense, they fear fear facing it.
    Additionally, these sick, evil acts were likely committed by adults that these kids trusted, which explains the anger manifested by the gay community.

    If more gays would speak out about the abuse, even anonymously, it would give others that were abused the courage to as well, and PREVENT even MORE innocent children from falling victim to sexual predators.

    I hope that these victims realize that what happened to them is NOT their fault, and they did NOT deserve it. And there is nothing to be ashamed of. What they need and deserve is healing and someone(who is caring and stable) to listen and help them through the pain.
  • MrSexyPants 2012/12/23 01:24:33
    Yes
    MrSexyPants
    +3
    hell yeah they do! "gay-conversion therapy" is basically just brainwashing! i can't believe people still do that. you can't fight who you're truly attracted to. Try and cover it up, but it's always gonna be there...
  • hajkorten MrSexyP... 2013/03/05 00:11:12
  • Mdougla... hajkorten 2013/08/02 22:36:24
    Mdouglas231
    EXCUSE ME -- but just what the hell does any of this "data" have to do with the issue at bar??? NOTHING. We are discussing if California should or should not ban the so-called "conversion therapy". Stick to the topic, please.
  • Noje 2012/12/19 15:19:36
    No
    Noje
    +2
    you can have sex changes. On the other side of the coin, you should have the option for therapy. If the therapy was to make people gay, would pro gay advocates accept THAT?
  • greyjack Noje 2012/12/21 14:52:54
  • Mdougla... Noje 2012/12/22 07:10:00
    Mdouglas231
    +2
    Excuse me, but are you aware that this law applies ONLY to minor children? Minor children who don't have the legal or practical right to resist being placed in this so-called "therapy"? And that is based on the FACT that this therapy is not recognized by the medical and psychological community? That they, in fact, almost universally CONDEMN it? Are you aware of this? It does nothing to interfere with the right of adults to try this quackery. Get your facts straight next time before you post.
  • George ... Mdougla... 2013/01/20 19:20:07
    George Martinez
    +4
    Your point is well taken. But I was just making a point about the therapy in general. I suspect some people would be outraged regardless of whether it was directed at minors or not.
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